RotJ Force Pike Accurate Build/Research

halliwax said:
This thread is amazing! I love the team work effort.

Tom the print looks amazing! Very clever with the aluminum tape!

My mind is boggling though, does anyone know what that hob gear is actually for?! Is it some kind of grain grinding gear? It doesn’t look like it would mechanically fit into another gear?

It sure is a weird gear setup!


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Click to expand...

Thanks! It's a tool for cutting teeth on the flat gear to mesh with a worm gear (a setup to turn rotational motion 90 degrees). The tool is put into a lathe to cut the gear teeth something like this:

maxresdefault-1.jpg

The rest of the redesign modelling is done but I've run into some scaling problems using the new reference, I have reason to believe it's bigger than I originally thought but I'm struggling to make the new scale fit with the overall length...
 
I would have never thought of that! First time I’ve ever seen anything like it, lol I thought it was something for mashing grain/wheat lol

Great model tom, depending on my expensive I’m gonna try my hardest to jump on your run


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Inquisitor Peregrinus said:
Attempts to PM failed to attach properly, so posting the remaining pics I dug up here:
Click to expand...

Those are great, thanks!

halliwax said:
I would have never thought of that! First time I’ve ever seen anything like it, lol I thought it was something for mashing grain/wheat lol

Great model tom, depending on my expensive I’m gonna try my hardest to jump on your run
Click to expand...

Yeah it's a very cool piece :) The initial quote for the run was positive so I think I can do them relatively cheap if we can get enough people to actually do it :D

This is likely the final design and render I'll do of this unless I or someone who wants to help physically gets hold of the prop, so here we go in all it's newly redesigned glory:

forcepike13render.png

Some of the more eagle eyed might notice some tiny changes I'll be making before this actually goes off to the machine shop but the final version should look pretty much exactly like this :)
 
Read the run post and have thoughts/questions...

Is it going to be multipart? Or a single milled piece, minus pommel I'd much prefer multipart. Tip and spiky bit, shaft in two pieces threaded just at the chrome collar above the grips, pommel in as many as four pieces (probably 3D printed), grip pieces in 3D printed plastic designed to slip into place... Like that. Give more interior access, leaves more assembly options to the end-user, etc.

Have you considered mentioning this over at the Royal Guard Detachment board for the 501st -- even just e-mailing staff to ask of it'd be okay? Would almost certainly generate some interest.

Tentatively interested, pending responses.
 
Inquisitor Peregrinus said:
Read the run post and have thoughts/questions...

Is it going to be multipart? Or a single milled piece, minus pommel I'd much prefer multipart. Tip and spiky bit, shaft in two pieces threaded just at the chrome collar above the grips, pommel in as many as four pieces (probably 3D printed), grip pieces in 3D printed plastic designed to slip into place... Like that. Give more interior access, leaves more assembly options to the end-user, etc.

Have you considered mentioning this over at the Royal Guard Detachment board for the 501st -- even just e-mailing staff to ask of it'd be okay? Would almost certainly generate some interest.

Tentatively interested, pending responses.
Click to expand...

It'll be in three main pieces, the gear hob tip will be one piece, the tapered shaft will be one piece, joining the grip section at that collar, and then the grip section. The large pommel piece will screw off the grip section and obviously the acrylic piece will be seperate, otherwise it's one hollow piece :) It will all be CNC machined (mostly aluminium, anodized where it should be black, steel for the gear hob and acrylic for the clear pommel cap)
Having the grip section split into the various parts was considered for ease of finishing, along with machining the black parts from delrin but ultimately I felt it would add too much complication/cost and therefore be less likely to actually get made :)

What alternative assembly/interior access options would you have wanted?

I absolutely intend to share the run over on forcepike.net once I've figured out the rules for stuff like this over there but thanks for the reminder :)
 
tomleech said:
It'll be in three main pieces, the gear hob tip will be one piece, the tapered shaft will be one piece, joining the grip section at that collar, and then the grip section. The large pommel piece will screw off the grip section and obviously the acrylic piece will be seperate, otherwise it's one hollow piece :) It will all be CNC machined (mostly aluminium, anodized where it should be black, steel for the gear hob and acrylic for the clear pommel cap)
Having the grip section split into the various parts was considered for ease of finishing, along with machining the black parts from delrin but ultimately I felt it would add too much complication/cost and therefore be less likely to actually get made :)

What alternative assembly/interior access options would you have wanted?

I absolutely intend to share the run over on forcepike.net once I've figured out the rules for stuff like this over there but thanks for the reminder :)
Click to expand...

This sounds amazing!!


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Hmm... I'd personally skip the anodizing It's an expensive process and wouldn't look right, anyway. Here is my anodized bull barrel for my blaster:

04b1 - Bull barrel after anodizing.JPG

It still has a metallic sheen. I'd probably go with my trusty satin black for the pommel, and Plasti-Dip or rubber bumper paint for the grips. My pike's grips were coated a decade ago and have held up just fine.

Leaving the color treatment to the end-user would save time and cost on the production end.

Apart from that I like what you describe. One of the things I love about having made my pike shaft from a floor lamp is it unscrews like a pool cue. Makes travel much easier. As for what I might do with more interior access...? Ehh... I have notions involving batteries, potentiometers, and cattle prods... :angel
 
Inquisitor Peregrinus said:
Hmm... I'd personally skip the anodizing It's an expensive process and wouldn't look right, anyway. Here is my anodized bull barrel for my blaster:

View attachment 842351

It still has a metallic sheen. I'd probably go with my trusty satin black for the pommel, and Plasti-Dip or rubber bumper paint for the grips. My pike's grips were coated a decade ago and have held up just fine.

Leaving the color treatment to the end-user would save time and cost on the production end.

Apart from that I like what you describe. One of the things I love about having made my pike shaft from a floor lamp is it unscrews like a pool cue. Makes travel much easier. As for what I might do with more interior access...? Ehh... I have notions involving batteries, potentiometers, and cattle prods... :angel
Click to expand...

Anodising is not an expensive or time consuming process and will indeed match the specularity of the original prop finish based on the reference I have :) I intend to provide a product that will ship 'finished' for those who want a dimensionally accurate prop made from more 'real world' materials or don't want to have to do additional work to display on their shelf. Here's the thing tho there's nothing preventing anybody from changing it if they so desire :D There's no reason you can't add prop-accurate rough sanding marks or applying accurate chrome tape over the silver sections or your favourite satin black or plasti-dip paint over the anodising, either over the top of the black anodise or spray some oven cleaner on to strip the anodise and then prime in white and finish with whatever black you choose if you want to add the authentic paint chips ;)

Yeah, if I could have the long silver section screw apart without a visible seam I would have, this way it still disassembles into pieces that would fit into a pool cue case.

You'd want some large capacitors for that ;) If it helps I can tell you that the internal space in the grip is rougly 22.22mm or 7/8" in diameter by over 200mm or 8" and a further section 19mm or 0.75" in diameter by over 60mm or 2.5". The grip section is pretty much as hollow as it can be without compromising strength, I don't expect people will full strength sword fight with these but I'd like them to stand up to the rigours of costumed trooping etc.
 
tomleech said:
An interesting piece of extra info I got from the hi-res prints; most of the grip was bored out to accomodate "EMA TUBE (FOR BATTERIES+LIGHT)" which leads me to believe that the clear/frosted pommel end seen in the reference pics was originally intended to light up, although I'm pretty sure this wasn't seen on screen.
Click to expand...

Your picture of the blueprint had me dig up my blueprints book.
In the book it says: "Guarding the Throne Room, and seen flanking the Imperial shuttle, are the Emperor's Red Guards. Their staves had lights fixed on their tops with holes drilled through the centers to fit tubes for batteries. The six staffs made for the film were built from fiberglass and fishing rods, with existing metal pieces from the prop department."
 
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Which is odd, as the lights didn't seem to get used. For instance, the one action scene:

tumblr_nl167ms0hY1tiwa1fo3_540.gif

(Never mind the persistently unanswered question of what the hell is up with that one really short Royal Guard...)

Also, the lore I've run across is that they used the same deep-sea fishing poles as were used for the rods lining the walls of the Death Star II's reactor chamber miniature. Dunno how accurate that might be, as the props and costumes were largely done in the UK, and the models and miniatures were done at ILM.
 
Aaahhh so it’s more of a fishing spear then rod

When everyone was talking about fishing rods I keep thinking of a flimsy pole

Like the lightning hook on the back of the delorean, which was a fishing pole

Now a deep sea fishing spear. I totally see it


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Inquisitor Peregrinus said:
Which is odd, as the lights didn't seem to get used. For instance, the one action scene:
Click to expand...

With "top" they mean the other side. In the blueprints the pommel is the top.

From that scene I always thought that the pikes were meant to shoot something.
That way it could make sense that there are lights in the pommel facing the end of the pike (like a lightsaber), but if the batteries were in the tube they must be facing the other direction.
 
halliwax said:
Aaahhh so it’s more of a fishing spear then rod

When everyone was talking about fishing rods I keep thinking of a flimsy pole
Click to expand...

Not a spear. Deep sea fishing poles are thicker and sturdier than lake and fly fishing sorts of gear. Look at a marlin or a swordfish. One needs something that can handle that. Most deep sea poles are segmented or telescoping. The pike could have been made from the handle end, with the open end where the rest of the pole was supposed to be fitted being where the hob gear cutter went. Something like this vintage bamboo piece -- only newer (and, hopefully obviously, not identical):

Vintage-Bamboo-Granger-Deep-sea-Fishing-Rod-w-vintage-_57.jpg

RafkeP said:
With "top" they mean the other side. In the blueprints the pommel is the top.

From that scene I always thought that the pikes were meant to shoot something.
That way it could make sense that there are lights in the pommel facing the end of the pike (like a lightsaber), but if the batteries were in the tube they must be facing the other direction.
Click to expand...

The pike is basically a short-range cattle prod. Able to deliver anything from a mild attention-getting jolt to a lethal charge. Plus the spiky part can be used to swat things.

If the pommel is clear I can only assume they originally meant it to light up, either constant-on, or on when the Guards are actively using them, as in that scene above. But, again, nothing in the filmed material...
 
Inquisitor Peregrinus said:
Not a spear. Deep sea fishing poles are thicker and sturdier than lake and fly fishing sorts of gear. Look at a marlin or a swordfish. One needs something that can handle that. Most deep sea poles are segmented or telescoping. The pike could have been made from the handle end, with the open end where the rest of the pole was supposed to be fitted being where the hob gear cutter went. Something like this vintage bamboo piece -- only newer (and, hopefully obviously, not identical):

View attachment 843200



The pike is basically a short-range cattle prod. Able to deliver anything from a mild attention-getting jolt to a lethal charge. Plus the spiky part can be used to swat things.

If the pommel is clear I can only assume they originally meant it to light up, either constant-on, or on when the Guards are actively using them, as in that scene above. But, again, nothing in the filmed material...
Click to expand...

Ohhhhh I get ya now!


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