Great minds think alike. Well let's face it, all the studios are pandering to Chinese market these days. I guess we
won't see any morality tales about regimes that censor the outside world and cover up history.
Star Trek: Discovery (2017)
- Thread starter mkstewartesq
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Great minds think alike. Well let's face it, all the studios are pandering to Chinese market these days. I guess we
won't see any morality tales about regimes that censor the outside world and cover up history.
KrangPrime
Master Member
See, now if i brought that up, people woudl just say i'm being negative ;o).
but yeah, that was my first thought as well.
So far, I'm not really caring about this new show. nothing really wows me.
it's also a shame that i never really used to th ink of chinese casting as bad. but now that hollywood puts it ahead of everything else..it's suspicious.
astroboy
Master Member
I'm really happy to have her in that role. What bothers me is the whole "chinese ship" thing.
What would roddenberry think about that? He'd roll over in his grave
Angelus Lupus
Sr Member
It's like we've gone backwards! They're patting themselves on the back saying "look, we're being diverse! Aren't we progressive?"
Back in the 60's Roddenberry said "Let's have women in command roles (sadly vetoed), Japanese/Black/Alien/Russian crew" And the only pandering they did was to give Koenig a Monkees haircut to appeal to young girls
Back in the 60's Roddenberry said "Let's have women in command roles (sadly vetoed), Japanese/Black/Alien/Russian crew" And the only pandering they did was to give Koenig a Monkees haircut to appeal to young girls
Shenzhou is the name of the spacecraft based on the Russian Soyuz spacecraft the Chinese currently fly.
"NCC" actually came from combining "NC" from early North American aircraft registry and "CCCP" of the Soviet era,
as Jeffries thought these were the two space faring nations at that time and projected them forward. So Gene seemed
good with that at that time, and of course Chekov was there. So there was inclusiveness in this way of nations at odds with each other.
So it's not like it's the USS Mao Zedong or anything.
China is the third nation now to fly astronauts. or Taikonauts.
I think it's not out of bounds to use that name but going with a Chinese Captain on top of that, it's very hard to not see studio pandering to that market.
Granted a HUGE portion of the human race is Chinese.
Now make her a descendent of "Tank Man" at Tianamen square and we are talking, but yeah, that won't happen. LOL
"NCC" actually came from combining "NC" from early North American aircraft registry and "CCCP" of the Soviet era,
as Jeffries thought these were the two space faring nations at that time and projected them forward. So Gene seemed
good with that at that time, and of course Chekov was there. So there was inclusiveness in this way of nations at odds with each other.
So it's not like it's the USS Mao Zedong or anything.
China is the third nation now to fly astronauts. or Taikonauts.
I think it's not out of bounds to use that name but going with a Chinese Captain on top of that, it's very hard to not see studio pandering to that market.
Granted a HUGE portion of the human race is Chinese.
Now make her a descendent of "Tank Man" at Tianamen square and we are talking, but yeah, that won't happen. LOL
Ok... colour me confused.... why all the griping about the ship's name being of Chinese origin? How is it different than the U.S.S. Potemkin in TOS or the Yamato in TNG?
As far as I understand, the Shenzhou follows Trek tradition of naming starships after modern day ships and satellites; i.e. Magellon, Challenger, etc.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shenzhou_(spacecraft)
Lightning
Master Member
Captains don't get to name their own ships. In-universe its an odd coincidence they have the same national origin, but since this is fiction, in the real world they made a deliberate choice to do something that's unlikely in-universe.
If you just look at that fact by itself: there's nothing wrong with it. At all. It's not even the first Trek ship to have a Chinese name. DS9 had the Yangtze Kiang.
It's also not odd to have a Chinese character.
It's not even THAT much of a coincidence to have both on the same ship. Bound to happen eventually.
But adding up all of that AND what we know of what's going on in real life, it pretty obviously pandering. That takes us out of the world a little and reminds us that behind the magic is a bunch of guys in suits trying to squeeze money out of it.
For me, I've become so jaded that it doesn't even bother me anymore. I expect pandering. Especially from reboots. I already know this is only a labor of love in the sense that the executives love money. This isn't even the worst example FROM THIS SHOW of blatant pandering.
SO I expect it, and ultimately I just hope we can have pandering AND good stories. I could probably ignore the entire crew openly drinking coke products and having Nike labels on their uniforms if the stories are good enough.
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cboath
Master Member
Will this even be available to china? It's their package open to all nations? Including china? The powers that be keep claiming that all this region BS is required, so, if it is, you'd think they'd not have made arrangements for china at this point. Not to mention, it has to actually be approved by the censors to air there.
But, like most, I saw it as a sign of pandering. Want to do it without being blatant? Make her ship something else and have another ship they run into from time to time with the chinese name.
But, like most, I saw it as a sign of pandering. Want to do it without being blatant? Make her ship something else and have another ship they run into from time to time with the chinese name.
We'll have to see how it all plays out in the end. They've already cast an actress who I'll watch in anything and the ship itself might actually look awesome. That stuff I'm cool with. And believe it or not, Star Trek can actually take this pandering concept to the next level. Imagine if you will that this ship and Michelle Yeoh's character and crew are actually aliens from another planet. A planet who's only culture is essentially modern day China and everyone onboard the Discovery can't help but be awe struck regarding how talented and gifted these aliens are. That would be the worst case scenario. Sound too far-fetched? Well, Star Trek actually did something like this during TOS era. But instead of pandering to China, it pandered to the US. I give you "The Omega Glory".
In short, the Enterprise encounters a group of aliens called the Yang (Who fight the Kohm. Yankees/Communists. Very subtle) who have not only developed the english language, but also the Constitution of the United States complete with an American flag. Now I know what you're thinking. There must have been some outside influence or some strange phenomenon that caused this alien culture to mimic ours. Nope. Not only does this episode establish that this planet has had no influence from Earth, but the Yangs actually developed all of these American specific elements CENTURIES BEFORE EARTH DID! Yes. Gene Roddenberry wrote an episode with a message saying that America is so freaking awesome that every iconic detail about it is universally instinctive from species to species across the univese. Now THAT is what I call pandering taken to ridiculous lengths. What makes this even more goofy is that not only did Gene Roddenberry write this episode as a draft for a second pilot to the series, he submitted the script for Emmy consideration.
Unless you're "The Sisko".
In short, the Enterprise encounters a group of aliens called the Yang (Who fight the Kohm. Yankees/Communists. Very subtle) who have not only developed the english language, but also the Constitution of the United States complete with an American flag. Now I know what you're thinking. There must have been some outside influence or some strange phenomenon that caused this alien culture to mimic ours. Nope. Not only does this episode establish that this planet has had no influence from Earth, but the Yangs actually developed all of these American specific elements CENTURIES BEFORE EARTH DID! Yes. Gene Roddenberry wrote an episode with a message saying that America is so freaking awesome that every iconic detail about it is universally instinctive from species to species across the univese. Now THAT is what I call pandering taken to ridiculous lengths. What makes this even more goofy is that not only did Gene Roddenberry write this episode as a draft for a second pilot to the series, he submitted the script for Emmy consideration.
Unless you're "The Sisko".
Sisko: Special dispensation from the Chief of Starfleet Operations to change the name from Sao Paulo to Defiant.
0neiros
Master Member
When did IQs here drop? So where was all the complaining that the Firefly Verse had them speaking a mash of English and Chinese and had a mash of both cultures, but HOW DARE they have an Asian captain and a ship with an Asian name? I Mean gee, they only make up the majority of people on the planet, so what would be the odds? Why it'd be like some white guy commanding a ship with a eurocentric name. Some of you have hit a new low for nitpicking. How about they have the USS Dixie NCC - 1861 Captain Robert E Lee commanding. That make you feel better? Can't wait for the first actual trailer to hit so we can have 30 pages of how bad it's going to suck.
I LIKE a Chinese captain. I LIKE a Chinese-named ship.
But it shows hamfistedness that the producers would put the two together.
It's like if the TOS bridge crew all got ships, and thus Scotty commanded the Aberdeen, Sulu commanded the Yamato, Chekov commanded the Kiev..... see what I mean?
But it shows hamfistedness that the producers would put the two together.
It's like if the TOS bridge crew all got ships, and thus Scotty commanded the Aberdeen, Sulu commanded the Yamato, Chekov commanded the Kiev..... see what I mean?
How many Asian actors appeared in Firefly?
astroboy
Master Member
Firefly was a human distopia. It was a completely different 'verse.
When I first heard of this ship, it was described as a Chinese ship. And Michelle yeoh was the captain.
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KrangPrime
Master Member
Yep. I LIKE the idea. Anyone who doesn't does not belong in this century.
BUT, knowing how hollywood is chasing the all ighty ollar? And how they are focusing on the chinese dollar in particular? and how so many movies lately have suddenly featured chinese actors and funding companies helping poor broke hollywood fund their billion dollar earning franchises?
Yeah. I'm going with the cynics on this one... it's pandering pure and simple.
I think they know that asking people to pay to watch is risky in America, they are thinking about other potential revenue streams.
They can say it's because of Trekian diversity but us jaded SOBs will see it differently. Why not just admit it?
Not like poor performing movies are not bailed out by Chinese market all the time.
It's not a big deal anyways for diversity sake, we all know this is true!....
They can say it's because of Trekian diversity but us jaded SOBs will see it differently. Why not just admit it?
Not like poor performing movies are not bailed out by Chinese market all the time.
It's not a big deal anyways for diversity sake, we all know this is true!....
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0neiros
Master Member
https://www.quora.com/Why-are-there-no-Chinese-people-featured-in-Firefly
Hey the Villains in Discovery could still be North Korean/Klingon Hybrids. Kang Jon Un.
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Not quite. During the concept art phase, once Jeffries was getting in a direction he liked, he wanted to deco the ship designs with registry numbers for a bit of verisimilitude. As a civilian pilot, he knew the Civial Aviation code for the United States at the time was NC. He might have been peripherally aware that the Soviet Union's CA code at the time was CC, but it wasn't a conscious thing on his part. He took America's NC and just doubled the second letter arbitrarily to give it a slight remove from reality. For the numbers, he eliminated any that would be unclear on 1963 television sets and, out of what was left, (in his words) "1701 was as good as anything". So he put it on his later concept paintings, Gene liked it, and that was that.
He didn't start thinking about what the prefix and number might mean until after that. And he didn't have someone point out the Soviet CA code connection until after the series had been cancelled and was in reruns. He liked the symbolism, however inadvertent at the time, of the big 20th century adversaries coming together in peaceful exploration in the 23rd.
JSYK
--Jonah
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