Warning!!!! Bad Auction!!!!

Using someone else's pics in one's auction without the consent of the artist is bad form indeed... Though the blueprint is made free to the public, it's still a matter of trust and integrity.

Nevertheless, the thread subject line may still be read as that DStines is "ripping members off" by selling his roto-cast replicas... as the thread has gone off on a slightly different tangent, it might be a good idea to change the title.

This one isn't there anymore. The computer-generated one. Or did I just dream that? Hellz. He does seem to be rubbing it in with his comments. Bad bad bad.

Originally posted by clutch@Dec 30 2005, 12:20 PM
Looks like the diagram is not in the auction anymore.

[snapback]1146442[/snapback]​

Click to expand...

Nope. As of this writing, the blueprint is still there... but now DStines has added a direct link to the RPF together with an explanation, which includes the following:


"Want a FREE Blueprint of the Grenade?

I have been contacted by several people about the drawing in the background.

This is a neat but inaccurate drawing based on a 3rd generation cast of the original prop
which makes it dimensions small overall compared to the real prop.

The drawing is not part of the auction or description but has been provided free of charge
and without restrictions to all by the author."

Originally posted by clutch@Dec 29 2005, 09:02 PM-->

This one isn't there anymore.  The computer-generated one.  Or did I just dream that?  Hellz.  He does seem to be rubbing it in with his comments.  Bad bad bad.
[/b]

Click to expand...

Clutch, no worries, mate. He might as well have posted my 3D model on his auction, since my 2D blueprint is directly derived from the 3D file.

Wasn't sure what you meant by his comments, so I revisited the auction, and found this:

Q: are tose your blueprints?  Dec-29-05

A: I assume you mean those instead of tose. These prints are not for sale but are made available free on the net by the author with no use retrictions. They are nice but were based on a cast of a cast of the original prop and are idealized meaning they really aren't screen accurate. Nothing beats a first generation cast of the original. The woodgrain impressions on the cast match the original just like a fingerprint. Thanks for looking.

Q: ....isn't this recast?  Dec-29-05

A: Hi, I'm not sure what you mean. A recast would be defined as a casting of a casting of an original or in simpler terms, a copy of a copy. This is a casting made directly off of the original screen used prop with the owners permission. That defines it as a 1st generation copy which would be as close as you could get, accuracy wise to the original. Since the originals were cobbled out on a lathe out of wood in 1933, this piece would be the equivalent of obtaining a copy directly out of the studios original mold. Thanks for looking.

Click to expand...

And in the ASAP forum, he posts this reply:

Wow.
Sounds to me like someone is upset that a higher quality , more accurate replica is being sold for less.

I do however thank you for your fine endorsement of my product.

You said this while referring to my replicas-

Quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
They are 100% accurate, while mine is an idealized replica
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Since you haven't held a real one, I'll still take that as a compliment. As you have requested in the numerous threads over several boards, I have given you proper credit and thanked you for your neat, but inaccurate drawing.

Dennis

Click to expand...

At your own risk, pal.

- Gabe[/b]

Click to expand...

And just now, I received a reply to my 2nd eBay e-mail:

wow.
Your facts and perception of truth change more than a windvane in a tornado.
Fact- You offered the blueprint Free without any restrictions to the world. A simple google search will confirm that you need not be a member of anything to use these.
Fact-They are used for nothing more than decoration in my auction.
Fact-I have given you full credit( as you have requested in same threads) by referring anyone who wants a copy to the original place you posted it for free which is more than required by any fair use law. You can't rescend your public offer of free after you have given up possession by offering it.
Fact-By incorporating a likeness of your free artwork into my auction picture as set dressing, that picture of the prop and background is my property and is protected by the same fair use laws. Your picture has in effect become public domain clip art.

Click to expand...

:eek

I don't know about you guys, but DStines has certainly earned himself a pair of these:



:lol

This episode has worn me out... But at least several individuals' true colors have emerged today, so I figure the price I paid was worth it.

- Gabe

The dimensions of the real prop are known by many now.

Gabe didn't invent the item or discover anything new. He drew it up in cad. Let's say that again; "He drew a picture." A photo based on measurements of a screen prop. While it was indeed a nice thing for him to do it was hardly necessary for someone to use his drawing to recreate this prop. C'mon'...It's a simple piece.

I do agree, using someone's pics without permission is bad form but I'd hardly say the guy recast anything...Let's not get crazy with our terms here. Drawing a photo doesn't make an item "belong" to anyone. Using the pic is a little shifty but not the act of making the item. The prop itself is fair game. Even the movie is in public domain.

Hell, I'm making a few gas bomb replicas myself. I think Gabe did a fine job but I want to do a thing or two different with mine. I have no need for cad drawings. if I did, I'd pay to have a set drawn up and off to Asia the info would go. Truth is, they just aren't necessary and gabe was trying to do something nice for a few board members.

The call to arms on this thread was just a little over the top in my opinion but, hey; he did use the guys pics without permission which does indeed hit me wrong, too.

I have no dog in this fight and just take issue with the "recast" word that is getting tossed about a little too fast these days.

You can't recast a cad drawing. I am curious to know if Gabe will consider anyone who makes these to have violated the spirit of his gift?

Will the implication now be, "You used Gabe's drawing" if the replica is accurate? Gabe got his dimensions from a screen prop. How did he all of the sudden become the authority of this piece?

Not attacking Gabe but just ponting out how easy it is for people to get a false sense of ownership in the prop world. It was a nice gesture on Gabe's part but I would caution him to place limitations (in writing) on his drawings if he feels others will use them in the future.

I think you nailed it, Rylo.

Gabe,

I'm sorry that you got taken advantage of in this fashion, and I'm glad that your images have been removed from the auction in question.

It seems that some tempers flared up here tonight (always seems to be the same people, too :unsure ). I've pulled a lot of the off-topic posts out of this thread and will lock this one up.

Lonnie
RPF Staff