Star Wars: The Last Jedi (Post-release)
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sztriki
Sr Member
That's a fair point, it was an extremely dumb plot device anyway. And agreed, nothing was pointing towards her being a slave until that ominous "sold you" bit.
I mean did they sell her to Unkar on a 4 years contract...? :lol
Jagjaguwar
Sr Member
From this it sounds like Rey was given to Unkat Plutt in exchange for some money, but wasn’t really a slave. She just worked for him. Apparently he has a larger role in the novel:
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Unkar_Plutt
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Unkar_Plutt
JPH
Sr Member
Wow! How to skew surveys 101.
You *do* realize your article *agrees* that negative reviews were deleted...I didn't see where they deleted positive reviews. Didn't you claim both positive and negative reviews were deleted? Finding an illegitimate negative review doesn't negate *all* negative reviews.
And there are LOTS of articles about bots and critics and wannabe fanboys giving unwarranted PRAISE to TLJ...
The point being, the movie was ultimately disliked/hated by MORE people than those who liked or loved it. I even said Rotten Toamtoes deleted negative reviews. YOUR article AGREEES.
Disney is even changing their strategy towards Star Wars...not because they are becoming more successful, but ...well, they stuff you are denying.
Skewing 201
Hmmm, asking people who walked out of the theatre what they thought? Gee, on this thread there are people who had to, "go home and think about it." Some even watched a second time to confirm it was bad. Since it was labelled as a "Star Wars" movie, true fans would be hard pressed to claim it stank without having to *process* how bad it actually was.
You deliberately choose to disregard their opinions; those people who wanted to be entertained, but instead felt insulted.
Websites allow people who have "processed" what they liked or disliked to properly define why at their convenience. SO, keep deflecting, your tactic is clearly designed to rig an outcome.
Did I mention the rigged positive reviews. Hmmm, fake positive reviews vs deleted negative reviews. And they still only got 46%!!!
As I stated before, it did well in the first week, then people began to realize it sucked.
So, play statistical rabbit hole all you like, but your methods are intentionally bias, so you have no credibility.
and Solo already lost 150mil. Unless you are ready to cut a check for that amount, Disney needs to reconsider
JPH
Sr Member
But people aren't sold into freedom. If they are *sold* it already implies they are property to be bought and sold. Slaves actually used to be for 7 years, because people owed a debt.
sztriki
Sr Member
No, I agree with that. I can buy into her not having a mini-bomb inside, as it may not have been rolled out to every single slave in the galaxy (plus I don't give two tosses about the prequels as canon anyway, but that's my personal thing), but I agree that the idea of selling her is pretty clear. Hence my Rick and Morty quote before, it's slavery with a few extra steps, whatever angle you're trying to look at it. Which to me again goes completely against how her character was introduced and set up in TFA.
Jagjaguwar
Sr Member
Source? I know you’re going to say Rotten Tomatoes, so here: https://m.imdb.com/title/tt2527336/
That’s IMDb, an equally flawed source, with a score of 7.3 based on just shy of 400,000 votes. Different site, different result. How could this be, if either/or is a valid representation of the entire population of TLJ viewers?
True, asking immediately after the movie ends isn’t perfect. But at least there’s an equal chance of asking everyone who watched (assuming everyone would take the time, which wouldn’t happen, or that opinions couldn’t change, when they could.) Not perfect but much closer to a true representation than a website poll taken voluntarily by people who happen to go to said website.
I actually never said anything close to this, so if you could cite where I did, that’d be great. Thanks.
They. Don’t. Ask. Every. Person. Who. Watched. The. Movie.
It’s exactly the same concept as any online reviews on Amazon, restaurant sites, etc. If you have an AMAZING or a TERRIBLE experience, you are the MOST likely to write a review. If whatever you bought or whatever restaurant you went to was just ok, or average, or as good as expected, you are less likely to bother. This is why lots of products on amazon have either tons of 5 star reviews or 1 star reviews. Ask yourself: do you write reviews for everything you buy, and everywhere you go? Same concept as telephone comments lines. Do you call every hotel or restaurant to let them know your visit was just ok, or do you only do this (if you do it at all) when you have either a particularly GOOD or BAD experience? I know which is the case for me.
It’s unclear to me how taking a poll from a randomized portion the entire viewing audience is “intentionally bias[ed.]” It’s literally the best possible way of gauging the sentiments of the entire viewing population short of asking EVERYONE as they left the theater.
Jaitea
Master Member
It's all about taste,....there are those who think that the decisions RJ made were spot on & the right direction to go,....but then there are others (like me) who are truly disappointed,....but the main thing that folks need to remember,....Disney wants bums on seats,....if theres a risk of their films losing popularity, they'll make steps to fix it
The reason TFA was so safe and similar to ANH was because the brief was to make everyone realise that Star Wars was back & in safe hands,....using practical effects instead of the overuse of green screen like the Prequels,....thats why that film did so astoundingly well, attracting all ages, fans, non fans, etc
BUT, where can they go now?...now that the franchise sits on a knife edge,......I pray that they dare to be creative,...moving on & stop recreating scenes from previous films
J
The reason TFA was so safe and similar to ANH was because the brief was to make everyone realise that Star Wars was back & in safe hands,....using practical effects instead of the overuse of green screen like the Prequels,....thats why that film did so astoundingly well, attracting all ages, fans, non fans, etc
BUT, where can they go now?...now that the franchise sits on a knife edge,......I pray that they dare to be creative,...moving on & stop recreating scenes from previous films
J
Jagjaguwar
Sr Member
Very true. Everyone who disliked the movie always seems to get lumped together by those defending it, and vice versa.
Something I’d be interesting in hearing from others is this: of the people who liked TLJ, was it because of the ways in which it, in Rian’s words, “subverted expectations?” Or was it in spite of this? Personally, the subverting in various ways and undoing of some of the groundwork I felt was laid in TFA made me like TLJ less, not more. I like TLJ in spite of its flaws, but there are a lot of things I would have done differently.
sztriki
Sr Member
I can only speak for myself. But I've said it before many times, I actually like the broad strokes of the story. If someone gave me a paragraph outline of TLJ's plot I'd say here's my money, make this movie. I was happy that Rey didn't turn out to be anyone's daughter/niece/etc. I was also okay with Snoke not being a long lost old character related to whoever. Whether or not it was a good choice to dispose of him so quick is debatable but I don't think it would have hurt the movie too much.
The reasons why I dislike the move are:
1. The tone is all over the place and is extremely jarring when it jumps back and forth between unfunny comedy and perpetual dread
2. Half of the film is pointless or just boring/tensionless/call what you want (Raddus/codebreaker subplot)
3. It did absolutely nothing to properly reinvigorate or shake the franchise up. It's still Empire vs Rebels. Many chances were in plain sight but the movie decided not to take them and just went back to status quo.
4. Character motivations are all over the place, I don't know who I'm really supposed to relate to, why people in the movie act the way they do. The movie is often confused about what message it wants to give and who I'm supposed to side with.
5. So many things that were started in TFA were either retconned, changed, snipped in the bud or ignored.
Cinematography was very nice, I haven't given too much time to the soundtrack, but read in many places that it's a step up from TFA. I just wish that someone was there to co-write it with Rian or at the very least someone annotated and sent his script back for a couple of further rewrites as opposed to running with a first draft. I'm very excited about Denis Villeneuve's Dune project, Brian Herbert, author and one of the producers of the movie and the son of author Frank Herbert recently tweeted that he just sent back the fourth draft of the script with his notes to the studio...by the sound of it they want to get it right.
----
Edit: I'm a *******, and just saw that your question was for the people who liked the movie.
Jagjaguwar
Sr Member
No worries, I guess it works as well for those who didn’t as those who did :cheers
I always like hearing people explain why they feel the way they do. Reading through your post, I actually agree with most if not all of the individual points you mentioned. Very interesting that in the end I feel I like it more than I dislike it, while you’re the opposite. I can say that my opinion about VIII may change based on what happens in IX. I have no clue how they’re going to wrap things up.
I always like hearing people explain why they feel the way they do. Reading through your post, I actually agree with most if not all of the individual points you mentioned. Very interesting that in the end I feel I like it more than I dislike it, while you’re the opposite. I can say that my opinion about VIII may change based on what happens in IX. I have no clue how they’re going to wrap things up.
JPH
Sr Member
I don't see how anyone could like the main pot of TLJ.
Bombing run, First Order blows up the bridge on the rebels lead ship then pull back...WHAT!?!?! The First Order is mobile.
It is absurd. Bomb the engines on the Rddus, jump some ships past them. Why give the rebels as much time as possible to come up with something?
And then hyperspace being used for a second time in a way you know any military would have tried upon creation of jump engines.
Bombing run, First Order blows up the bridge on the rebels lead ship then pull back...WHAT!?!?! The First Order is mobile.
It is absurd. Bomb the engines on the Rddus, jump some ships past them. Why give the rebels as much time as possible to come up with something?
And then hyperspace being used for a second time in a way you know any military would have tried upon creation of jump engines.
JPH
Sr Member
IMDB?
I am solo glad you mentioned them. You see, they take metacritics and use their reviews to "balance out" the peons reviews.
So, (46 + 91) / 2 =
You could have 40 million negative reviews from fans, but imdb cheats.
Better yet, read the reviews from the person who gave The Last Jedi 100% "It’s less Star Wars as you’ve never seen it than Star Wars as you’ve never felt it."
Gee, give a few "metacritics" some green and suddenly you can skew ANY review 50 points.
For someone who claims to know about statistics, all I see is turning a blind eye to gross abuses of statistical analysis.
You agree asking people as they leave will effect an accurate poll, but then claim you never said anything close to this...uh, you just did. I pointed it out...you agreed. It deliberately skews a poll.
Notice you haven't TOUCHED the deleted negative reviews.
This is statistical rabbit hole, you will argue statistics are relevant until they aren't. It is a waste of time argument to avoid the issue that more folks disliked TLJ than liked it.
You made the assertion people who loved or hated it are more likely to voice and opinion online, not me, I just said it was more convenient so more likely to get a larger, more legit sample when I can voice my opinion online. Plenty of in-the-middle reviews for TLJ, but more low than high, by real fans...even through your own example of imdb.
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JPH
Sr Member
Just the opening crawl, something like, " the brave rebrls are fleeing...
If it were, " the cowards stayed to fight..." Id find it equally dumb.
astroboy
Master Member
The interesting thing was that after that we were talking about other movies and she didn't know Chris Hemsworth. So I quickly fired up Ragnarok and after the opening scene she was like, "uh, that was identical to the opening of star wars. We're they written by the same people?'
Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk
gedmac66
Sr Member
:lol ! ... if you don’t mind me saying so - kudos to your wife’s acumen ! .
Difference being , I really enjoyed ‘ Ragnarok ‘ it kinda flowed well with some of the previous Marvel films - humour wise , and it was actually funny for the most part !
Thor’s been known to crack jokes or two in previous films , heck most of the major characters have ... it just worked .
TLJ’s ‘ humour ‘ on the other hand didn’t sit well with me because it was (imo) misplaced - throughout the film . Certainly by situations and characters that needed to be taken more seriously than they were , given what the film was supposedly about .
:cheersGed
p.s. To answer your wife’s rhetorical question ... Simply No . The writers on Thor / Marvel were more talented , and they probably wanted the ‘ entire ‘ audience to enjoy their film .
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JPH
Sr Member
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