Star Wars: The Last Jedi (Post-release)

What did you think of Star Wars: The Last Jedi?

  • It was great. Loved it. Don't miss it at the theaters.

    Votes: 154 26.6%
  • It was good. Liked it very much. Worth the theater visit.

    Votes: 135 23.4%
  • It was okay. Not too pleased with it. Could watch it at the cinema once or wait for home video.

    Votes: 117 20.2%
  • It was disappointing. Watch it on home video instead.

    Votes: 70 12.1%
  • It was bad. Don't waste your time with it.

    Votes: 102 17.6%

  • Total voters
    578
Mark Hamill has been quoted as saying "I pretty much fundamentally disagree with every choice you've made with this character... (Luke)

This point is wrong and uses a partial quote of what Mark actually said about Rian's portrayal of Luke. The actual quote was "I was quoted as saying to Rian that I fundamentally disagree with everything you decided about Luke, and it was inartfully phrased. What I was, was surprised at how he saw Luke. And it took me a while to get around to his way of thinking, but once I was there it was a thrilling experience. I hope it will be for the audience too." People need to stop using that partial quote in order to support their negative opinions about the movie and their arguments against the movie, because it's simply not accurate.
 
Regarding Forge ghosts. Here's Obi-Wan from the OT:

EmpireObiWan1.jpg

EPV_Obi-Wan_Force_Ghost-1.jpg

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Yoda in TLJ seems well within the range, to me.

Regarding Force ghost capabilities. I said it in a spoiler tag some pages back ,but I'll repeat it openly here. In Star Wars, Obi-Wan told Vader that if Vader struck him down Obi-Wan would become "more powerful than [he could] possibly imagine." Some attribute this to the psychological impact of Luke seeing Old Ben killed motivating him. Lucas originally intended something more tangible. Obi-Wan's progression from disembodied voice to hazy, distant figure to near and close -- but still static -- figure to being able to move around, push vines aside, and sit on a log to talk to Luke were part of a deliberate progression. In early notes, he was going to step back across the veil to corporeal form to help Luke defeat the Emperor at the climax. Later, Lucas decided this would undercut Luke's victory (and I feel he's correct in that). One in-universe rationalization for that not happening has been that the Emperor's aura was too strong for him to get through to help. My preferred take is that he just hadn't had enough time to finish pulling his residual self-image into sharp enough focus. Being able to bonk Luke on the head seems well within the bounds of what Yoda would be able to do so long after he merged with the Force. And, since he's Yoda and this was a Force nexus, I have no problem with Yoda being able to call down the lightning.

I'm still holding out hope that Obi-Wan, Anakin, or even Luke might appear. To Rey or Ben or both.

Now, for the story as a whole...

I am one who feels it should have been two episodes, but I also feel the Prequels and OT should have been six each, include Rogue One in there, and have done a lot of sloppy recutting to see if the story actually works (it does), and, if so, if it works better (I think so, and so do the people I've shown or told, for what that's worth). I've only seen TLJ once so far, but intend to go back at least twice more. Most of the story elements work for me. I've already done a quick-and-dirty re-shuffling and re-contextualizing that improves the presentation, but leaves us at the same point. Which is one I like.

For who only knows how many thousands of years it's been Jedi and Sith, Republics and Empires, Dark rising and Light rising to restore balance, Light rising and Dark rising to restore balance, round and round, with billions dead along the way caught in the crossfire. The whole point of this movie is "It hasn't worked, no matter how often it's tried. We gotta do something new." Who Snoke is doesn't matter, except academically. He's a symbol of the old and well-established cycle, and thus a symbol that has to be destroyed if we're to move forward. It's exciting and scary because we don't know what that "something new" will be.

One thing that is clear is it won't be the old post-ROTJ EU, with repeated happily-ever-afters that end up not sticking because the newest superweapon of the week or Emperor-Wannabe comes along to keep things in turmoil. Peace is boring. Can't have movies without conflict. I'd rather have conflict that moves the story forward rather than keeping it locked in the same endless cycle of Jedi vs. Sith. My biggest gripe with the new films (besides that there need to be more of them to let the story evolve at its own pace) is JJ's frikkin' Mystery Box. We needed more at the top of TFA. We needed more tidbits. Not a lot, but more than we got. It would have made it easier to accept that Our Heroes are older and have reacted all-too-humanly to things not turning out as they'd hoped.

I keep thinking of a couple things from the Nolan Batman films. "Die a hero, or live long enough to see yourself become the villain." This may not be the Star Wars we want, but it may end up being the Star Wars we need. :p

--Jonah
 
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Just seen it just meh. the pacing is bad, whole Finn & Rose plot was unnecessary ( don't like the Rose Character ) Finn should have got his death would have a been a good end for the character. the whole conflict between Poe and the Admiral was stupid just tell Poe the plan could have been far more tension in knowing where the rebels ( I know they are the resistance but i thick it was stupid to call them that ) are going and them working to get there. There was too many miss placed jokes which killed the mood of the scene. Driers performance was good but it got boring with the he might be good oh no hes evil back and forth. Daisy's performance was much better in this but still not quite enough to carry the film ( Also i still can't stand how strong she is with out training). I am going to have to say something that makes me said as a screen actor Mark Hamill just isn't that good. Snork died to easily, Laura Derns character didn't have to die that's what droids are for ( Also nit picking but if your rank is admiral you shouldn't be wearing a long flowing dress) and if a ship jumping to light speed can do that much damage a dozen droid piloted x wings could have crippled the entire fleet. once again Captain Phasma was a complete waste of space. why go through all that just to have Luke die any way. he should have sent Ben running then trained Rey. Last problem they completely ruined the ending. That subtle use of the force was brilliant then they go and bludgeon us with the ring and the broom less is more!
There was some nice moments i really liked Ben And Rey connecting through the force but the whole was less than sum of its parts. With editing there is a good film in there.
 
This point is wrong and uses a partial quote of what Mark actually said about Rian's portrayal of Luke. The actual quote was "I was quoted as saying to Rian that I fundamentally disagree with everything you decided about Luke, and it was inartfully phrased. What I was, was surprised at how he saw Luke. And it took me a while to get around to his way of thinking, but once I was there it was a thrilling experience. I hope it will be for the audience too." People need to stop using that partial quote in order to support their negative opinions about the movie and their arguments against the movie, because it's simply not accurate.

I took this quote from IMDB and it doesn't have the rest of what you're quoting here except that he would help to achieve his vision. Fair enough as far as it goes.

That said, what else is he going to say after that gets around? We all know that actors can be excommunicated by Lucasfilm for breaking ranks. Initial responses are often closest to the truth.

Just my two cents... Not trying to start a flame war or anything.
 
The sight of Luke Skywalker fondling, extracting and consuming blue milk from what appeared to be a very grateful creature for absolutely zero benefit to the overall story will forever sum up the worth of this movie to me. At best it was the WORST easter egg in film history. There wont be a second time.

That was definitely shocking in our sanitized "food comes from a grocery store" culture, but it was so batty, so bonkers, so WEIRD, that I couldn't help but love it. My teenage boys and I have been joking about it since Thursday (Shamrock shakes at McDonalds are gonna rule this year). I get that some see SW as a source of reverence, but this whole movie was a "lighten up, Francis" to the fans, and amen. If I gotta see alien sea giraffe breast milk in Luke's beard in order to crack the pomposity of SW, drink up I say.

Love the mischievous look Luke gives after pole vaulting and drinking.

Besides, you know there's some basement dwelling virgin out thete shoving up his glasses, hitting his inhaler, and scoffing "how does Luke SURVIVE on that island?!" Well, now we know.
 
as hard as they tried to avoid redoing ESB, you have an isolated location with a learner and a master, a dark cave with the dark side, a battle on a white planet with AT-AT's and guys in trenches trying to save a base, the main character saying another main character is good inside and can be turned, main character learning their parentage, communicating across distances between two people, remnants of a person killed in the previous episode affects others decisions. The only thing missing was someone losing a hand.. Humor at times was forced (Chewie bbq was the best), and you could tell the toy lines that built up with this one. Not that it wasn't a bad movie, but in avoiding making ESB, they made ESB.
 
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as hard as they tried to avoid redoing ESB, you have an isolated location with a learner and a master, a dark cave with the dark side, a battle on a white planet with AT-AT's and guys in trenches trying to save a base, the main character saying another main character is good inside and can be turned, main character learning their parentage, communicating across distances between two people, remnants of a person killed in the previous episode affects others decisions. The only thing missing was someone losing a hand.. Humor at times was forced (Chewie bbq was the best), and you could tell the toy lines that built up with this one. Not that it wasn't a bad movie, but in avoiding making ESB, they made ESB.

Nah, they had to one-up just remaking ESB, so they remade ESB and ROTJ simultaneously.

We got cute diminutive creatures, designed to sell plush dolls.

We got the bad guy taking the good [girl] up and elevator to see the big bad in his throne room, complete with the red guards, the good lightsaber sitting next to the big bad on his throne, and even the Emperor's theme music.

Also, we got the Falcon chasing through interior caverns, and even breaking off the dish again in there.

And, of course, the last of the Jedi Masters, becoming one with the Force.
 
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as hard as they tried to avoid redoing ESB, you have an isolated location with a learner and a master, a dark cave with the dark side, a battle on a white planet with AT-AT's and guys in trenches trying to save a base, the main character saying another main character is good inside and can be turned, main character learning their parentage, communicating across distances between two people, remnants of a person killed in the previous episode affects others decisions. The only thing missing was someone losing a hand.. Humor at times was forced (Chewie bbq was the best), and you could tell the toy lines that built up with this one. Not that it wasn't a bad movie, but in avoiding making ESB, they made ESB.
I disagree. Although they touched on some of the same themes and conflicts, almost everything in TLJ went unexpected, which resulted in many welcome surprises.

If anything, some of the similarities you mentioned paid homage to ESB, while separately doing something fresh with them.

I got lots of gripes with TLJ, but a copy if ESB is NOT one of them.

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk
 
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That was definitely shocking in our sanitized "food comes from a grocery store" culture, but it was so batty, so bonkers, so WEIRD, that I couldn't help but love it. My teenage boys and I have been joking about it since Thursday (Shamrock shakes at McDonalds are gonna rule this year). I get that some see SW as a source of reverence, but this whole movie was a "lighten up, Francis" to the fans, and amen. If I gotta see alien sea giraffe breast milk in Luke's beard in order to crack the pomposity of SW, drink up I say.

Love the mischievous look Luke gives after pole vaulting and drinking.

Besides, you know there's some basement dwelling virgin out thete shoving up his glasses, hitting his inhaler, and scoffing "how does Luke SURVIVE on that island?!" Well, now we know.

My dads`s owned a small farm for over thirty years so trust me, I was far from shocked by it any other sense of it being there at all.

We see him catch a fish and haul it up the rocks.....is that not enough? Breast milk fed Luke is totally unnecessary on every conceivable way imaginable.

There was more than enough and might I say well placed and written laughs in this movie without a homage to Russ Myers movies.
 
I can understand what Rian Johnson was doing in this movie. He was deconstructing Star Wars' established myths and tropes, and thus levelling the road ahead for JJ Abrams and Disney to really develop Star Wars outside of Lucas' original vision. Along with employing this intellectual approach to the TLJ story, Rian developed some truly stunning visuals. For example, the encounter in Snoke's sanguine-hued chamber reminded me of the saturation permeating an old technicolor film (The Red Shoes or Vertigo, or even Samurai Fiction, Suspriria or 2001). Funny enough, Snoke's chamber's beautiful red artifice is washed away once the fighting ends. It's as though Rian is drawing a parallel with his own pulling back of the Star Wars vaneer. There is no doubt in my mind that Rian created a truly brilliant, entertaining movie.

redshoes4.jpg261770_full.jpgSUSPIRIA 9.jpgkubrick_704.jpgkim-novak-vertigo.jpg

However, because I'm a lifelong Star Wars fan, it's difficult for me to truly appreciate Rian's film, as I'm loyal to Lucas' vision. Thus, while I can appreciate TLJ's approach and its aesthetic qualities, I'd rank TLJ among the 3 lowest Star Wars films, along with TPM and AOTC. While Rian created a brilliant movie, he also destroyed the mythology underpinning the original incarnation of Star Wars which has entertained me since I was kid with Kenner figures. I wanted two hours of escapism into Star Wars, and not a movie inspired by the last season of Twin Peaks and the current fascination over meta (wink wink) humor. in summary, I went with my kids to see Star Wars, but instead witnessed something vaguely resembling classic Star Wars. Right now, I'm ambivalent as to whether I'm flexible enough to accept this new incarnation of Star Wars.

Finally, I'm sure my assessment of TLJ will change upon viewing the 9th film. At that point, I'll be able to look back at the 3 films in the ST and holistically assess TLJ's role.
 
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We see him catch a fish and haul it up the rocks.....is that not enough? Breast milk fed Luke is totally unnecessary on every conceivable way imaginable.
.

I might be alone in appreciating the milking scene, LOL. Totally understand most viewers thinking WTF?

It was so far out there it deserves it's own phrase similar to "jumping the shark", or "nuking the fridge".

How about "Milking the Jedi"?





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Quick questions / points:

While I can understand why holo-Luke appears young in the fight with Kylo, I can NOT understand why he is holding the ESB blue saber. Even in the flashback scenes, he had his ROTJ saber. Plus, since we had just seen the "real" ESB saber destroyed with Kylo/Rey.

Snoke dies WAY too easily, too quickly. I guess Rian was just trying to show how arrogant Snoke was, thinking he had full control of Kylo, but MAN... what a waste. No fight with Snoke whatsoever. I GUESS they could bring Snoke in with episode 9, saying that "that wasn't me at all; just a decrepit clone of myself" or some such.

Yoda and Luke's interaction; from what I can tell, this seems to be the first time post ROTJ that Luke sees Yoda. I kept trying to see if Yoda was a physical puppet, or a mocap CG version. It looked like 50/50, to be honest. It DEFINITELY had the ROTJ look and face, not the prequel CG look.

With the Resistance ships staying ahead of the First Order star destroyers; the reason given is that "the are lighter, faster." Umm, that does NOT apply in space. You need more energy to get a larger mass moving, sure.. but there should be no logical reason that the resistance ships were outrunning the First Order at sublight speeds.

Although C3P0 had a few token scenes, I hate that they were all reduced to "shut-up 3P0!"

While I enjoyed the film, it DESPERATELY needed a better edit; the Canto Bight chunk seemed quite the waste; and about 20 minutes needed to be lopped out.

And although the dedication to "Our Princess" Carrie Fisher was nice to see in the credits, no love for Kenny Baker?!


P.S. does the "chosen one" in the ancient Jedi prophecy change?
In the PT, it was Anakin.
In Star Wars: rebels, old Obi-Wan confirms to the dying Darth Maul that Luke is the chosen one.
Now, is Rey the "new" chosen one?
 
I might be alone in appreciating the milking scene, LOL. Totally understand most viewers thinking WTF?

It was so far out there it deserves it's own phrase similar to "jumping the shark", or "nuking the fridge".

How about "Milking the Jedi"?





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In TFA Han says, "Some Moof-Milker installed a compressor on the..." referring to Unkar Plutt.

In TLJ, is that animal that Luke milks a Moof? If so, that makes Luke a...

SB
 
I thought it was enjoyable. Not great, but still fun. There were a few disappointments. The one that bothered me the most was the dice. Why did they feel the need to change the dice? I don't know why, but that really bugged me, even more than the "humor". But still an enjoyable movie. Just happy my kids liked it.
 
I thought it was enjoyable. Not great, but still fun. There were a few disappointments. The one that bothered me the most was the dice. Why did they feel the need to change the dice? I don't know why, but that really bugged me, even more than the "humor". But still an enjoyable movie. Just happy my kids liked it.

I'm sure we'll be getting a novel or comic series about the dice sometime down the road...
 
The tone was off the whole movie. The heroes are getting decimated and picked off left and right and we are shown joke after joke while it happens. The whole thing was such a downer of a movie. I left the theater feeling drained. Subverting expectations for its own sake and not in service to the story is no way to write a compelling story. The more I think about this movie the less I like it and the less hope I have that any of it could be fixed by 9.
 
I loved loved loved TLJ.

Easter Eggs:
Parking Ticket: 27b/6 - Brazil

Iron Ship: From Hardware Wars.
74BC3A89-B34C-43D0-B429-AABC1E79624F.jpeg

I would say the police costumes on the gambling planet were Spaceballs inspired.
 
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