Blade Runner 2049 props and replicas

They're still SHINY! :)

Interesting how the manufacturer (if it's just one) mixes and matches the grip style...

How would you describe the metal of the dark slide - is it steel? Aluminum? Brushed? Painted? Satin? Polished?

Are the circled numbers inlays? Can you tell what they're made of?

The triangular corner plates and cross bar - are they steel or aluminum? What material are the grips?

Final question: please remove the dark slide so we can see the interior. :)
 
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Hey guys, just wanted to put out a warning, if anyone else comes across this site, it is a scam! http://www.dggbshop.top/kassetten-f...plattenformat-plattenformat-k04-p-15720.xhtml

Couldn't believe my luck :facepalm I ordered two of these before realising that the images were identical to the ones Buzby posted. A further check, and other items were using images fished from Ebay. I googled their charging company, and it's flagged as a scam.

I used a debit card, so I may lose the money I dropped. Pretty much the first time I've been duped, and it wasn't here or Ebay!
 
Thanks for the warning - sucked being scammed. I hope you canceled your card - what a hassle...

Why on earth would they list something so obscure and in low demand? If they had added “Blade Runner 2049” in the title and put a €300 price tag on it the way they now do for Graflex 3-cell flash handles, that would have made sense...

Hope there’s a competent reporting agency like the FTC in the U.S. for credit card fraud.

Birdie said:
Hey guys, just wanted to put out a warning, if anyone else comes across this site, it is a scam! http://www.dggbshop.top/kassetten-f...plattenformat-plattenformat-k04-p-15720.xhtml

Couldn't believe my luck :facepalm I ordered two of these before realising that the images were identical to the ones Buzby posted. A further check, and other items were using images fished from Ebay. I googled their charging company, and it's flagged as a scam.

I used a debit card, so I may lose the money I dropped. Pretty much the first time I've been duped, and it wasn't here or Ebay!
Click to expand...




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Yeah, it's odd...there's truckloads of stuff on their site, so I can only guess that maybe they use bots to trawl auctions and it's all automatic.
 
Birdie - check out eethan’s latest reply to the BR2049 props thread on PropSummit - he used Photoshop (at my request) to verify your conclusion on the correct size of the plate holder. Could you step in and confirm?
 
Hey, Unforgiven asked me to post here too. here is my photoshop, I'm not super sure this is conclusive as it's really approximative.

first picture is with the plates at the same size at the back of the box, you get 55cm for two plates:

frame2.jpg


now, this isn't really precise, I didn't change the size of the plate, but since it's not sitting at the back of the case, if you do what I did again but not totally at the back, you get 47cm for 2:

frame3.jpg


don't know if that helps :?
 
A bit more digging has revealed the make. The plate holder is from a Goltz & Breutmann 'Mentor' Reflex camera, dating from the early 1900s to late 1920s. They were made in 6.5x9, 9x12, 10x15, and 13x18cm formats. They also made portable folding (Klapp0 verisons of the Mentor.
Here's a 9x12 Klapp version (the 9x12 models are far more common than the other formats, relatively speaking).
s-l1600.jpg
Here's some more 9x12 plate holders like the ones @Franatix has:
goltz-breutmann-mentor-single-lens-reflex-camera-[4]-13646-p[ekm]202x270[ekm].jpg
One auctioneer listed the plate holders as being made of ebony and aluminium. Some plate holders do not have the aluminium corner reinforcement plates, so the design was changed over time (I'm betting they lost the corner plates later on as an economy measure, as G&B went bankrupt in 1929). There appear to be very early or late versions that were all wood, like these 13x18 ones:
s-l1600.jpg
Here's a 10x15 format Klapp Reflex:
s-l1600.jpg s-l1600.jpg
The plates with aluminium strengthening parts seem to be mostly seen with the Klapp models, so they may be 'lightweight' plate holders intended to be used on the more portable folding models.

The company were operating at the same time and in the same city (Dresden) as ICA, so it's probably not a coincidence the plate holders look similar. However, the exterior dimensions and fit are unique to Mentor's cameras, so they are quite sought after by collectors as the cameras are practically useless without them. The company was taken over by one of the former workers during WWII, but the factory was flattened in the Dresden raid in 1945. After the war the company continued to make large format cameras (though with more standard Lindhof-style plate holders) under the Mentor name in the DDR, and eventually merged with Pentacon (the company that made Praktica cameras) in 1980.
 
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Buzby, you just won the Internet! Or as Gaff would say: “you’ve done a man’s job, sir!” :)

Are you also on PropSummit?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Unforgiven said:
Buzby, you just won the Internet! Or as Gaff would say: “you’ve done a man’s job, sir!” :)

Are you also on PropSummit?
Click to expand...
yes, as Prime586. I don't post often though (I think last time was when I identified the manufacturer and model number of the binding post on Deckard's blaster)

You wanted to see what's inside one of the plate holders - I think I can make a good guess. Originally they were made to hold glass plates negatives. The plate slides in from the side underneath the dark slide. To push the plate to the front of the holder and keep it in place there is a leaf spring in the centre of the backplate. As celluloid film became available there was no way to hold a sheet of thin film in place in the plate holder, so sheet film adapters were made by various companies for glass plate holders. These are metal plates with either small clips at the sides or folded return edges that the film slots into that hold the film flat, and then the adapter slides into the plate holder in place of a glass plate.

I suspect the paper on the prop is clipped or tucked into a sheet film adapter that probably came with the plate holder when they bought it.
 
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ahah, it's becoming hard to follow both threads on both forums. So, seeing the pictures here, in reassures me, this is clearly not ebony, just painted wood. it would be crazy if people really did parts out of exotic woods. ;)
 
eethan said:
ahah, it's becoming hard to follow both threads on both forums. So, seeing the pictures here, in reassures me, this is clearly not ebony, just painted wood. it would be crazy if people really did parts out of exotic woods. ;)
Click to expand...
I think it might actually be ebonised hardwood. It might be worth getting @Franatix to try taking a small scraping of one of his plate holders to see if there's plain wood beneath the surface.
 
I've have one of the 8x12 ones for a while, I started a thread here: https://www.therpf.com/showthread.php?t=286398and was the first to point out the slide in cover, I believe, but everyone seems to have ignored it :lol

The material feels like hard plastic or bakelite, I have some of the little ones too, same material, it isn't painted wood. If there is any wood it is coated with something hard and shiny. I don't reallt want to cut one up just to find out.
 
Ebony wasn't rare or illegal to harvest back in 1910-1930, so it's quite possible it was used in this plate holder. It's rather a moot point, since no-one is going to use real ebony in a replica. ;)


Further confirmation that the correct format is 13x18 (and not 18x24, as I originally concluded): using the KoohINoor pencil, I verified that the width of the inner fame matches the 14.5 cm written on the Mini Post It Note on the Mentor plate holder photo Buzby posted. I believe that the 13x18 format is actually a further reduced inner border behind the dark slide. This would make 14.5x21 cm the dimensions the seller measured of the inside frame, not the outer frame. 18 mm strikes me as the correct thickness of the plate holder.


KhHOkO7.jpg


Feedback welcome!
 
Birdie said:
The material feels like hard plastic or bakelite, I have some of the little ones too, same material, it isn't painted wood. If there is any wood it is coated with something hard and shiny. I don't reallt want to cut one up just to find out.
Click to expand...
That does sound more like like ebony. These cameras were very expensive pieces when new, so like musical instruments of that era it's not uncommon to see ebony used in their construction (which as @Unforgiven has mentioned above, wasn't a protected species back then). Using Bakelite resin for mouldings didn't really come into widespread use until the late 1920s-early 1930s. It was used as a laminating varnish and coating from the late 1910s though, so it could also potentially be a more common hardwood impregnated with Bakelite (a composite material which was used as an ebony substitute in cheaper jewellery and musical instruments).

Unforgiven said:
I believe that the 13x18 format is actually a further reduced inner border behind the dark slide. This would make 14.5x21 cm the dimensions the seller measured of the inside frame, not the outer frame. 18 mm strikes me as the correct thickness of the plate holder.
!
Click to expand...
The 9x12 and 13x18 measurements refer to the size of the glass plates (and later, film sheets) the holders were made to take, i.e. the interior dimension of the 'box' behind the outer frame and dark slide (the photographic plates came in standard sizes, 13x18cm being the metric equivalent of 5"x7"). The inner dimensions of the aperture of the frame need to be smaller than the size of the plate, or it would fall out of the front under the pressure of the leaf spring that sits behind it.

I am pretty sure the 14.5cm x 21cm measurement is the outer dimensions of the frame where it fits into the camera (there is a slight lip on the top and bottom edges of the frame where it slides into the retaining channel of the cassette holder on the back of the camera).

The seller who listed the 13x18 holder and gave the outer dimensions as 14.5x21cm also had 9x12cm holders that he gave the outer dimensions as being 10.4x14cm - does this measurement line up with your example, @Birdie?
 
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Not really....:lol

Outer dims on mine (not including the lip) are 16.6x11cm. Inner 12.8x9cm.



buzby said:
That does sound more like like ebony. These cameras were very expensive pieces when new, so like musical instruments of that era it's not uncommon to see ebony used in their construction (which as @Unforgiven has mentioned above, wasn't a protected species back then). Using Bakelite resin for mouldings didn't really come into widespread use until the late 1920s-early 1930s. It was used as a laminating varnish and coating from the late 1910s though, so it could also potentially be a more common hardwood impregnated with Bakelite (a composite material which was used as an ebony substitute in cheaper jewellery and musical instruments).


The 9x12 and 13x18 measurements refer to the size of the glass plates (and later, film sheets) the holders were made to take, i.e. the interior dimension of the 'box' behind the outer frame and dark slide (the photographic plates came in standard sizes, 13x18cm being the metric equivalent of 5"x7"). The inner dimensions of the aperture of the frame need to be smaller than the size of the plate, or it would fall out of the front under the pressure of the leaf spring that sits behind it.

I am pretty sure the 14.5cm x 21cm measurement is the outer dimensions of the frame where it fits into the camera (there is a slight lip on the top and bottom edges of the frame where it slides into the retaining channel of the cassette holder on the back of the camera).

The seller who listed the 13x18 holder and gave the outer dimensions as 14.5x21cm also had 9x12cm holders that he gave the outer dimensions as being 10.4x14cm - does this measurement line up with your example, @Birdie?
Click to expand...
 
Thanks again Birdie for the plate slide text! Turned out great!
 

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Birdie said:
Not really....:lol

Outer dims on mine (not including the lip) are 16.6x11cm. Inner 12.8x9cm.
Click to expand...

Ah well, worth a punt! The 'inner' measurement of 12.8 x 9cm is the size of the plate aperture in the frame? You have the sheet film adapter inside as well don't you (the part the paper is clipped onto)? Is that removable, and if so, what are the dimensions of that?
 
well, I found this listing here:

http://www.retrolandleeds.uk/goltz--breutmann-mentor-single-lens-reflex-camera-13646-p.asp

according to their description its clear, that they used ebony and aluminium for the film plates:

Dresden, circa 1920. Grained black leather covered body, original Rietzschel prolinear F1.9 135cms super-fast lens. Lens, four ebony and aluminium plate holders, lens cap, in fitted original leather case 10 x 7 x 8" tall. All in excellent condition * Rare with this lens.
Click to expand...
 
The clip is not removable. Once we are done 'collating', I should be able to reproduce these fairly accurately with laser cut acrylics and engraved metalgraph laminate for the corner tabs and aluminium sections. Hopefully find somewhere to cut 1mm aluminium sheet to size for the plates.

Obviously, these dims would need to be scaled up
.measurement.jpg


buzby said:
Ah well, worth a punt! The 'inner' measurement of 12.8 x 9cm is the size of the plate aperture in the frame? You have the sheet film adapter inside as well don't you (the part the paper is clipped onto)? Is that removable, and if so, what are the dimensions of that?
Click to expand...
 

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