Joker (origin film)

Re: The Joker (origin film)

I hope Joaquin Phoenix is still part of this franchise. DC tried but building a cohesive universe didn't work out for them. This approach with each character/movie having its own universe is the better approach moving forward.

Let Wonder Woman and Aquaman continue with their solo movies. Establish a solo Superman movie in the Metropolis universe. Matt Reeves gets to create his Batman universe from the ground up. They can occasionally reference other DC characters without showing them. Jared Leto gets his solo movie as well. If any of these character movies fail, they can just abandon further sequels and move on to the next.
 
Re: The Joker (origin film)

Probably but as fine as an actor Joaquin is, I don’t think anybody ever asked for this film, and time will tell but at this stage I would have no interest in watching that in theatre. It’s like a curiosity I’d watch on Netflix.
 
The DCU is such a mess right now. It's clear they don't know what the heck they're doing anymore.

Phoenix is a solid actor and great to see a change from Jared Leto. He's a great actor, but I just don't like his Joker at all. Also, is Joaquin going to be in the for the long haul, or is he going to just play the role once and be out?

I really don't like that WB just keeps pulling everyone's strings and confusing the crap out of everyone in what direction they plan to go. If the idea is to null Suicide Squad, then they must be just changing things in places, but yet continuing on of sorts?

It's extremely confusing because we also have another Wonder Woman film coming, so obviously they're keeping Gal Gadot, but what is WB doing on the whole? It gets so tiring to hear of all the changes that I just don't have a whole lot of faith in the DCU right now.

I LOVE The Joker. I LOVE Batman. I LOVE Superman. I really DON'T CARE for what they've done with these 3 characters though, and it's sad because they are among my top favorite heroes/villains. I grew up with a higher love for DC than Marvel, but I have been so impressed and absolutely love what they've built in the MCU that my appreciation level for them has far skyrocketed above DC's film universe. I didn’t even care when I saw Batman and Superman together in the vs film and I still have yet to see Justice League. It’s sad how much disconnect I feel toward these heroes. The last time I got excited for Batman was the Nolan years and prior to that, Keaton.

I am, for the long term, very jaded by any news about the DCU, but if it starts looking good i'll be on board. It hasn't been a great last 10 years though since Nolan's Batman went bye bye.
 
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Set photos

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I wish that this isn't set in a different universe. DC's cinematic universe is more confusing than the X-Men series. I hope that Joaquin's Joker is like the original Joker and Jared Leto's Joker ends up being his successor or something just to make sense of it all.
 
I guess I don't see the problem with them having different continuities for different stories. It's worked fine for DC in the past, at least with some of the original superman and batman films. I really don't see what "harm" comes from having a few different stand alones, and any somewhat crossed over films going at the same time is. I can walk into my comic shop and pick up a dozen stand alones that are all fun, snag two different versions of suicide squad, two versions of superman, three versions of batman, and most if all of them were being put out (or are still being put out) at the same time. Why aren't we Ok with our comic book movies following the same rules as their source material?

I love the MCU, but not every story needs to be told as a multi film cross over franchise; and if there IS a CU in existence for something, not every story related to that has to be told as part of that universe. I'm playing through the new Spider-Man game, and its story is great, but is set apart from the MCU, and it doesn't make it any more or less enjoyable for it.
 
Who wants to guess the "Suck Factor" of this one. I'll guess slightly less than a Black Hole, just over a White Dwarf Star. ; )
 
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I guess I don't see the problem with them having different continuities for different stories. It's worked fine for DC in the past, at least with some of the original superman and batman films. I really don't see what "harm" comes from having a few different stand alones, and any somewhat crossed over films going at the same time is. I can walk into my comic shop and pick up a dozen stand alones that are all fun, snag two different versions of suicide squad, two versions of superman, three versions of batman, and most if all of them were being put out (or are still being put out) at the same time. Why aren't we Ok with our comic book movies following the same rules as their source material?

I love the MCU, but not every story needs to be told as a multi film cross over franchise; and if there IS a CU in existence for something, not every story related to that has to be told as part of that universe.

I agree, but when there were standalone superman and batman movies, DC wasn't trying to build up a cinematic universe, like they are now. Not to say they can't make standalone movies within the CU, they're doing it with Wonder Woman and Aquaman. They still tie in with JL, without actually being a JL movie (I hope).

Due to the success of the MCU, and the copycat attempt by DC, anything standalone made would be expected to be a tie in to the DCEU, and doing anythingess could cause confusion to the viewing audience, at least not without a significant set up of what's going on.

MCU has had standalone movies that are part of the overall universe, but work well on their own. It would be awkward, though, if they made a standalone movie about a current CU character, while using a different actor. I'm not a fan of Jared Leto's Joker, but he's the one who is pre-established in the cinematic universe. Joaquin Phoenix, as the Joker in a completely different movie, seems counter productive, and emphasizes the mistakes WB/DC as made thus far.

And personally, I don't want to know the Jokers origin, unless, as stated above, it turns out to be a fabrication made by a broken mind.

One Joker origin story I could get on board with, is Jared Leto as the Joker, telling multiple stories through a series of flashbacks (with Joker being played by a different actor in each scene), to Dr. Harleen Quinzell, providing an origin for Harley Quinn as well. To see her change, emotionally and mentally, interview after interview, story after story, until she becomes obsessed with the Joker. After which, he reveals that he has been making the whe thing up.
 
Eh, I feel like that's not giving audiences enough credit. Especially when you add in press tours and marketing that go along with films; the only folks that won't get it, are the same folks that think batman is going to come help his buddy captain America in the next avengers movie, and there's no squaring those folks away.

And what's a joker origin story matter? We've already got a hand full and you clearly don't count those, so what's this one matter? Each incarnation of the character just needs to be consistent within themselves. The jack Nicholson joker had an origin, which doesn't stop the BMTAS joker from NOT having an origin, same as that doesn't stop the killing joke joker from having one, which in turn doesn't stop the heath ledger one from NOT having one.
 
It's like the Han Solo origin story, we knew enough of the character through the OT and EU, that a dedicated origin movie was superfluous. They filled in some of the gaps, then layered it over with the cement that is canon, all while spoon feeding the audience a rather dull story that hits all the bullet points but not much else.

My fear is that WB/DC will do the same thing with another beloved character. What I wrote above would/ could tie in all, or at least many, of the origin stories that exist, while still leaving his origin open ended, I could get behind. Leave some of the mystery to the character.

The animated series Joker, and Ledgers Joker, are two of the best because they have the mystery. Nicholsons Joker, was okay, because that's what I grew up with and really before I got into comics. And I may be alone in this, but I hated the Killing Joke. And not just for the Joker origin.
 
I’m up for any and all interpretations of my favorite characters. Artist get to tell a different story and I love the variety. I’ll echo what others have said, artist have been doing this forever in comics and why is that ok but film not? So you didn’t like what they did with the Joker in Suicide Squad, me either however let’s see what’s next!
 
... And I may be alone in this, but I hated the Killing Joke. And not just for the Joker origin.

You are not alone. I don't understand how it got the acclaim it did. I guess it just hit a growing desire in the market that we didn't realize was there, at the right time, back when "needlessly gritty" was still considered artistic? who knows.
 
"Hey, we're doing a Joker film!"

"Oh cool! So we're extending this beyond the Gotham series?"

"Why would we do that?"

"Oh okay so Jared Leto..."

"What? No!"

"But wait... So we're revisiting the Nolan era Joker?"

"This is different. We got Joaquin Phoenix playing him."

"So wait... This is an origins film and we're using an older guy to tell the beginning of Joker that Leto eventually plays?"

"What? No! What are you talking about?"

"No, what are YOU talking about? We got 3 different universes of the same characters that have nothing to do with each other! What the heck are we even doing here at DC???"

"We already have other Jokers being portrayed?"

I think WB is just making whatever they want whenever they want and the reboot window has a cushion of 4 months or something. How can anyone relate to the DCU together as a society? The discussions would be so confusing.

Marvel has ONE S.H.I.E.L.D.. ONE Cap, ONE Loki, ONE Hell's Kitchen.... When you talk about anything MCU at least everyone is talking about the same thing. Anything that had prior iterations were from years passing enough to where it's pretty clear the differences.

Spider-Man was probably the most close-together transition from the solo films from Sony moving into the joint cooperation of the Disney Marvel MCU, but they handled that with a very clear reasoning and were very methodical.
 
I’m optimistic because I like the Joker character and maybe someone besides HL could do it justice. But DCEU has been subpar lately. I saw this and thought it was pretty funny

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