Warning!!!! Bad Auction!!!!

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atacpdx

Well-Known Member
http://cgi.ebay.com/1933-RKO-King-Kong-Gas...1QQcmdZViewItem

"Dish_Man" ie DSTINES has decided to take our own PropRunner's hard work and generosity and run a batch of Kong grenades without even so much as a "Thanks" or "May I" and is using Gabe's photos to boot. He then has the nerve to email me and say it is ethical and acceptable because Gabe posted the files here for all of our personal use and enjoyment. (Ever wonder why so many here with info don't share?) :(

I hope you will all drop him an email via ebay and let him know it isn't cool.
 
So is it cast off an original?

He stated twice that it was cast off the original prop.

"This is a casting made directly off of the original screen used prop with the owners permission."

If so is he only using Prop Runners Diagram?

FB
 
Definetly not cool. Gabe gave up his hardwork for people here to you for free and this #*&$%@ is trying to make a profit of it.

Not cool at all.
 
Originally posted by franz bolo@Dec 29 2005, 07:41 PM
So is it cast off an original?

He stated twice that it was cast off the original prop.

"This is a casting made directly off of the original screen used prop with the owners permission."

If so is he only using Prop Runners Diagram?

FB
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He doesn't have an original. He is doing this off of PropRunner's work and using PropRunner's photos in the auction to boot as near as I can tell from emails with him.
 
This replica was molded directly off of an original grenade that belonged to famous collector and movie historian, Forrest Ackerman.

The originals were turned out of wood. This carbon copy is done in the highest quality urethane resins and is roto-cast to reduce weight and provide a piece that requires very little cleanup and prep.
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Seems like he's saying it's cast off an original. What's the problem then?
 
Notice Prop Runner's prints that he supplied to the RPF in his pictures on the auction...
 
Originally posted by Kerr Avon@Dec 29 2005, 07:56 PM
This replica was molded directly off of an original grenade that belonged to famous collector and movie historian, Forrest Ackerman.

The originals were turned out of wood. This carbon copy is done in the highest quality urethane resins and is roto-cast to reduce weight and provide a piece that requires very little cleanup and prep.
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Seems like he's saying it's cast off an original. What's the problem then?
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The problem Kerr is that he is using Gabe's blueprints to add "authenticity" to his photos, when emailed, could provide no "provenance" to back up his claims and also, when asked to remaove the prints from his photo's essentially said piss off.
 
It looks like it was a cast. There are wood grain patterns in the grenade. It doesn't look machined or crafted either.

So the problem seems to be with using Prop Runners diagram in the auction and not with using the specs that were drawn up.

FB
 
I am not sure but I think if someone should be e-mailing him asking him to remove that pic from the auction it should be Gabe. If he is not selling this picture on ebay I dont really see any reason to be implying he is doing something wrong.
 
Mark: he's selling cheap hollow recasts of the original prop - that's undisputed. They are 100% accurate, while mine is an idealized replica (albiet constructed from wood, like the screen-used original). He's simply using my blueprint (ironically, derived from measurements off a casting of an original sold by PF) to embelish his item description. He's not making any claims to the blueprint, but it's obvious he wants bidders to assume a direct association.

I sent him this note via eBay yesterday, but have not heard back:

Hi there

I recognize my own 1:1 scale blueprint in your gas bomb replica auction photos.  I'd appreciate if you remove it from your item description, as my intent was not to put it out there for commercial gain, and the ethical thing on your part should have been to ask my permission first, seeing that it has my name on it (not to mention the fact that it has nothing to do with the casting you're offering, which bothers me just a little bit).

Feel free to contact me directly at proprunner@aol.com.  I'd like to be able to resolve this matter like gentlemen.

Respectfully,

Gabriel Galt
Ventura, CA
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I just hope his bidders don't expect a copy of the blueprint, because it will be dated 12/21/05 and labeled "PROP RUNNER REPLICAS," unless Stines edits the PDF file. Besides, I don't think they had 3D CAD back in 1933... :lol

I do appreciate the supportive comments, and I have absolutely no regrets putting out that blueprint as a freebie. I believe in karma, and since DStines is an associate of PF (who is probably his supplier for this auction), he'll get his due at some point. ;) It actually makes me warm and fuzzy to think that the former T2 license holder and his pal have to resort to blatantly using my work to move a resin casting. :p

And as a firm believer in the Tinseltown rule that there's no such thing as bad publicity, if anyone would like to check out the wooden gas bomb replicas based on my blueprint, check out my Junkyard thread:

http://www.rpf.invisionzone.com/index.php?showtopic=101960

:D

- Gabe
 
IMHO it doesn't look to have the same shape as the original shown and it appears that he got wind of this thread because he has just lowered the price considerably. As long as Gabe doesn't have a problem with it , neither do I, but thanks atacpdx for looking out for a fellow member. :thumbsup
 
Does someone know for sure if these are recast or is it just speculation? I guess I'm confused as to what wrong has been done.

Andy
 
Originally posted by westbatman@Dec 29 2005, 02:06 PM
Does someone know for sure if these are recast or is it just speculation? I guess I'm confused as to what wrong has been done.

Andy
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It's really quite simple, Andy: no-one disputes the seller's right to recast a screen-used prop and sell his replicas on eBay - we do it here all the time in one form or another, unless there's a licensee like MR or Sideshow whose rights we collectively, for the most part, agree to respect.

At issue here is the seller using someone else's work (in this case, my blueprint) without so much as asking permission or giving me due credit, in order to promote and embelish his eBay auction, when it's clear to all that my work has nothing to do with his recasts.

It's generally bad form to use someone else's replicas or pictures to promote an eBay auction, let alone without asking first for the owner's permission or blessing. At the very least it's dishonorable, but strictly speaking, it's deceptive advertising.

Hope I helped clear things up for you. :)

- Gabe
 
Gabe responded while I was typing this. I differ to his answer (which is, more or less, what I typed up anyway)
 
Originally posted by atacpdx@Dec 29 2005, 01:08 PM
http://cgi.ebay.com/1933-RKO-King-Kong-Gas...1QQcmdZViewItem

"Dish_Man" ie DSTINES has decided to take our own PropRunner's hard work and generosity and run a batch of Kong grenades without even so much as a "Thanks" or "May I" and is using Gabe's photos to boot.  He then has the nerve to email me and say it is ethical and acceptable because Gabe posted the files here for all of our personal use and enjoyment.  (Ever wonder why so many here with info don't share?)  :(

I hope you will all drop him an email via ebay and let him know it isn't cool.
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I think that the confusion is coming from the fact that the first post of this thread appears to be an accusation of recasting or using Prop RunnerÂ’s blue prints to make a grenade with a secondary mention of "and is using Gabe's photos to boot."

As it has been subsequently explained in the thread, the issue is the seller using a picture that is not his property and refuses to remove it from the auction. I have had this happen to me (it really makes you feel taken advantage of) and the seller also refused to remove the pictures. You can file a complaint with ebay but I am not sure how responsive they are to things like this.

Anyway, I think that the original post and thread title are unfortunately a bit misleading and will probably leave many people thinking that this is a recasting issue instead of the real issue which is the very annoying practice of sellers using someone else's photos to sell their goods (can't they take their own pictures, is that too much to ask? :rolleyes ).
 
Originally posted by Montagar+Dec 29 2005, 05:52 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Montagar @ Dec 29 2005, 05:52 PM)</div>
<!--QuoteBegin-atacpdx
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@Dec 29 2005, 01:08 PM
http://cgi.ebay.com/1933-RKO-King-Kong-Gas...1QQcmdZViewItem

"Dish_Man" ie DSTINES has decided to take our own PropRunner's hard work and generosity and run a batch of Kong grenades without even so much as a "Thanks" or "May I" and is using Gabe's photos to boot.  He then has the nerve to email me and say it is ethical and acceptable because Gabe posted the files here for all of our personal use and enjoyment.  (Ever wonder why so many here with info don't share?)   :(

I hope you will all drop him an email via ebay and let him know it isn't cool.
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I think that the confusion is coming from the fact that the first post of this thread appears to be an accusation of recasting or using Prop RunnerÂ’s blue prints to make a grenade with a secondary mention of "and is using Gabe's photos to boot."
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....yeah, that's what I thought at first as well...recasting....

However, the seller still shouldn't be posting Gabe's pix in his auction....just bad form.
 
Originally posted by clutch@Dec 29 2005, 07:20 PM
Looks like the diagram is not in the auction anymore.
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As of 7:44 Pacific Standard Time, 12/29/05, they sure as hell are. Here is a direct link to the auction photo:

Dstines_1.jpg


[Edit]: this photo has now been replaced (see auction). An even earlier version, which the seller shrewdly replaced, showed more of the blueprint with the title block bearing my name (GABRIEL GALT), the date (12/21/05), and my DBA (PROP RUNNER REPLICAS).

Here's a thumbnail image of my blueprint:

RKO_Kong_gas_bomb_1.JPG


(the 1:1 scale .pdf file is ANSI C size, but it can be downsized during the printing preferenes to fit an 8x10 sheet, like the one shown by DStines in his auction).

- Gabe
 
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