Star Wars: The Last Jedi (Pre-release)

Re: Star Wars: Episode VIII (Pre-release)

Whew! I am watching the pre-quels again (TNT is running them), and I am shocked! I mean, REALLY SHOCKED that they are, after 20 years, just as crappy as I remember them! The good actors are just walking through their roles, and the bad ones vary between amateurish and mawkish. The cutting is loose with no sense of flow. Kind of like, hey! we shot it so just stick the footage together, Spielberg gets away with it, why can't we! I could go on, but I am so ashamed that I (in the words of NeilT) wasted two hours of my time on each of them. You can almost hear the sound of the flushing of the budget toilet while watching them.

Re: Star Wars: Episode VIII (Pre-release)

astroboy said:

I would love to have George back. He could plan out the stories and be in charge of the design team.

But I think his life would be like that season of breaking bad where walter was a slave for Gus fring.

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J

Re: Star Wars: Episode VIII (Pre-release)

like i said, they have major flaws. but if you fix them, i think they'd be perfectly fine movies with enough special sauce to keep one coming back for more.


these new things being produced are basically star wars lite. someone copying the basics of the formula without really pushing the envelope into something special

Re: Star Wars: Episode VIII (Pre-release)

They don't NEED to be constantly pushing the envelope. Sure they are FX flicks, but CHARACTERS make those movies.

You keep pushing things and you go from Die Hard to A Good Day to Die Hard.

Re: Star Wars: Episode VIII (Pre-release)

Yes because characters are all TFA had going for it IMO.

I will admit that after watching bits of the Prequels last week there is a lot of dialogue that makes me cringe. Any "romantic" dialogue between Anakin and Padme makes me want to smack whoever wrote it. If it wasn't George, it was whoever they had fill out the dialogue. And in general I liked the Prequels.

Re: Star Wars: Episode VIII (Pre-release)

I kinda have two tiers of movies. There's brilliant, beautiful movies I adore from Nosferatu to Metropolis to Casablanca, Seven Samurai, Psycho, The Good the Bad and the Ugly, The Graduate, Midnight Cowboy, Apocalypse Now, Blade Runner, Pulp Fiction, Let the Right One In...

And then there's trash I enjoy watching but don't really demand it make any sense or particularly move me. Halloween 2, Nightmare on Elm Street 4, Jason Takes Manhattan, Predator 2, AVP:R...

Star Wars had always been (barely) in the first category for me. But with the godawful PT and now Disney just churning them out, I think a healthier perspective for me might be to view it the way I view Jaws 2 or The Green Inferno or the Friday the 13th reboot...I don't go into those movies with an overly critical eye, I just sorta take them for what they are and don't get too emotionally invested. I think SW has to be like that for me now. I can't let myself be any more bothered that I was by Freddy's Dead. Who cares if it sucked?

Besides, I'd rather invest my mental energy on getting a theatrical blu ray of The Warriors

Re: Star Wars: Episode VIII (Pre-release)

Jaitea said:

https://s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/...nt/uploads/2015/12/11170901/Facepalm-Ford.jpg

J

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Only the sith deal in absolutes

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Re: Star Wars: Episode VIII (Pre-release)

You must be a Sith then...cuz the prequels were absolutely horrible...ba dam-tiss!

Thank you, I'll be here all night

Re: Star Wars: Episode VIII (Pre-release)

astroboy said:

I would love to have George back. He could plan out the stories and be in charge of the design team.

But I think his life would be like that season of breaking bad where walter was a slave for Gus fring.

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You'd have to be pretty closed minded to not realize that the core story in the prequels isn't solid. One could argue a thousand different ways where the PT may've gone wrong... but, the plot is really pretty solid.

...and like @astoboy said, the design was cool, too. Maybe it was a bit new and well defined for some... but, that's what the PT was.

Re: Star Wars: Episode VIII (Pre-release)

JD said:

You'd have to be pretty closed minded to not realize that the core story in the prequels isn't solid. One could argue a thousand different ways where the PT may've gone wrong... but, the plot is really pretty solid.

...and like @astoboy said, the design was cool, too. Maybe it was a bit new and well defined for some... but, that's what the PT was.

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Thanks.

The designs weren't just cool, they were world building.

And even better yet, they gave us an evolution throughout time. I loved the excess of coruscant and naboo.

And I love how there isn't any evidence of that in the OT. (Well, perhaps cloud city has a bit)

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Re: Star Wars: Episode VIII (Pre-release)

JD said:

You'd have to be pretty closed minded to not realize that the core story in the prequels isn't solid. One could argue a thousand different ways where the PT may've gone wrong... but, the plot is really pretty solid.

...and like @astoboy said, the design was cool, too. Maybe it was a bit new and well defined for some... but, that's what the PT was.

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I feel if George had used all the time between Jedi and EP1 writing, and really fleshed out the story for all 3, they would have been much better. To me, the stories felt forced, like he HAD to come up with something, and threw something together, and it wasn't until ROTS that he kinda started to pull things together, but it could have been significantly better.

Re: Star Wars: Episode VIII (Pre-release)

It's all going a bit off topic here,.....But,......how I see the Prequels......

- George had set up the gap for the Prequels by starting with Episode 4
- The OT were collaborative productions,....(ROTJ less so).....George couldn't fully realise his vision,....other creative people making decisions in his films
- Each film pushed the boundaries in the Special Effects industry
- George being the showman continues to top previous show,....one battle at finale of Ep 4,....two at Ep 5,.....three at the finale of Ep 6
- A huge merchandise deal,...unheard of previously,.....Lucasfilm made a LOT of money from the products

So after deciding not to continue with what had been planned with sequels,...& tying up loose ends (the 'Other' mentioned in ESB) & making Luke & Leia siblings, he gave us closure to the Star wars story.....George took a long break from Star Wars......In that time his company continued to evolve, becoming masters of digital effects (Jurassic Park)....which drew George back to the possibility of making more Star Wars films,.....the prospect of being able to make & direct these films without them being tainted by others appealed to him,....He still had disdain for the very films that had built his Empire,....he has said in interviews that he was fed up with praise for ESB,...the film he had the least directorial control over,....so he wanted to test his tools that he needed for his new films,......still wanting to push boundaries,.....he wanted to create digital characters,...which ended up being Gungans & Battledroids,.....so by experimenting on the OT, especially ANH,...he 'fixed' the things that were out of his control when the films were released

The SE films had some improvements & also some changes that disturbed the flow & logic of the films,....this was a precursor for the decisions made for the Prequels & future adjustments to the SE's

When TPM was released,....I loved it,.....yes there were some daft parts in it,...It was more STAR WARS!!!,....yeah Star Wars is back!!!,.....It had great effects, great actors, brilliant music,....not such a great story,....but we trusted George,.....we imagined how the next two films would connect,...it would be epic

AotC came out & my son was 4,......I bought him a Jango toy,....he loved it,.....Slave One followed,.....then the Jango costume:


Attack of the Clones was a bit of a disappointment,....the weak things that were apparent in TPM were the weak things in this film,....& now that you analysed it you could see the rot went back to Return of the Jedi,.....the smile & hope started to fade.....there were some cool things in the film,....the designs for the craft were amazing,....special effects were top notch,....but it was a bit too much,.....a bit of an overload

Hope that George would pull us back with the next film was fading,......what had he done with our Star Wars,.....George promised that Revenge of the Sith would be a lot darker,....darker than The Empire Strikes Back,....

RotS didn't know what it wanted to be,...there were elements of brutality right from the start Obi Wan getting crushed,....Lord Tyrannus having limbs cut off & then being decapitated,.....then having moments of out of place comedy with the droids.....it all felt wrong......why was there a landing strip in Star Wars,.....no craft needs to land on a landing strip,.....the film was chaos,.....the friendship between Anakin & Obi Wan was never there,...the love between Anakin & Padme was ludicrous, the entire film is pieced together like a model kit,...nothing flows,.....listen to Williams soundtrack.....he had an extremely hard time scoring this film

"I can do dark & serious,......watch me do dark & serious!"......yes theres loads of cool designs,...new planets,....thats the ONLY thing that keeps it Star Wars......& there are crafts that appear for milliseconds,.....everything is thrown in here,....universe building = toy bucket,......all thrown in the middle of the living room

When Star Wars was sold to Disney I had high hopes,....at least there would be real creative and energetic people making decisions,...but dread that the merchandise would be turned up to the max......LOADS of new craft, just for the sake of it,...for the merchandise,....but the complete opposite,.....Disney have dialled the whole thing back & done something I wouldnt have believed,......they have gone for strengthening the characters,....fleshing them out,...creating them first, then the tech & planets around them



The Emperor is George, he is the rot

J

Re: Star Wars: Episode VIII (Pre-release)

hansicle said:

I feel if George had used all the time between Jedi and EP1 writing, and really fleshed out the story for all 3, they would have been much better. To me, the stories felt forced, like he HAD to come up with something, and threw something together, and it wasn't until ROTS that he kinda started to pull things together, but it could have been significantly better.

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....and in theory, if you give a monkey a typewriter, eventually they'd write Hamlet. Lucas didn't spend all the time between Jedi and Episode 1 writing, he had other things going on.

One could still argue the basics of the story - heck, maybe even the script itself aren't necessarily the issue with those movies.

Re: Star Wars: Episode VIII (Pre-release)

it's been a while since i'veseen it, but how exactly did they flesh out characters?

We hardly know anything about Rey or Finn other than the basics.
The guy in the beginning who got killed bey kylo was just a plot device..
Kylo himself is just a whiny brat who is angry at something, we know not what.

I don't know. sometimes i think people are willing to let things pass just so long as a few tie fighters and classic style effects are thrown at them.
It even worked for me when Rebels started..but soon you realized there was so little to that show, one only had to watch it once and that was it.

As for the landing strip.. did they ever refer to it as that? Maybe it was just a big star ship landing and staging area, only it was big enough for them to perform a crash landing on without having to harm people? and what is wrong with comedy? ESB has great moments of it. R2 getting shocked by the wrong coupling. R2 getting spit out and giving us his first dialogue of speech. Even Vader, unintentionally, gets a moment to shine with some lando moments.

all dark and grim and gritty is not only depressing, but down right boring.

that being said, yeah. i don't miss the CRAZY aspects of georgey as he got older. he really was getting a bit out of control. but i feel the creativity was still there, even if he only came up with the basic ideas and others fleshed thme out to what we know.

Re: Star Wars: Episode VIII (Pre-release)

NeilT said:

it's been a while since i'veseen it, but how exactly did they flesh out characters?

We hardly know anything about Rey or Finn other than the basics.
The guy in the beginning who got killed bey kylo was just a plot device..
Kylo himself is just a whiny brat who is angry at something, we know not what.

I don't know. sometimes i think people are willing to let things pass just so long as a few tie fighters and classic style effects are thrown at them.
It even worked for me when Rebels started..but soon you realized there was so little to that show, one only had to watch it once and that was it.

As for the landing strip.. did they ever refer to it as that? Maybe it was just a big star ship landing and staging area, only it was big enough for them to perform a crash landing on without having to harm people? and what is wrong with comedy? ESB has great moments of it. R2 getting shocked by the wrong coupling. R2 getting spit out and giving us his first dialogue of speech. Even Vader, unintentionally, gets a moment to shine with some lando moments.

all dark and grim and gritty is not only depressing, but down right boring.

that being said, yeah. i don't miss the CRAZY aspects of georgey as he got older. he really was getting a bit out of control. but i feel the creativity was still there, even if he only came up with the basic ideas and others fleshed thme out to what we know.

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It's just the way we are introduced to the main characters in TFA & in R1,.....there is more care to give them more three dimensions,.....when little Anakin leaves his mum in The Phantom Menace.....there's nothing,....John Williams score is there,....but you feel nothing,.....when Jyn sees the Hologram of her father & later says goodbye to him on the platform, it hits you in the heart.....Even when you see the little kid Rey screaming after a craft leaving her behind in her Force Vision,....you have that depth because you know that since then she has had a terrible life,....on her own

Theres nothing like that in the Prequels,.....you just watch, disconnected

There is a lot of comedy in the OT,....subtle comedy,.....the Han in the Death Star being convinced by Luke to rescue the Princess still gets me....but in RotS, the slapstick comedy interwoven with decapitation scenes just doesn't work,....it shows that the director is assembling the shot scenes with no clear vision

"I can be dark,....I can be funny"

No George,.....you cant

J

Re: Star Wars: Episode VIII (Pre-release)

I think i'm going to have to be a little of point 'counter point' here.

jyn and her father was bah bah boring. it could just be because i'm more bitter now than i was then, but i didn't really feel anything. kid anakin was a better actor than adult anakin and i thought could pull off the scene far better. and of course the excellent music, when music was allowed to be music.....

I felt like the jynn story wasn't given enough focus. and the other characters where so under used or just plain..there to be there....that they might as well have been written out. i can't even remember the name of the gun toting guy...

Re: Star Wars: Episode VIII (Pre-release)

NeilT said:

I think i'm going to have to be a little of point 'counter point' here.

jyn and her father was bah bah boring. it could just be because i'm more bitter now than i was then, but i didn't really feel anything. kid anakin was a better actor than adult anakin and i thought could pull off the scene far better. and of course the excellent music, when music was allowed to be music.....

I felt like the jynn story wasn't given enough focus. and the other characters where so under used or just plain..there to be there....that they might as well have been written out. i can't even remember the name of the gun toting guy...

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No problem,...everyone see's things differently

....but you remember the gun toting guy,....good

J

Re: Star Wars: Episode VIII (Pre-release)

Mads really sold that scene for me when he was talking to Jyn about how he didn't mean to do what he did. And I thought Felicity did fine. She was crying quite well.

And the coup de grace was telling her he designed a flaw. Why he decided to tell her about the flaw is beyond me but it fits so well into the OT. But I also suspect that Luke had some extra help because that damn shot curved into the exhaust port!

Re: Star Wars: Episode VIII (Pre-release)

that's about all i remember. basic character traits.

There's 'guy who's a rip off of han solo with a name that sounds like calrissian'.

theres 'gun toting guy who for some reason decided to die in a pointless bravado revenge attack'...

there's 'comic relief tentacle love imperial pilot guy.'

there's 'guy from clone wars episode who is in this movie for some reason'

there's 'guy who is blind and fights like a ninja and is apparently a force fanboy'

didn't even care enough about them to learn their names.

At least I'll give Fin and Rey that honor .

Re: Star Wars: Episode VIII (Pre-release)

NeilT said:

that's about all i remember. basic character traits.

There's 'guy who's a rip off of han solo with a name that sounds like calrissian'.

theres 'gun toting guy who for some reason decided to die in a pointless bravado revenge attack'...

there's 'comic relief tentacle love imperial pilot guy.'

there's 'guy from clone wars episode who is in this movie for some reason'

there's 'guy who is blind and fights like a ninja and is apparently a force fanboy'

didn't even care enough about them to learn their names.

At least I'll give Fin and Rey that honor .

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There's a golden tin man rip-off and a beeping garbage can.
There's a Disney Princess with rediculous hair buns..
Obvious Excaliber rip-off!
There's armored troopers that look like Mr. Bubbles...
There's a villain in black, we'll there's a streatch....
There's aliens in cheap Halloween masks.....
There's a space Cowboy and a large hairy dog that growls like a bear....

Do you feel old yet? Because this is what a lot of adults thought in 1977!

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