Kathleen Kennedy to step down from Lucasfilm (after 2021)?

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Re: Kathleen Kennedy to step down from Lucasfilm?

Luke abandoned all of his principles given everything we learned about him in TLJ so yes he is a nihilist.

All because he contemplated murdering his nephew in his sleep. So the most optimistic character in the series learned nothing in Empire or Jedi, going so far as to redeem his father in that film and since Ben turning was his fault he decides the best thing to do is to let everyone else clean up his mess?

The galaxy is in turmoil and he ends up showing up in the end anyway so what difference did his exile even make?

You see what I mean by this whole thing being a waste of time?

I know you will come up with some other excuse for this movie and that's fine but it doesn't make any logical sense.
 
Re: Kathleen Kennedy to step down from Lucasfilm?

@Robinson

Thanks 3PO. lol

I know I should just shut up already. I'm sick of talking about this stupid movie. I wander into the entertainment section from time to time. I guess sometimes I just can't help myself.

I disagree strongly with those who love TLJ. I absolutely hate it. But if people love it that's fine too. I don't understand and I don't think I ever will but to each their own.
 
Re: Kathleen Kennedy to step down from Lucasfilm?

Psab keel said:
Luke abandoned all of his principles given everything we learned about him in TLJ so yes he is a nihilist.

All because he contemplated murdering his nephew in his sleep. So the most optimistic character in the series learned nothing in Empire or Jedi, going so far as to redeem his father in that film and since Ben turning was his fault he decides the best thing to do is to let everyone else clean up his mess?

The galaxy is in turmoil and he ends up showing up in the end anyway so what difference did his exile even make?

You see what I mean by this whole thing being a waste of time?

I know you will come up with some other excuse for this movie and that's fine but it doesn't make any logical sense.
Click to expand...

What principles? Rushing off to "help" his friends at the expense of his soul? I'm sorry but Luke in the OT is defined by disbelief, pessimism, fear, recklessness, and hate. It's only briefly in ROTJ do we see a very optimistic person.

Yes the galaxy is in turmoil, and he does show up in the end, but he's learned from his all of his failures, his failures as a student and his failures as a teacher. It's important to realize that the film never says what Luke is doing on that island is the right thing. We are meant to understand him, but not to agree with him. Anyone who's seen the prequels knows what he's talking about. So the Jedi will return, but they won't be the same Jedi we once knew.
 
Re: Kathleen Kennedy to step down from Lucasfilm?

Joek3rr said:
What principles? Rushing off to "help" his friends at the expense of his soul? I'm sorry but Luke in the OT is defined by disbelief, pessimism, fear, recklessness, and hate. It's only briefly in ROTJ do we see a very optimistic person.

Yes the galaxy is in turmoil, and he does show up in the end, but he's learned from his all of his failures, his failures as a student and his failures as a teacher. It's important to realize that the film never says what Luke is doing on that island is the right thing. We are meant to understand him, but not to agree with him. Anyone who's seen the prequels knows what he's talking about. So the Jedi will return, but they won't be the same Jedi we once knew.
Click to expand...

The Jedi that came forth with the teachings of the ancient Jedi texts, will just be a new generation of Jedi, with the same teachings from the same texts. It would've been one thing if the books had still been in the temple when Yoda destroyed it, but they were safety stored on the Millennium Falcon at that point, which made that moment even more useless. Luke hesitated to sacrifice the texts (that weren't there) and Yoda straight up deceives him by destroying the temple when Luke hesitates. Yoda had to know that Rey had them.

The entire ST has a running theme, failure doesn't matter, we win anyway.
 
Re: Kathleen Kennedy to step down from Lucasfilm?

Kovnyn said:
The Jedi that came forth with the teachings of the ancient Jedi texts, will just be a new generation of Jedi, with the same teachings from the same texts. It would've been one thing if the books had still been in the temple when Yoda destroyed it, but they were safety stored on the Millennium Falcon at that point, which made that moment even more useless. Luke hesitated to sacrifice the texts (that weren't there) and Yoda straight up deceives him by destroying the temple when Luke hesitates. Yoda had to know that Rey had them.

The entire ST has a running theme, failure doesn't matter, we win anyway.
Click to expand...

I see some changes coming. The biggest reason the Jedi fail is they are monastic religious order, that teaches celibacy, and that their followers need to suppress their emotions. So when someone does let their emotions go they don't what to do, and they fly off the handle.
 
Re: Kathleen Kennedy to step down from Lucasfilm?

Apathy and pessimism. The cornerstones of Star Wars. But these films are fun right? :rolleyes
 
Re: Kathleen Kennedy to step down from Lucasfilm?

Nothing important. Star Wars probably. I really need to stop posting in entertainment. Sorry for stirring the pot. This thread needs to die. Lol
 
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Re: Kathleen Kennedy to step down from Lucasfilm?

Joek3rr said:
Nihilism- the rejection of all religious and moral principles, often in the belief that life is meaningless

Luke exiled himself to bring an end to the Jedi, what he believed was a failed husk of a religion. Why did he do this?

For a thousand of generations there had been war after war between the Jedi and Sith. This finally came to an end over Endor. The Sith were finally defeated. But the Dark Side wasn't, and unsurprisingly it rose again, and from ranks of the Jedi......again. And once again the galaxy had war. And so Luke decided, and not easily, that the best hope for the galaxy was for him and the Jedi to end. He pushes his x-wing into the sea, and cuts himself from the Force, to prevent himself from returning or being found.

But when Rey shows up and hears of Han's death, he begins to question his decisions. Then R2 gives him a guilt trip, and he decides to show Rey why the Jedi need to end, and hopes that she will understand and return. And in the process, he eventually reconnects with the Force, and feeling his sisters pain. He decides that he does need to return, but he finds Rey Force connecting with Kylo, which simply reinforces his previous decision to stay on that island.

For Luke to be nihilistic he would have to be someone who believes that life has no value, that nothing is real, everything is meaningless. Doctor Strange would be considered a nihilistic person "We are made of matter and nothing more. You're just another tiny, momentary speck in an indifferent universe." If Luke was simply hiding on that island out his own selfish reason, perhaps he could be considered nihilistic. But he's not, he is doing what he considers the most selfless thing possible, to doing the one thing he couldn't do in ESB......that is not getting involved. For if he were to return, would it help? Or would it perpetuate the problem?
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No, no, no. For over a thousand generations, the Jedi knights were guardians of peace and justice in the old republic. They were not continuously at war with the Sith.
The Jedi were not at the height of their power when Sidious revealed himself as Luke(Rian) claims in TLJ. They had lost their way and had already fallen from grace.
You and Rian can’t go changing Star Wars history to suit your misconceptions of something that has existed longer than you have.
As for hearing of Han’s death, Luke was basically shown not really giving a F. Just like he didn’t give a F about Leia or Ben or Rey or the fight.

So if Luke thinks he’s doing the right thing, what exactly changed his mind? Meeting Rey? Han’s death? Yoda? Or just sick of green milk?
 
Re: Kathleen Kennedy to step down from Lucasfilm?

Greenie said:
No, no, no. For over a thousand generations, the Jedi knights were guardians of peace and justice in the old republic. They were not continuously at war with the Sith.
The Jedi were not at the height of their power when Sidious revealed himself as Luke(Rian) claims in TLJ. They had lost their way and had already fallen from grace.
You and Rian can’t go changing Star Wars history to suit your misconceptions of something that has existed longer than you have.
As for hearing of Han’s death, Luke was basically shown not really giving a F. Just like he didn’t give a F about Leia or Ben or Rey or the fight.

So if Luke thinks he’s doing the right thing, what exactly changed his mind? Meeting Rey? Han’s death? Yoda? Or just sick of green milk?
Click to expand...

Not changing Star Wars history. While canon is newer and shorter, so one has to call upon Legends to fill in some gaps. Legends straight up shows all the different wars between the Sith and the Jedi, or fallen Jedi. I'd hazard a guess that somewhere around 80% of villians that end up fighting the Jedi, come from the ranks of the Jedi. Just play KoToR 1and 2 and SWTOR and you'Lloyd see what I'm talking about. And while this is Legends, there hasn't been much to contradict this. Literally the longest period of peace in Legends, is after Bane establishes the rule of two, one thousand years before TPM.

This is why I love Luke in TLJ, we know that ultimately the Jedi are the best hope for the galaxy. And so we the audience, like Rey, are pleading for Luke to see this. But at the same time, we can also see that he's got a point. So what changed his mind? Han's death, meeting Rey, his sister in peril, and Yoda, all of those work to bring Luke back from despair.

It's also worth pointing out that this is the only logical way to keep Luke on that island. The notion that Luke would abandon his friends for something like 3 years, just to sit cross-legged like some bhuddist monk, is unfathomable. But if he truly feels that he's doing more good by staying out of the fight, and that he would cause more harm then good if he came back. This is the only way he would seemingly abandon his friends for several years.
 
Re: Kathleen Kennedy to step down from Lucasfilm?

Psab keel said:
I only go with the movies. Expanded universe can be fun but if it ain't in the movie then it doesn't matter.
Click to expand...

And so do I generally. But if the film refers or hints at something or someone outside of the films...... then you have start looking.

What I'm about to tell is Legends, but may return to canon. The film shows us a pendant in Luke's hut. A pendant with a Sith kyber crystal. In the visual guide, it's said that's it's a Jedi Crusader pendant. In Legends when the Mandalorians attacked the Republic, the Jedi refused to help, with the council citing that they felt some dark influence behind the attack. But some Jedi decided to join the war effort, and became Crusaders. And with the Crusaders help, the war was one. People began loosing faith in the Jedi. Then things became worse, the Crusaders disappeared into the unknown regions to chase down the remaining hostiles. When they returned, they called themselves Dark Lords of the Sith. If Luke knows this history, it could have influenced his thoughts on the matter.
 
Re: Kathleen Kennedy to step down from Lucasfilm?

Mr Webber said:
If only this was the spirit that motivated those behind TLJ and not selfish ambition.....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wrRFXMI4N1s
Click to expand...

While it's nice to finally see some of the visual fixes that were sloppily thought in the actual cut, I will not be watching this "fixed" edition and it's a wasted effort. I take what is officially released (in terms of the events and story) to be the gospel and not a fan cut, no matter how much better they may steer the direction of the film. It's unfortunately just not the actual story in the end.
 
Re: Kathleen Kennedy to step down from Lucasfilm?

It still makes no sense to me that Luke would renounce the Jedi and everything they stood for and yet isolate himself at the location of the first Jedi temple and surround himself with Jedi artifacts. Talk about self loathing! Lol
 
Re: Kathleen Kennedy to step down from Lucasfilm?

Joek3rr said:
It's also worth pointing out that this is the only logical way to keep Luke on that island. The notion that Luke would abandon his friends for something like 3 years, just to sit cross-legged like some bhuddist monk, is unfathomable. But if he truly feels that he's doing more good by staying out of the fight, and that he would cause more harm then good if he came back. This is the only way he would seemingly abandon his friends for several years.
Click to expand...

And that there is a problem. The ONLY reason Luke was on the island is the 'creative' team couldnt write a story in which he didn't over shadow the new characters. Which would suggest the new characters are not so compelling.
The story RJ told can only work within the context of his movie or if Luke was a previously unknown character.

As for Legends.........
image.jpeg
 
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Re: Kathleen Kennedy to step down from Lucasfilm?

Mr Webber said:
If only this was the spirit that motivated those behind TLJ and not selfish ambition.....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wrRFXMI4N1s
Click to expand...

This just made me think of the actual official trailers. So I rewatched them both. It just struck me how immensely (and I think deliberately) misleading they are.
- Snoke may be talking to Kylo OR Rey. But then it turns out there's zero involvement in that.
- Luke and Rey training together. Not a single thing about grumpy Luke other than the "time for the Jedi to end"
- No Canto Bight
- No Rose
- No Holdo
- No DJ
- No wacky hijinks and lovely comedy (apart from a single porg shot)
- Shots that made people instantly interested. OMG is Rey gonna join Ren? Is Ren going to shoot Leia? And then you saw the movie and, ah none of those actually create any more tension than what's in the trailer.

Whoever cut those trailers together probably knew better what kind of film this should have been.
 
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