Rian Johnson to write and direct a new trilogy of films.. (Star Wars Universe)

Re: Rian Johnson to write and director a new trilogy of films..

Being on this site has taught me better to voice a negative opinion when everyone is optimistic about something, but I'll say this: there was an interview with George Lucas, and I'm sure it's out there on the internet somewhere, ages ago (around 76-77, I think) where he briefly mentions ideas he's had for a set of films in the SW universe that went beyond the original films. So far removed from them, he said most people would probably hate it...

...I want that.

I've wanted that since... forever. In the alternate reality where that happened when these new films came to be, I envy them. I would rather have something that was divisive and made for some to love than something that everyone will like.

I love the OT, I like the PT, but everything after the PT has... not been my cuppa, to put it lightly. And what Lucas touches on in that interview, and as far as Disney is concerned, Star Wars is a brand. As in, to the majority of people, the tangible things about Star Wars (more current and specifically, the OT) should not and can not be strayed from because deviation from the brand is sacrilegious. It's the image people associate to Star Wars over both what Star Wars as a franchise and as films can be. Why did clear Coke fail despite it being the exact same formula as regular Coke? It deviated away from the brand. And in that brand, Coke must have color. And it's gotta be that "Coke" brand color. There were even talks by some that the taste was different because there wasn't any coloring.

It's all about the brand and people who are either wholly bought into it or not. Disney is all about the brand and has been for almost the past 80 years, and in that time, it's learned its lesson from trying different things that weren't met with the reception they were looking for.

Considering this, what these new films have been, what the line-up for the other planned films (that will stretch the entirety of my life) will be, how this is setting a trend for future films, on top of the fact that I only like one film from Rian Johnson (Brick), what can I appropriately say about hearing this news?

I won't stop drinking.

I hated the PT and I stopped trusting Uncle George as a writer as of 1999. BUT, that said, I’m with you. I’d love for the usual stuff to be out of the picture— no Jedi, no rebellions, no fascist empires... something NEW.

If Rian can do that, AND still find a way to make sure it still feels enough like Stars that it feels on brand, that would be awesome.

But I agree with you— I don’t know if in Disney’s eyes that’s possible.
 
Re: Rian Johnson to write and director a new trilogy of films..

I don't want to get into film theory too much and as silly and reductive as @The Wook "SW IQ" is, I understand where that comes from.

Star Wars is written off as some stupid silly thing derived from camp serials but there's a real sophistication to it that's masked by all the surface trappings that have come to identify it. Nevermind the technical achievements, the OT sports a solid foundation--- a methodology---that was lucky enough to be supported by genuinely sophisticated visual grammar. Otherwise, it wouldn't have been so influential and popular, even to today. Taking archetypal tropes that span all written and spoken works and distilling them through a different lens to see if it works in the "modern" world; it's deceptively simple. A testament to how it is are all the films that have come out since that have tried and failed at replicating what made Star Wars work in the first place. We still see it today.

Unfortunately, with how it is today, I don't think there's enough freedom allotted to filmmakers to even try and attempt something like that, at least not through the current studio/corporate system. Not unless they've got some serious clout and even then, I guarantee you that Disney is not going to let anyone severely meddle with their brand, especially a mostly "indie" filmmaker whatever his ideas may be. I'm not saying continuously grind that ax until you've got it sharp but that Tolkein-esque obsession to detail, the methodology that laid the groundwork---come at it like that.

And for all the slack SW has always had for being a merch peddler, for a long time, it was the films that sold the toys and other merchandise. There were things Lucas would not approve to carry the Star Wars name. Now, it's a bit of the tail wagging the dog where the merch makes the movie. Again, it's a solid brand, now. The label's gotta be slapped on whatever, and be instantly recognizable, before anyone has any idea of what it is yet and if it's good. And that's a real shame because Star Wars, for all its faults and wherever its influences came from, became more than its resources; it was greater than the sum of its parts and, for The Wook's SW IQ, not a lot of people seem to understand or be able to express that. Rather than an influential work of art, it's just another "thing," a type, a style, a logo, another commodity to be traded.




...******, I need a drink.
 
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Re: Rian Johnson to write and director a new trilogy of films..

Disney: reinventing Christmas since 2015

THAT is exactly what it feels like atm, like theres going to be a Christmas eve every week. I am not sure if old me can handle that. But then again, once we´re REALLY old (not that I am already old at 46) we have enough stuff to be grumpy about. Like "when WE were young", we had a Star Wars Film every other year or so. And that was made out of sticks and stones. "An alien was a few cats bundled together, lightsabers were painted wooden rods, the special fx were painted on film by hand and there was a guy next to the organ player who read the whole story to the audience from a book, using a trumpet. But admittance to the shows was just ten pence and a soda a penny and we had to stand around ten blocks because the movie theaters were so packed and costumes were painted plastic bags and we had to make our own lightsaber and blaster sounds with our own voices and there was NO internet to get information from but only printed paper magazines and ..."
 
Re: Rian Johnson to write and director a new trilogy of films..

I don't want to get into film theory too much and as silly and reductive as @The Wook "SW IQ" is, I understand where that comes from.

Star Wars is written off as some stupid silly thing derived from camp serials but there's a real sophistication to it that's masked by all the surface trappings that have come to identify it. Nevermind the technical achievements, the OT sports a solid foundation--- a methodology---that was lucky enough to be supported by genuinely sophisticated visual grammar. Otherwise, it wouldn't have been so influential and popular, even to today. Taking archetypal tropes that span all written and spoken works and distilling them through a different lens to see if it works in the "modern" world; it's deceptively simple. A testament to how it is are all the films that have come out since that have tried and failed at replicating what made Star Wars work in the first place. We still see it today.

Unfortunately, with how it is today, I don't think there's enough freedom allotted to filmmakers to even try and attempt something like that, at least not through the current studio/corporate system. Not unless they've got some serious clout and even then, I guarantee you that Disney is not going to let anyone severely meddle with their brand, especially a mostly "indie" filmmaker whatever his ideas may be. I'm not saying continuously grind that ax until you've got it sharp but that Tolkein-esque obsession to detail, the methodology that laid the groundwork---come at it like that.

And for all the slack SW has always had for being a merch peddler, for a long time, it was the films that sold the toys and other merchandise. There were things Lucas would not approve to carry the Star Wars name. Now, it's a bit of the tail wagging the dog where the merch makes the movie. Again, it's a solid brand, now. The label's gotta be slapped on whatever, and be instantly recognizable, before anyone has any idea of what it is yet and if it's good. And that's a real shame because Star Wars, for all its faults and wherever its influences came from, became more than its resources; it was greater than the sum of its parts and, for The Wook's SW IQ, not a lot of people seem to understand or be able to express that. Rather than an influential work of art, it's just another "thing," a type, a style, a logo, another commodity to be traded.

...******, I need a drink.

You had me at "SWIQ".

Dare I ask what SWIQ is? I mean, what I stands for is obvious, but are the standards going to be something ridiculous?

Seth,

SWIQ is a term I coined, which encompasses both a person's factual knowledge about Star Wars (e.g. Bothans died stealing the plans to the second Death Star, not the first), and a person's judgement about what made Star Wars and The Empire Strikes Back--the two masterpieces in the franchise--well, masterpieces.

The only thing necessary for you to embrace the concept of SWIQ, is a general belief in the existence of absolutes, and a specific belief that there exists an absolute standard of excellence in Star Wars filmmaking: the theatrical cut of Star Wars, and the theatrical cut of ESB.

A person with a high SWIQ knows when something does belong in Star Wars movie, and when something doesn't belong in a Star Wars movie. A person with a low SWIQ will not be able to make those judgements correctly.

To make a good Star Wars movie, the filmmaker must have a high SWIQ, or else the film will contain all sorts of things that make a high-SWIQ viewer cringe and think, "This is not Star Wars". And if the filmmaker does not have a high SWIQ, a high-SWIQ viewer will come out of the theater disappointed, and thinking, "WTF? Why didn't they do this instead of that? And God, that scene would've been so much more moving if there had been better music behind it.".

But a low-SWIQ viewer won't ever know that a Star Wars movie was made by a low-SWIQ filmmaker, because that viewer will not be offended by the things that are there and don't belong; and because that viewer will not even notice the good things that are (conspicuously) missing from the film.

There is no actual numeric values for someone's SWIQ. That would be impossible to standardize. SWIQ is merely a matter of degree: high SWIQ, medium SWIQ, or low SWIQ.

Now, every fanboy, who knows a lot about Star Wars, and has strong opinions about Star Wars, should believe that he possesses a high SWIQ. But because there is an absolute standard of what does and does not belong in a Star Wars movie, he may be right, or he may be wrong. I know that I have a high SWIQ. You should also be confident that you have a high SWIQ. But if you and I disagree *a lot* on the movies that came after ANH and ESB, then one of us is right, and one of us is wrong. One of us has a high SWIQ, and one of us has a low SWIQ.

To put it in practical terms for you, let's say you were hired by Disney to direct a Star Wars movie--an Obi-Wan Kenobi standalone film, set in the years between ROTS and ANH. Disney tells you to hire the writer, the cinematographer, the chief VFX artist, the chief make-up artist, the chief editor, the music composer, etc. You are confident that you possess a high SWIQ, but you know that you cannot do everything, and that you must rely on these other people to make the film. You're gonna wanna hire people to head up those departments who you deem to also have a high SWIQ.

Like when you're interviewing a writer for the job, what are you gonna do? You're gonna talk to him about all the Star Wars movies, and ask him what he likes, dislikes, etc. If you hate Jar Jar, but he says Jar Jar is his all-time favorite Star Wars character, you're gonna give him the bum's rush out the door, right? Of course you will. Because the guy's an idiot. With an abysmally low SWIQ. If another writer candidate professes his love for the Special Editions, and thinks it was very progressive and awesome for George to change the original film so that Han didn't shoot Greedo until he was fired upon first, you'd say thanks, but no thanks.

I didn't create SWIQ. It's existed since that magical summer of '77. I only named it. And I did so, because I felt the need for a word (or short phrase or acronym), to describe how in touch an individual is with true Star Wars. Not just how many facts they know, but how much the 'get it'. How much they understand what makes those first two films masterpieces. What makes them magical. What makes them...Star Wars. And what makes these new episodes ring true, or ring false, when measured against those absolute standards of Star Wars excellence.

The Wook
 
Re: Rian Johnson to write and director a new trilogy of films..

Good for Rian, but.. Why does everthing nowadays have to be trilogies?:facepalm Couldn't he just be signed on for three films? If the first one warrants a sequel or two, then fine. Why not just three unrelated stories form the Star Wars universe?. That said, they really need to address an unresolved part of the franchise: Episode One-Ewoks, Ewoks, Ewoks!:rolleyes
 
Re: Rian Johnson to write and director a new trilogy of films..

Good for Rian, but.. Why does everthing nowadays have to be trilogies?:facepalm

This.

What happened to just standalone films? Why does Disney have to do everything in 3s.

Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk
 
Re: Rian Johnson to write and director a new trilogy of films..

This is like my neighbour claiming he has a new Beatles album coming out.
 
Re: Rian Johnson to write and director a new trilogy of films..

This.

What happened to just standalone films? Why does Disney have to do everything in 3s.

Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk

They are still doing stand alone films, this doesn’t preclude that.
 
Re: Rian Johnson to write and director a new trilogy of films..

I'm wondering at what point Disney will be introducing Earth as a known planet in "Star Wars" lore. Technically you could say it's already canon since the E.T. species appeared in "The Phantom Menace". Think about it, and it's an eventual no-brainer for Disney when you consider the franchise tie-in opportunities. I even wonder if Galaxy's Edge is supposed to be an outpost on Earth.
 
Re: Rian Johnson to write and director a new trilogy of films..

I'm wondering at what point Disney will be introducing Earth as a known planet in "Star Wars" lore. Technically you could say it's already canon since the E.T. species appeared in "The Phantom Menace". Think about it, and it's an eventual no-brainer for Disney when you consider the franchise tie-in opportunities. I even wonder if Galaxy's Edge is supposed to be an outpost on Earth.

Highly unlikely. They already have a fantasy franchise that involves Earth with Marvel. Part of the mystique of the Star Wars brand is established at the start of the Saga films, “A long time ago in a galaxy far, far away”. I‎t allows for a lot of creative freedom they won’t step on.
 
Re: Rian Johnson to write and director a new trilogy of films..

I can understand the over saturation concern some people have but look at it this way:

• you have a renewed public interest in Star Wars, especially with kids, which I think is fantastic...

• you have a generation of film makers working on these new films who grew up loving the originals and, succeed or not, try their best to do right by them...

• and you have a company with leadership who is invested enough to be willing to reshuffle a production mid-stream if they think it might result in a better movie (Rogue One, replacing directors on Han Solo and Episode 9).

Given all that, I say let Disney go nuts and make as many films and shows as they want to. Some might be stinkers which you can choose to ignore, some might be decent which you can enjoy, and a couple of them might actually be really good films that will stand the test of time. As fans, we have nothing to lose and possibly much to gain.
 
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Re: Rian Johnson to write and director a new trilogy of films..

To have gone with this kind of announcement before "The Last Jedi" is even reviewed and released is quite exciting. It must mean they have a huge amount of confidence in the film and Rian for producing. It shows he's got a strong idea what he wants to do with the series beyond it and they've agreed to let him take us there. Now that is thrilling.

And I'm guessing a new trilogy in another part of the galaxy will allow a descent period of time to elapse after episode IX is finished so that the next chapter X of the "Skywalker" story can be written and agreed well in advance, without the pressure to find the writers and directors to rush out a film to meet a release deadline ,as with the current crop of films.

This way we will probably get to see the survivors of IX properly mature into their characters after its concluded ( as much as they will have done as actors and people in the real world) and that will help take the next Skywalker trilogy story in other interesting directions (possibly intersecting with Rians in the future).

Plus it gives the current actors a break to do other projects before returning to their roles. That seems to be a great idea to me, expanding the overall universe, whilst giving us a time out from the very familiar elements of the current movies.

Overall this seems to be a much better plan for SW productions in the future,rather than the hurried and slightly chaotic times we seem to have seen for some of the films. It looks more in line with what they have managed at Marvel, it gives everybody more time to play with the concepts of the stories and set up the production teams to make them and I think it gives the whole project the overall stability it has needed for a while.

And I think in Rian Lucasfilm have found what they really needed, much as Marvel did with the Russo brothers, someone to build the core direction in which they intend to go in the future. I've a feeling his approach to VIII is sufficently strong and different to TFA to really have given the SW universe what it needed to get back on track. I just hope JJ doesn't screw it all up again.

Anyway the idea that we get to see a totally fresh set of new characters and stories set within the same universe is really exciting. Rian is a strong writer, both in role and story, his plots are interestingly unpredictable because of the way he hands his characters often very difficult moral choices in a point of crisis, and like I've said I 'm really excited to see VIII now having read all this this morning.

As a fan of Star Wars I'm pretty over joyed by all this news and the fact we are finely going to get a live action TV series as well makes it kind of overwhelming early Xmas present.
 
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Re: Rian Johnson to write and director a new trilogy of films..

I say let Disney go nuts and make as many films and shows as they want to. Some might be stinkers which you can choose to ignore, some might be decent which you can enjoy, and a couple of them might actually be really good films that will stand the test of time.

Or they could all suck.

Look, it's clear all they give AF about is making money. They've rushed out two low-SWIQ movies in the last 23 months, and have two more to be released in the next 7 months. You're right, Dem Bones, there is a public hunger for Star Wars right now, and Disney is exploiting that hunger by pumping out as much stuff branded with "Star Wars"--both films, and merchandise--as fast as they can.

But in doing so, they're sacrificing quality in their films--banking on the belief that the public will buy anything branded with the Star Wars logo. It is cool to love Star Wars today. And the prequels were so dreadful, people desperately want that bad taste out of their mouths. So they're giving Disney a chance. I've given Disney a chance. But they've released two duds so far--one so offensive to my SWIQ, that I rank it below the prequels. And so yes, people *want* to love Star Wars so badly right now, that they've lost sight (if they ever had it all) about what makes a great Star Wars movie, when paying for the schlock "Star Wars" movies Disney's been peddling.

I have so little hope for the Chewbacca standalone film, I can't even talk about that. But I do have hope that this Rian Johnson cat proves to be SWIQ-worthy, of making a good Star Wars movie.

I'll know in 5 weeks.

The Wook
 
Re: Rian Johnson to write and director a new trilogy of films..

THAT is exactly what it feels like atm, like theres going to be a Christmas eve every week. I am not sure if old me can handle that. But then again, once we´re REALLY old (not that I am already old at 46) we have enough stuff to be grumpy about. Like "when WE were young", we had a Star Wars Film every other year or so. And that was made out of sticks and stones. "An alien was a few cats bundled together, lightsabers were painted wooden rods, the special fx were painted on film by hand and there was a guy next to the organ player who read the whole story to the audience from a book, using a trumpet. But admittance to the shows was just ten pence and a soda a penny and we had to stand around ten blocks because the movie theaters were so packed and costumes were painted plastic bags and we had to make our own lightsaber and blaster sounds with our own voices and there was NO internet to get information from but only printed paper magazines and ..."

I'm half your age, so I never got to experience Star Wars at it's inception. I've grown up on the prequels and the Clone Wars, with the latter really hooking me on Star Wars. With Disney's plan for a movie a year and even more TV shows, I wonder what the Star Wars landscape will look like by the time I'm 46! I just pray the market doesn't get so oversaturated with Star Wars it loses its magic completely.
 
Re: Rian Johnson to write and director a new trilogy of films..

So if it's a compleatly separate landscape, with no ties to the Star Wars everyone knows, then it's really just an original sci-fi trilogy that they're slapping the Star Wars label on to make it successful. It's probably a story idea he's had for awhile and though "hey, if i put Star Wars in the title, people will see it".
 
Re: Rian Johnson to write and director a new trilogy of films..

I guess this is the next way of selling a movie. The upcoming movie is so good, we are going to let the director start an all new trilogy!!! Seriously though I haven't watched a trailer yet and I hope it's a good movie because The Force Awakens was too much of a homage and setup movie. But I read something the director said about Luke's story which makes me have doubts about this sequel. I still can't believe they discarded the Extended Universe for the one movie we have now.

In the end, I wouldn't be surprised if Rogue One turns out to be the only Star Wars movie that I end up keeping next to the originals. But I'll watch to see what they come up with.
 
Re: Rian Johnson to write and director a new trilogy of films..

Or they could all suck.

Look, it's clear all they give AF about is making money. They've rushed out two low-SWIQ movies in the last 23 months, and have two more to be released in the next 7 months. You're right, Dem Bones, there is a public hunger for Star Wars right now, and Disney is exploiting that hunger by pumping out as much stuff branded with "Star Wars"--both films, and merchandise--as fast as they can.

But in doing so, they're sacrificing quality in their films--banking on the belief that the public will buy anything branded with the Star Wars logo. It is cool to love Star Wars today. And the prequels were so dreadful, people desperately want that bad taste out of their mouths. So they're giving Disney a chance. I've given Disney a chance. But they've released two duds so far--one so offensive to my SWIQ, that I rank it below the prequels. And so yes, people *want* to love Star Wars so badly right now, that they've lost sight (if they ever had it all) about what makes a great Star Wars movie, when paying for the schlock "Star Wars" movies Disney's been peddling.

I have so little hope for the Chewbacca standalone film, I can't even talk about that. But I do have hope that this Rian Johnson cat proves to be SWIQ-worthy, of making a good Star Wars movie.

I'll know in 5 weeks.

The Wook


Well, Wook, I don't presume to question the integrity of your disappointment in TFA or Rogue One (personally, while neither movie scored a direct hit for me, I found things to enjoy in both that gives me hope. I guess in your eyes, that puts me in the back row at SW University wearing a dunce cap). And unlike some folks here, I think your love and appreciation for SW is the real deal.

So, while I can appreciate the idea behind your SWIQ concept (Trademark pending?), I still maintain that these movies appeal to, and satisfy, different people in different ways that can't be quantified by applying one individuals subjective standards of approval, no matter how good the intentions. One mans "schlock" is another mans treasure.

Despite that, my point was that the current conditions are ripe to get some good — maybe even great — SW films in the years ahead. If Disney wants to pour their time, money and creative resources into attempting to make that happen, I wish them well and they've got my support.

We seem to agree (?) that there's a lot riding on The Last Jedi in terms of how willing Disney/Lucasfilm will be in letting this new trilogy become its own thing. Like you said, we'll find out soon.

As for Chewbacca The Movie, I don't think American audiences will ever sit still for all the sub-titles. ;)
 
Re: Rian Johnson to write and director a new trilogy of films..

So if it's a compleatly separate landscape, with no ties to the Star Wars everyone knows, then it's really just an original sci-fi trilogy that they're slapping the Star Wars label on to make it successful. It's probably a story idea he's had for awhile and though "hey, if i put Star Wars in the title, people will see it".

Case in point Star Trek Discovery. It’s a slick, modern, somewhat dark with very flawed characters like BSG with a Star Trek wrapper. It’s not bad per se, it’s just not Star Trek. Star Wars should always retain its sense of whimsy and fun and have broad appeal. I‎t continuously does my head in listening to grown men winging that the more recent Star Wars products are too directed towards kids. If any adult just can’t accept Star Wars films that have elements that appeal to children they really need to find an new fandom.
 
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