Black Panther (Post-release)

What did you think of Black Panther?


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I keep hearing that people thought it was too political. I really wouldn't call it political but there was some walls finally being broken. From the massive African American cast to the strong female security/general characters, Ryan Coogler nailed it. Heck even the album is great!
 
Hate to bring up this subject again but once again there is a real disconnect between the RT user rating and real audience exit polling from Comscor and other services. RT really does seem vulnerable to “gaming” the user score.

I had read that there were a few attempts at organizing a poor audience rating on RT for this film, by a couple of different groups...one being fans of D.C. films tired of seeing MCU films trounce their faves at the box office, and the other...well, let's just say it's a group quite a bit worse than some D.C. fanboys.


Thain summed up my impressions of the film quite nicely. I loved it, and although there were a few things I'd have liked to see done better...primarily the fight choreography...I feel that this is a standout film in the MCU.

To me, Michael B Jordan as Killmonger is their best villain to date...and the rest of the supporting cast was outstanding. I'm sitting here secretly hoping T'Challa didn't let him die, and that somehow Klaue is still alive.
 
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To me, Michael B Jordan as Killmonger is their best villain to date...and the rest of the supporting cast was outstanding. I'm sitting here secretly hoping T'Challa didn't let him die, and that somehow Klaue is still alive.

I agree, Micheal B Jordan was fantastic as Killmonger! Even though he was evil, you sympathize with him. If it weren't for a few things he had done, I would be rooting for him. As much as I would like to see him reprise his role, I think bringing him back may lessen the impact of his last words.

Also did anyone pick up on the kids calling Bucky "White Wolf"? White Wolf in the comics was a child that survived a plane crash in Wakanda that killed both of his parents. T'Chaka adopted the child which became a Wakanda protector known as White Wolf. So I wonder if we may see Bucky transition from Winter Soldier to the adopted son of Wakanda.

739720-whitewolf_01.jpg
 
Not to start an argument here, but I really have to ask, what part displays racism towards white people??? Shuri saying, “You brought me another broken white boy” to fix is the only thing I can think of. And don’t give them crap about that Colonist BS, because it was funny and true too :lol

The part in the Museum when Kilmonger went on a tirade about how the ladys white ancestors stole things. Totally unnecessary. That scene could have went the same way without that ancestor jab in there.

When they showed the destruction of humanity glimpses, did they need to show slavery, in a movie featuring 99% black people? Unnecessary.

What about the fact that Kilmonger was a black supremacist who wanted to kill anyone who wasn't Black?

The "another white boy for me to fix" comment?

Calling Bucky "white wolf" in the post credits scene

What about M'Baku telling the Martin Freeman "if you say another word, I'll kill you", while allowing the black people to talk.

Colonizers comment

What about the little remark of "Leaders build bridges and not walls"? Jab at the president

What about the remark of "When you let refugees in, they bring their problems with them"? Jab at the president
 
The part in the Museum when Kilmonger went on a tirade about how the ladys white ancestors stole things. Totally unnecessary. That scene could have went the same way without that ancestor jab in there.

When they showed the destruction of humanity glimpses, did they need to show slavery, in a movie featuring 99% black people? Unnecessary.

What about the fact that Kilmonger was a black supremacist who wanted to kill anyone who wasn't Black?

The "another white boy for me to fix" comment?

Calling Bucky "white wolf" in the post credits scene

What about M'Baku telling the Martin Freeman "if you say another word, I'll kill you", while allowing the black people to talk.

Colonizers comment

What about the little remark of "Leaders build bridges and not walls"? Jab at the president

What about the remark of "When you let refugees in, they bring their problems with them"? Jab at the president

British ancestors did steal things from Africa.

Slavery happened.

Killmonger wanted to kill the people of Wakanda who also opposed his plan.

It was another white guy for her to fix.

White Wolf is a character from the comics.

Freeman was an outsider.

Colonizing happened.

Leaders should build bridges, not walls. Nothing racist about that.

The idea that when when you let refugees in you let their problems in isn't relegated to only our president, many feel that way.


Not much racist in any of that. I think maybe it's not the movie that's racist in this instance.
 
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1.Why should we hide history?
2. Why should we hide history?
3. Uhhhhh he tried killing T'Challa along with his entire staff and they were all of black
4. I thought that was funny because it was a call back to Bucky AND they dont often have white people in Wakanda
5. White Wolf is a white character from the Black Panther comic books..who is white.
6. Reading way too much into the comment
7. Humor
8. Reading to much into it
9. Reading too much into it. Even if it was a jab, that happens ALL the time. Look at SNL.
 
The part in the Museum when Kilmonger went on a tirade about how the ladys white ancestors stole things. Totally unnecessary. That scene could have went the same way without that ancestor jab in there.

When they showed the destruction of humanity glimpses, did they need to show slavery, in a movie featuring 99% black people? Unnecessary.

What about the fact that Kilmonger was a black supremacist who wanted to kill anyone who wasn't Black?

That was the whole point of Killmonger and his dad. His dad had been radicalized. This was stated in the film. It was his dad telling him about home in the beginning, so it'll have that bias. When we're introduced to him as an adult in the British Museum, that dialogue establishes that he's grown up following the same worldview. And the entire conflict of the movie is, basically, MLK's peaceful outreach philosophy versus Malcolm X's violent rebellion philosophy.

The "another white boy for me to fix" comment?[

A reference to Bucky's presence, and the two of them in an otherwise all-brown country...? Basic observation. Not racist.

Calling Bucky "white wolf" in the post credits scene

As speculated a couple posts up, there's a chance Bucky will be merged with another minor Marvel character of that moniker. Regardless, a nickname involving skin color is not, by itself, racist.

What about M'Baku telling the Martin Freeman "if you say another word, I'll kill you", while allowing the black people to talk.

That had nothing to do with race, and everything to do with Wakandan versus Outsider.

Colonizers comment

Unfamiliar to American audiences, as most films out of Hollywood ever present things from a Caucasian-American-straight-cis, etc., centric perspective, but presenting the viewpoint of a good chunk of people on or with ancestry from that continent viv-a-vis Europeans. It's more recent history for them than our rebellion against England, our Civil war... Even World War I. It's a current and relevant thing a lot of people are dealing with and getti mg through.

And yes, when one is raised within a background conversation of American exceptionalism, it can be jarring to run into a different worldview. Also doesn't make it racist. If Shuri had refused to treat Bucky or Ross because they were white? That'd be different.

What about the little remark of "Leaders build bridges and not walls"? Jab at the president

What about the remark of "When you let refugees in, they bring their problems with them"? Jab at the president

Those are universal, and, while currently relevant, also long-established prejudices, and those being addressed is the whole frikkin' point of the film. Be bad form to build up to it and then stop short for fear of offending some who would take it personally.

That's as far into politics as I'm going to get. BP is not racist.

--Jonah
 
It's a movie about a fictional comic book character. I'm not arguing that the slavery and colonizing isnt true, but why did they feel the need to go out of their way to emphasize such things? It has absolutely zero to do with the movie. If those jabs were left out, the scenes would still have had the same EXACT effect. So why, in a movie with 99.9% black actors and actresses do you need to point irrelevant stuff like that out? I didn't hear anyone in any of the other movies calling people "Black boy" or any other thing remotely questionable.

Kilmonger made it abundantly clear that his mission was to help the oppressed black people all over the world.

Instead of saying "another white boy", why not say "another outsider"? Why even point out he's white?

Bucky IS NOT the "white wolf"

No need to call white people "colonizers"
 
But hey, these are the things that JUMPED out to me. I wasn't actively looking for things like this. I was enjoying and into the movie, and said scenes made me say "huh?", and really stuck out to me. To me, it was in bad taste.

That's just my opinion. You don't agree, and that's ok. That's what makes this site great.
 
It's a movie about a fictional comic book character. I'm not arguing that the slavery and colonizing isnt true, but why did they feel the need to go out of their way to emphasize such things? It has absolutely zero to do with the movie. If those jabs were left out, the scenes would still have had the same EXACT effect. So why, in a movie with 99.9% black actors and actresses do you need to point irrelevant stuff like that out? I didn't hear anyone in any of the other movies calling people "Black boy" or any other thing remotely questionable.

The scenes were also not even remotely racist with those comments added in.

CPTRogers said:
Kilmonger made it abundantly clear that his mission was to help the oppressed black people all over the world.

Not racist.

CPTRogers said:
Instead of saying "another white boy", why not say "another outsider"? Why even point out he's white?

Last I knew Martin Freeman and Sebastian Stan were both white. Outsiders wouldn't be limited to only people if one skin color, as they made it clear Wakanda had adopted an isolationist policy, so even other Africans would be outsiders.

CPTRogers said:
Bucky IS NOT the "white wolf"

Are you part of the team working on the story for the MCU? If not, you have no clue which characters become what. This isn't the first time a character in the MCU wouldn't be EXACTLY as seen in the pages of comics.

CPTRogers said:
No need to call white people "colonizers"

Colonizing happened. It was clear that some of the characters in the film harbored deep seated resent from that aspect of history.
 
In a fake country about a fake super hero. Yea I guess they'd be mad about something that happened in real life that's totally irrelevant to the movie.
 
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Both the wifey and I loved it as another of Marvels great accomplishments but I was a little on the edge with political overtones like another said... Edgey Yes ....

Not just that but the racism towards whites. It was pretty hard to watch
While you can make the case that a character or two are somewhat, if not overtly, racist towards white people, I don’t believe that the movie itself is racist. Take the 1992 scene where Erik’s dad is confronted by T’Chaka and starts shouting about how their people are being oppressed in the US. I was prepared to cringe hard. But then I realized this perspective wasn’t carried by the film. They didn’t show us flashbacks of young Erik being taunted at school or accosted by cops. They didn’t flashback to Erik witnessing his father being tormented by rednecks (inexplicably walking the streets of Oakland). They didn’t populate the film with white characters that were impossibly naive (c.f. New Jack City). And the movie didn’t clobber us with news footage of Rodney King or Trayvon Martin. The narrative was carried purely by that character. He was the Malcolm X to T’Challa’s MLK and I’m OK with that.
 
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A little 

Again, what does colonizing and white ancestors have to do with the movie? Nothing.

How do those facts being mentioned lead you to "this film is racist against white people?"

You've still provided ZERO actual things from the film that are racist.

What this comes down to is YOU apparently didn't like being reminded of the historical FACT that black people, and Africa, have been exploited by white people for generations.

FACT: Europeans colonized Africa. This is not racist. It's a fact.
FACT: Ancestors of Europeans robbed and stole precious items from African people. This is not racist. It's a fact.

They have to do with the movie because:
A. It's set in Africa, and African history is part of the story
B. These facts explain Killmonger's character, and are used to serve as his motivations. Without them, he's just a jerk who wants a throne.

My my wife just asked me why I've been typing on my phone all night, and I read her your "reasons" for why the film is racist. She literally started cracking up at your "They called Bucky 'White Wolf'" "reason" and said "I wonder if he's also offended by them calling a black guy 'Black Panther?'"
 
How do those facts being mentioned lead you to "this film is racist against white people?"

You've still provided ZERO actual things from the film that are racist.

What this comes down to is YOU apparently didn't like being reminded of the historical FACT that black people, and Africa, have been exploited by white people for generations.

FACT: Europeans colonized Africa. This is not racist. It's a fact.
FACT: Ancestors of Europeans robbed and stole precious items from African people. This is not racist. It's a fact.

They have to do with the movie because:
A. It's set in Africa, and African history is part of the story
B. These facts explain Killmonger's character, and are used to serve as his motivations. Without them, he's just a jerk who wants a throne.

My my wife just asked me why I've been typing on my phone all night, and I read her your "reasons" for why the film is racist. She literally started cracking up at your "They called Bucky 'White Wolf'" "reason" and said "I wonder if he's also offended by them calling a black guy 'Black Panther?'"

It's a movie about a fake country. Lol.

The fact, as I said, that a movie which is 99.9% black, needs to point these things out when they have absolutely NOTHING to with the plot and the movie itself, is racist.

But to each their own. My wife, and a few friends, and a co worker, who is half black, has even said that there was no need for the the repetative remarks about whites.

But hey, to each their own. I'm not trying to get into a big debate. Just expressing my opinion. I won't change mine and you won't change yours. No point in arguing about it.
 
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While you can make the case that a character or two are somewhat, if not overtly, racist towards white people, I don’t believe that the movie itself is racist. Take the 1992 scene where Erik’s dad is confronted by T’Chaka and starts shouting about how their people are being oppressed in the US. I was prepared to cringe hard. But then I realized this perspective wasn’t carried by the film. They didn’t show us flashbacks of young Erik being taunted at school or accosted by cops. They didn’t flashback to Erik witnessing his father being tormented by rednecks (inexplicably walking the streets of Oakland). They didn’t populate the film with white characters that were impossibly naive. And the movie didn’t clobber us with news footage of Rodney King. The narrative was carried purely by that character. He was the Malcolm X to T’Challa’s MLK and I’m OK with that.
No, the movie jtself isn't. It's overall a good movie. Just a few unnecessary jabs.
 
The fact, as I said, that a movie which is 99.9% black, needs to point these things out when they have absolutely NOTHING to with the plot and the movie itself, is racist.

But to each their own. My wife, and a few friends, and a co worker, who is half black, has even said that there was no need for the the repetative remarks about whites.

But hey, to each their own.

You seem really hung up on how many black people were in the film.

The number of black actors in a movie has no bearing on what historical facts are.

You might as well be saying "This movie was full of black people, I don't need to be reminded that it's set in Africa...that's so racist!"

Your idea that the film is racist is not only wrong, it's dumb. It's even dumber because all of your supporting arguments aren't actually supporting your stance.

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Not just that but the racism towards whites. It was pretty hard to watch

No, the movie jtself isn't. It's overall a good movie. Just a few unnecessary jabs.

Which is it? Hard to watch or a good movie?
 
You seem really hung up on how many black people were in the film.

The number of black actors in a movie has no bearing on what historical facts are.

You might as well be saying "This movie was full of black people, I don't need to be reminded that it's set in Africa...that's so racist!"

Your idea that the film is racist is not only wrong, it's dumb. It's even dumber because all of your supporting arguments aren't actually supporting your stance.

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Which is it? Hard to watch or a good movie?

It's a good movie with parts that are hard to watch

Never said the FILM was racist, only certain unnecessary parts.

What I'm saying is it's a film with all black people and I don't need to be reminded what my white ancestors did hundreds of years ago.
 
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