Rogue One: A Star Wars Story (Post-release)

firesprite said:
Okay. I'm going to say this yet again. I am sick and tired of people labeling Rey as a Mary Sue.

Per Know your Meme: "cementing the definition of a Mary Sue to be a wish-fulfillment outlet for the author which can sometime seem out of place in the established universe and ultimately warps the canon characters’ personalities, causing them to act out of character."

Who, exactly, do you feel acted out of character toward Rey?

Han’s behavior was consistent with his arc with Luke: Initially surly, but growing to respect and care for the naïve younger man.
Chewie’s behavior toward Rey was… well, frankly, almost non-existent.
Oh, no, Leia hugged her. Well, guess what? Sometimes women hug people, even people we don’t know, if we know they’ve just gone through something traumatic.

And then there’s the definition stated on Wikipedia: A Mary Sue is an idealized and seemingly perfect fictional character, a young or low-rank person who saves the day through unrealistic abilities. Often this character is recognized as an author insert or wish-fulfillment.[1] Sometimes the name is reserved only for women, and male Sues are called "Gary Stus" or "Marty Stus"; but more often the name is used for both sexes.

If you want to push that definition, I will counter that by that logic, Luke and Han are Marty Stus.
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Gorram Max Landis. I love the guy, but I swear to god. He was the reason for Mary Sue... and he fruckin has a MARY SUE IN HIS OWN SHOW!

I've watched Dirk Gently twice through, and if I had the time I would cut together every "Mary Sue" scene with Rey with the main female character in his show and I could find a perfect match.

And I've said this a million times... in the heros journey, the hero has to accept the call to action... Rey does not. Rey runs from it every time.

THAT ALONE makes her a flawed hero, and not a Mary Sue.
 
I checked out Rogue One again...

Three things stood out to me... they've probably been mentioned.

1. Why is everything so dark?

I don't mean "This is so dark, the loss... the fight... the deaths"... I mean "Why is every shot in shadow?"

Shots never looked like this:

5977be316588ee9edcb5010c89eeb2da.jpg

Everyone would be standing in a dark room, with one single area lit up, causing harsh shadows everywhere else, making it hard to see what was going on.

rogue-one-star-wars-story-trailer-still-.08.54-PM.jpg

If they were in the cargo bay of a ship, the door would be open, and a bright sunny day would be outside, but everyone would be standing in the shadows off to the side...

3045427-an1-ff-014.jpg

Every scene... half a persons face completely in shadow....

rogue-one-star-wars-story-trailer-stills-.32.19-AM.jpg

Bright light, dark everything else...

18.jpg

When they're running around on Jedha... everything is lit, except where the characters are running... they are always under a shadow....

One character in this Gif... but in shadow...

maybe-jedha-doesnt-completely-go-boom.gif

It's like taking a photo of your family in a dark room, in front of a large window to the outside... Good luck!


2. Wonabi... (Obi Wan?) - didn't pick up on that name...

3. "He has a friendly face"

f64309e28e.jpeg
*note the half in shadow face*

So the blind guy asks about Cassian Andor... and is told he has a friendly face...

What?!?!?

Was there a single moment this guy wasn't miserable and scowling... Now if he had said that about Han, you could buy it. Han was serious, and angry, but then he would smirk "Trust me!"

"Han has a friendly face..."

Han-solo-princess-leia-smiling-cocky-580x435.jpg

I could buy that... but this dude?

YVC9C.jpg

Do an image search... flip through his scowling, resting jerk face.


One thing I thought I heard... but can't find a script online... and since I can't find anyone else saying anything, I must have misheard... but when Cassian was talking to the rebel at the beginning about the pilot, did one of them say "A friend of Solo's...."?
 
Mood lighting? I assume it's a visual metaphor, a big ominous shadow is engulfing everything (the big murder ball thingy). At least they stayed away from the retarded orange/teal crap we see in almost everything else.
 
robn1 said:
Mood lighting? I assume it's a visual metaphor, a big ominous shadow is engulfing everything (the big murder ball thingy). At least they stayed away from the retarded orange/teal crap we see in almost everything else.
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funny you should bring that up.

On Our Old 70s TV, that had a record player and 8 track in it no less, we had a tint button. I used to have fun pressing it and turning threepio and han different shades of color ;o).
 
NeilT said:
funny you should bring that up.

On Our Old 70s TV, that had a record player and 8 track in it no less, we had a tint button. I used to have fun pressing it and turning threepio and han different shades of color ;o).
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I liked playing with the vertical and horizontal hold.
 
robn1 said:
Mood lighting? I assume it's a visual metaphor, a big ominous shadow is engulfing everything (the big murder ball thingy). At least they stayed away from the retarded orange/teal crap we see in almost everything else.
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Mood lighting is fine... but when you have to search the screen for what to look at, it's not a well lit flick.

And they KNOW it's going 3D, which automatically dims the picture.

Look at Blade Runner... that whole movie is dark, and rainy, but people and faces are lit. It's very clear where the focus is.

blade-runner.jpg
 
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NeoRutty I'll agree that the scenes are dark but I definitely did not have a probably seeing what was occurring what I should be focusing on.

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The Mad Professor said:
Point of Information: Obi-Wan only said that he couldn't recall ever OWNING a droid, which is true based on what we've seen. He never said that he didn't know Artoo.
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I wonder in a Galaxy full of Astromechs how many look like R2? Great question where they kind of dropped the ball on any type of connector.
 
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Maybe crazy Ol' Ben was putting on a bit of an act for Luke, guiding him to help him discover his own path.
If he flipped out, WHOAH MY BUD ARTOO! Wasssssup my little metal man!!!??? Luke would have probably thought
WTF is going on on here? perhaps it was better to let things play out more a mystery for him.
 
NeilT said:
and considering how many droids out there might have the same paint scheme, let alone the same name.
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That's the one problem that I have with droid naming conventions in Star Wars, In a huge galaxy filled with hundreds, if not thousands of inhabited worlds, doesn't naming all droids with a 4 digit alpha numeric designation rather limit the number of each model of droid you can produce? Let's take Artoo, assuming that R2 is his model number and D2 is his "name", then that means you could only make 234 (26 letters X 9 numbers) R2 model droids, that's not a whole lot of R2s for even one planet much less a whole galaxy.
 
Riceball said:
That's the one problem that I have with droid naming conventions in Star Wars, In a huge galaxy filled with hundreds, if not thousands of inhabited worlds, doesn't naming all droids with a 4 digit alpha numeric designation rather limit the number of each model of droid you can produce? Let's take Artoo, assuming that R2 is his model number and D2 is his "name", then that means you could only make 234 (26 letters X 9 numbers) R2 model droids, that's not a whole lot of R2s for even one planet much less a whole galaxy.
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Well, not ALL droids/droid models are named that way. This little dude, for instance is a GNK model:
gonk-tested-12.jpg
However, the point is pretty valid, especially considering the fact that R2 seems to be the model designation ("This little R2 unit and I have been through a lot!") and D2 his "name". If they were to only use a 4-digit naming convention for all droids, there would be literally thousands, if not millions, of R2-D2's in the galaxy.
 
firesprite said:
Well, not ALL droids/droid models are named that way. This little dude, for instance is a GNK model:
View attachment 693945
However, the point is pretty valid, especially considering the fact that R2 seems to be the model designation ("This little R2 unit and I have been through a lot!") and D2 his "name". If they were to only use a 4-digit naming convention for all droids, there would be literally thousands, if not millions, of R2-D2's in the galaxy.
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I'm certain they have longer serial numbers but for God's sake it's a fantasy movie.

"Hey R2-D2- 678865445-5f67785k65433-b64348m88-65211, plot the course for a Hyperspace jump to Degoba..."

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk
 
Finally went for my second watch today, this time in 2D rather than IMAX 3D. I prefer 2D over 3D but I like the immersiveness of IMAX. I got all emotional before the movie even started, the theater paid a tribute to Carrie Fisher, just before the movie they put up a big picture of her and the year she was born and her year of death. Made me go in the movie really weird.
I personally don't mind that there is no opening crawl, but I can't help but finding it off when the movie just starts like it does. This time I tried to pay more attention to easter eggs with the emphasis on tried because I missed pretty much everything. The first time I went saw the calls to General Syndulla and Antilles, I picked up one of the few scenes where the Ghost appeared and a few more things. This time, I really wanted to see that Chopper even though he only appeared for like 1 second, and I wanted to see the other Ghost scene, but I missed it all, though it gives me a good excuse to watch it a third time.
I love the Death Troopers and the fact they don't speak English to each other, though they do seem to speak English. After the X-Wings attacked Eadu I believe one of them said something like "Get up on your feet, Director" which resulted in a scene of them picking up Krennic. I like to think they have a secret way of communicating with each other, like the elaborate system of hand gestures the ARC troopers used.
I really liked all of the characters, in the trailer I wasn't a fan of Chirrut but he ended up being one of my favourite characters. The only character I wasn't a fan of was Saw, though I liked his moment with Jyn.
Overall I love the movie, the start is a bit slow, but the end is godlike. I love all the Vader scenes and his castle, I love CGTarkin and the amount of screentime he got, because I expected it to be shorter than Vader's. The first time I left the movies feeling amazing, though this time the ending made me feel a bit sad because of Leia, gave this bit at the Special Thanks part of the credits a whole different feeling.
IMG_20161229_123302.jpg
 
The talk about droid names made me think of a TV special from late '77, it was a movie retrospective with George Burns and a woman I can't remember reviewing the films of the past year. When discussing Star Wars the woman mentioned R2-D2 and George said "I knew his father, R1-D1". :lol

Found it, Hollywood Out-Takes
 
dascoyne said:
I don't have a problem with Donnie Yen at all. I grant that, this character might not have existed at all were it not for the Chinese market Disney is trying to crack but I thought his character was well integrated and his background enriched the mythology. Regardless of the impetus it's all in the execution and I felt he was executed well. SW has been applying kendo-styled fighting (ANH) and all out wushu (TPM) from the start.

You see, I didn't feel that was true about R1 either. Each character was credible in their role as part of a war movie. If you know that genre (which is all but defunct) you will know that the films were more about the title mission than the individual characters' internal arcs. Have you ever seen The Wild Bunch? There was even less exposition about these characters than the R1 characters. Watch this film with the same eyes as you'd watch The Wild Bunch and you might appreciate what the filmmakers were trying to accomplish.



... or not.
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Never seen the wild bunch so Ill give it a shot. Thanks for the recommendation.

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Safuran said:
Finally went for my second watch today, this time in 2D rather than IMAX 3D. I prefer 2D over 3D but I like the immersiveness of IMAX. I got all emotional before the movie even started, the theater paid a tribute to Carrie Fisher, just before the movie they put up a big picture of her and the year she was born and her year of death. Made me go in the movie really weird.
I personally don't mind that there is no opening crawl, but I can't help but finding it off when the movie just starts like it does. This time I tried to pay more attention to easter eggs with the emphasis on tried because I missed pretty much everything. The first time I went saw the calls to General Syndulla and Antilles, I picked up one of the few scenes where the Ghost appeared and a few more things. This time, I really wanted to see that Chopper even though he only appeared for like 1 second, and I wanted to see the other Ghost scene, but I missed it all, though it gives me a good excuse to watch it a third time.
I love the Death Troopers and the fact they don't speak English to each other, though they do seem to speak English. After the X-Wings attacked Eadu I believe one of them said something like "Get up on your feet, Director" which resulted in a scene of them picking up Krennic. I like to think they have a secret way of communicating with each other, like the elaborate system of hand gestures the ARC troopers used.
I really liked all of the characters, in the trailer I wasn't a fan of Chirrut but he ended up being one of my favourite characters. The only character I wasn't a fan of was Saw, though I liked his moment with Jyn.
Overall I love the movie, the start is a bit slow, but the end is godlike. I love all the Vader scenes and his castle, I love CGTarkin and the amount of screentime he got, because I expected it to be shorter than Vader's. The first time I left the movies feeling amazing, though this time the ending made me feel a bit sad because of Leia, gave this bit at the Special Thanks part of the credits a whole different feeling.
View attachment 693949
Click to expand...

What in gods name did Simon Kinberg have to do with this movie!? :angry That dude is a total hack.
 
karmajay said:
@NeoRutty I'll agree that the scenes are dark but I definitely did not have a probably seeing what was occurring what I should be focusing on...
Click to expand...

I thought the lighting was refreshingly realistic, a nice change from the crap we've seen in recent years. This was a gritty war movie, not film noir like Blade Runner.
 
dascoyne said:
One of the differences between a character like Jyn and Rey is that there is really nothing inherently exceptional about Jyn's abilities. She's not imbued with untapped superhuman force potential nor is she someone whose coming was foretold by ancient lore or even an ace pilot. But that makes her story more human and relatable. Jyn is a tragic child of circumstance struggling her whole life with faith. What makes Jyn heroic is not that she's a "chosen one" but the choices she ultimately makes and her will to do right - even without the support of the Rebellion behind her. Jyn is flawed and broken - just like the Captain. In the end we don't even know that they would be remembered as they make the ultimate sacrifice.

So, yes, Jyn is nothing like Rey. R1 is a different kind of story from the rest of SW. But these are the kind of characters I tend to love the most.
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'

Reading your post, on paper, makes it sound great, and I wish I felt that, but I didnt feel anything for Jyn at all while watching the movie. Everything you just explained here, didnt feel a shred of that during the movie. I wish I did, cause it seems almost all of you loved the hell out of this movie. *shrug*
 
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