Survivor: Fans vs Favorites

I agree with what was said above - Cochran owned that jury and he deserved to be there based on how he played the game. I hate the argument that it was unfair, or low or disrespectful to vote out Brenda after she gave up her win for others to get family time and food. The only way to guarantee you survive another 3 days is to win immunity. If being nice is all it takes to win the game, Survivor would be the most boring show on television.

And here is why I feel that Burnett/Probst were willing to do whatever it takes (read: bend the rules) for Rob so that he could get his million (after 4 tries) and Jeff could finally say he was the best player in survivor history - Erik shows signs of starvation and the decision is made to pull him from the game instead of giving him any nourishment first and allowing him some time to recover. However, Boston Rob shows signs of severe dehydration after a challenge and Jeff allows the medics to give him water and time to recover so that Rob can make the decision that he can continue playing - even though he couldn't stand on his own two feet (if I recall correctly, didn't Russell Swan have a blackout from the same thing and he was removed as well?).

reaper63 said:

I think they film both seasons back to back during the summer. Which would mean Malcolm had done both shows before the first reunion show. They might have guessed at him being a favorite or were just in a jam for the final favorite.

Edit,

Now, not being a fan of Russel, was his back to back appearances in the same tv season (like Malcolm) or was it jan/feb and sept?

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Russell's first season, Samoa, aired Sept. to Dec., followed by his second season, Heroes Vs. Villains, which aired Feb. to May. In other words, the same as Malcolm. Neither man had a break between filming their first and second seasons.

One big difference, though. Malcolm did not make it to the Final 3 in his first season, so he knew he lost his first season when he flew out to begin filming his second season. Russell, however, began AND finished filming his entire second season, BEFORE a single episode of his first season aired. And he was in the Final 3 in both seasons. So he went through his entire second season not knowing that a sour-grapes jury had given the prize in season one to that nitwit-do-nothing Natalie.

The Wook

Great show, Cochran deserved it.

What the heck happened to the finale??

Last season it was only a 30 minute show, this season they only had the jury present and no one else???

Did a bunch of cast members not be able to make it this time so they didn't have everyone there???

What gives???
Lynn

Good points about Rob's dehydration and Erik's.... Erik looked completely fine at tribal. Wonder if Erik even thought about it...


Anyone see any good interviews from today on the net? I can't be bothered to watch day time news shows to catch any of them and my searches aren't turning anything up.

Guri said:

Good points about Rob's dehydration and Erik's.... Erik looked completely fine at tribal. Wonder if Erik even thought about it...


Anyone see any good interviews from today on the net? I can't be bothered to watch day time news shows to catch any of them and my searches aren't turning anything up.

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Erik wanted to leave the game. He nearly rang the bell in the previous episode.

Well before the dizziness--which I don't doubt he experienced--Erik checked outta the game mentally and emotionally. So even if he did recall Mariano's bout with dehydration and the treatment he received to allow him to stay in the game, I don't think he'd care one bit. The dude was starving and wanted out.

Julia, I taped the CBS morning show (whatever it's called), but haven't scrolled through it yet to see if there was any coverage, or a check presentation, or whatever. I'll let you know once I check it.

The Wook

Probst handed Cochran the check during the reunion show. Which was strange since it's normally presented the next day on the morning show.

Interesting points about Erik - I hadn't thought of him WANTING to go, not when he was so close. But I'm sort of betting a lot of people do Survivor for more than the million... and he probably got what he wanted already and it just wasn't worth it any more.

As for the way they changed it, maybe it was just to make it go more quickly and, this time at least, less chance of bringing notice or drama surrounding Brandon?


BTW, does anyone here ever think about applying? My husband wants too every time a show ends. I have ZERO desire to go through the backstabbing portion. I'd love everything else, though. I'm just not competitive enough to want to lie to win money. I'd end up crying like Dawn if I tried, probably. haha!

decaturvader said:

I thank my stars above that CBS/Survivor didn't give that little dirtbag Brandon any screentime during the reunion, nor was it even mentioned.

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Looks like Brandon wasn't even invited to the reunion show. Thought this was a great season. Congrats to Cochran!

Evacuated Erik Reichenbach slams the 'Survivor: Carmoaon' reunion show | Inside TV | EW.com

Guri said:

Interesting points about Erik - I hadn't thought of him WANTING to go, not when he was so close. But I'm sort of betting a lot of people do Survivor for more than the million... and he probably got what he wanted already and it just wasn't worth it any more.

As for the way they changed it, maybe it was just to make it go more quickly and, this time at least, less chance of bringing notice or drama surrounding Brandon?


BTW, does anyone here ever think about applying? My husband wants too every time a show ends. I have ZERO desire to go through the backstabbing portion. I'd love everything else, though. I'm just not competitive enough to want to lie to win money. I'd end up crying like Dawn if I tried, probably. haha!

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Regarding Erik's exit from the game, all I know is what the editors showed us on TV. Which was Erik breaking down mentally in the previous episode over his starvation. He said he was miserable, and felt trapped in the game, like being in a prison, and that he absolutely had to get food. So he climbed that ridiculously tall coconut tree to try to get food, and said in his confessional after failing to reach them, that if only he'd fallen, he'd have broken his leg, and would've gotten to leave the game, have all the coconuts he wanted, and no one would judge him, because he left due to injury.

And then in the finale, just a day or two later in his time, the starvation starts causing dizziness, and he gets medevaced from the game. When that happened, Erik seemed perfectly content to leave. He showed no signs of any desire to stay in the game. The doc made his decision based on Erik's vitals, and all Erik said was, "Okay". Erik had already checked out--the doc's call just made it official.

I've watched every season except the first one (which btw, I'd love to rent...is it available?), and I've seen many people medevaced from the game. Most people are pissed, and loudly protest the decision to pull them from the game, some even break down in tears when they realize their game, their dream, is over. And there are some who want to leave but feign anger and disappointment, saying the "right" things to give the impression that they want to stay. I believe that southern racist nasty gay guy was in this category, as well as Shamar, the nasty black Marine from earlier this season. I'm not saying he didn't get sand in his eye, but that dude wanted out big time. Erik, however, was the first I can recall who wanted to leave but didn't even pretend to want to stay. If Erik offered a single protestation, well, the editors didn't show it to us. And I read that interview R.P. McMurphy posted above, and not once did Erik say he wanted to stay in the game. No, Erik's dire condition was real, but he was completely relieved, IMO, that it earned him a one way ticket to Ponderosa.

To answer your second question, Julia, there's one reason I haven't applied for the show. If I get even just one big bug bite, it drives me bananas. When I see castaways whose backs and legs are COVERED with bites, there's just no way I could tolerate the itching. Other than that, I'd go in a heartbeat. And I'm certain I'd win.

The Wook

Didn't Erik say in the interview (in R.P. McMurphy's link) that he was pretty much delusional by the point he was evacuated? I mean he wouldn't exactly be in a state of mind where he "could" protest even if he wanted to (feigned or not).

At any rate that interview sure unveiled a bit for me. Especially the fact that Erik DIDN'T sit down after Sherri berating him. Just goes to show how manipulative the editing can be.


Kevin

SSgt Burton said:

Didn't Erik say in the interview (in R.P. McMurphy's link) that he was pretty much delusional by the point he was evacuated? I mean he wouldn't exactly be in a state of mind where he "could" protest even if he wanted to (feigned or not).

Kevin

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I don't buy his statement that he was delusional. I think he's trying to save face, because he knows he never uttered a single protestation to being taken out of the game. And I think he lied in the interview when he said he didn't realize Brenda had been voted out. I just went back and watched that TC, and focused on the reaction shots of him that were undoubtedly captured in real time, and he looked completely lucid, and did not at all appear to think Sheri (who was sitting right next to him) was voted out instead of Brenda, whom he waived Goodbye to, for Pete's sake. lol Nope, I call BS on that.

I'm convinced of 3 things: he was sick (his vitals proved it), he wanted to leave (he never expressed a single desire to stay), and now he's making up lies ("I was delusional") to excuse his passive acceptance to being medevaced outta the game.

The Wook

I still think Russel as a player was a crappy player. He did well in his situation because he could bully the people around him, but he never adapted well to new situations and always bulldozed his way through. I think the "Bad Boy" mentality did worked with some but as an overall strategy would not work well and socially he was never in the game. That stung him always at the end of the game and that is the most strategic part of game play.
The same thought goes for Phil's take on the Boston Rob strategy. In certain circumstances such as in Rob's case and for some players it might work but as a general overall formula, it was the circumstance of a specific game and individual players that made it work for Rob.
The game has definite dynamics that change in accordance to the types of characters in the games as well how Phil manipulates the juries to influence future play and drama.
I thought this season was one of the best as you had a considered underdog weak character who worked the group after getting his feet grounded and adjusted extremely well adopting to each weeks situations as they formed. Chocran's game play by far to me was the most intense physical due to his own inherited weaknesses as well mentally challenging game played for a winner ever. He still used the final tactic of bringing useless unworthy players to the end but had to work hard to control the game to the very end. As well it was not by chance, he was manipulating and commenting on each aspect and major play throughout the last two thirds of the show.

Guri said:

BTW, does anyone here ever think about applying? My husband wants too every time a show ends. I have ZERO desire to go through the backstabbing portion. I'd love everything else, though. I'm just not competitive enough to want to lie to win money. I'd end up crying like Dawn if I tried, probably. haha!

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I have always wanted to apply with my brother who looks nothing like me. We would pretend to hate each other and have separate alliances, but always make sure the other was safe from the vote.
Of course, neither of us can take the necessary time off so it remains a concept rather than a plan.

The Wook said:

I've watched every season except the first one (which btw, I'd love to rent...is it available?)

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I do know there was a DVD set released with all the episodes as well as a DVD of highlights and footage that was not aired.

Guri said:

BTW, does anyone here ever think about applying? My husband wants too every time a show ends. I have ZERO desire to go through the backstabbing portion. I'd love everything else, though. I'm just not competitive enough to want to lie to win money. I'd end up crying like Dawn if I tried, probably. haha!

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I did send in a tape, probably back around season 3. several people at work thought the game was made for me lol so they helped me put it together. Didn't get very far in the application process though. Rejected from the show. But I did try.

R.P. McMurphy said:

Looks like Brandon wasn't even invited to the reunion show. Thought this was a great season. Congrats to Cochran!

Evacuated Erik Reichenbach slams the 'Survivor: Carmoaon' reunion show | Inside TV | EW.com

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That interview confirms what we all suspected -they sort of shafted the players this year. It makes no sense. I really want to know the thought process behind it.

The Wook said:

No, Erik's dire condition was real, but he was completely relieved, IMO, that it earned him a one way ticket to Ponderosa.

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I don't know - if he did have an infection in his leg that they didn't treat right away then maybe he was delusional, as he said.

Delirium: Causes - MayoClinic.com

To answer your second question, Julia, there's one reason I haven't applied for the show. If I get even just one big bug bite, it drives me bananas. When I see castaways whose backs and legs are COVERED with bites, there's just no way I could tolerate the itching. Other than that, I'd go in a heartbeat. And I'm certain I'd win.

The Wook

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I've seen that too, but not everyone gets the bites... in the physical aspects of the game, I'd be more worried about sleep deprivation and hygiene than bug bites. (even though I used to be deathly terrified of spiders, I've gotten over it in the past few years)

I am not a nice person when I don't get enough sleep. I can go without food easily, but sleep, I would be a mess.

And being cold and modesty... I would have to bring more to wear than most of the women usually do.

I would soldier up and deal if it was a life/death situation where I had no choice, but to CHOOSE to go into that situation just for money or the challenge... eh, no interest.

My husband can deal with all of that stuff and would love the challenge. It wouldn't be about the money, but about pushing himself.


DBuck - time away from work/family is another consideration... it is a long time.


Ed - You can always reapply! Some contestants did many times before they made it.

Found an explanation from Probst himself: Jeff Probst talks 'Survivor: Caramoan' finale and reunion | Inside TV | EW.com

EW: For the first time ever, anyone voted out before the jury was not invited to sit on the stage for the reunion show. Why is that and why was Brandon Hantz not invited to come to the reunion show?

PROBST: Regarding Brandon, we had a conversation and everyone, including Brandon, felt this was the best decision. Regarding the jury, the main reason was staging. We were on a new stage this year and our design couldn’t accommodate the usual enormous amount of people we have at the reunion. But having done it once, we may do this same configuration again in the future. The truth is, it’s very difficult to manage 20 people in an interview situation, and the staging last night was much more manageable. The hardest part of all of this is that it is so disappointing to the non-jury. I completely empathize with them feeling left out. Like it or not, the priority is for us to produce the best reunion show we can. Quite often when someone is voted out early they just don’t have enough story to warrant a spot on the reunion show. It doesn’t mean they aren’t deserving people, they just didn’t get to play long enough.

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Blamed it on staging and his interview managing abilities. Part of the amazingness of Probst is his ability to handle such large groups of people so well. He's selling himself short.

Just blame the stage, Probst.

R.P. McMurphy said:

Looks like Brandon wasn't even invited to the reunion show. Thought this was a great season. Congrats to Cochran!

Evacuated Erik Reichenbach slams the 'Survivor: Carmoaon' reunion show | Inside TV | EW.com

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I can totally understand why Brandon was not invited to the show and agree with the decision. The kid is unstable and the finale need not turn into a Hantz family delusion fueled tirade. It was Cochran's night and he deserved the spotlight. I didn't see a big deal that the entire cast was not on stage. In prior years most of the losers have nothing worthwhile to contribute and it wastes time.

As for Erik, that guy is hilarious! He's the floater who essentially "got the vapors" (oh lordy) and was removed from the show then had the nerve to lecture another floater (Sherri) about her behavior?? I hate floaters who talk after the fact about their strategy.
Give-me-a-freakin'-break..

I've always said Probst is a great host! If he hosts Survivor for the next 25 years my wife and I will watch!

tripoli said:

I still think Russel as a player was a crappy player. He did well in his situation because he could bully the people around him, but he never adapted well to new situations and always bulldozed his way through. I think the "Bad Boy" mentality did worked with some but as an overall strategy would not work well and socially he was never in the game. That stung him always at the end of the game and that is the most strategic part of game play.

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(Note: This will thrill Guri) From a particular POV, I can see why some think of Russell as a crappy player. In the overall sense of the game, I suppose that is true as Russell was never able to win... but then, I have seen season after season when utterly worthless players who did NOTHING but ride on coat tails take a victory (that one useless girl did it TWICE) solely because the jury voted more AGAINST someone than FOR someone because they are petty and angry and not truly appreciating the game for what it is, but are taking it personally. This game, by design, is intended to bring out the very worst in people and is designed to create drama and chaos. To vote against people who make moves that the games is created for is nothing but being a sore loser... but we have seen it again and again and to me, that plays a large part in why Russell didn't win, although admittedly, he was never very good in final tribal.

With that being said (Guri won't like this part), I don't see Russell as a bully at all, but as a single-minded, unstoppable force of his own will. I have never seen someone who simply wanted things to happen and MADE them happen the way he did. Whatever it took and whatever he had to do (which is the intent of the game), he made what he wanted to happen come to life. The second season was much more impressive than the first because it proved that his strategy wasn't simply a fluke, as I believe is all too often the case with other players, but that Russell was able to do almost exactly the same thing with two entirely different sets of people. I do think you analogy of "bulldozing" his way through is really apt. No matter how unlikely his ability to come out on top seemed, he simply put his head down and pushed forward, right through the people standing in his way, to get where he needed to get. Now, we would all frown on that in the real world, but in Survivor, that is pretty singular and amazing and I have not seen anyone, before or since, who was able to do anything like that. I would love to see someone else come along and run a game like that again.

Art Andrews said:

I have seen season after season when utterly worthless players who did NOTHING but ride on coat tails take a victory (that one useless girl did it TWICE) solely because the jury voted more AGAINST someone than FOR someone because they are petty and angry and not truly appreciating the game for what it is, but are taking it personally.

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Exactly. Too many people win this game (and Big Brother) for this reason alone.

Art Andrews said:

The second season was much more impressive than the first because it proved that his strategy wasn't simply a fluke, as I believe is all too often the case with other players, but that Russell was able to do almost exactly the same thing with two entirely different sets of people.

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While yes, his strategy worked twice, it would only work on the clueless. Remember Russel played back to back. None of the other players had seen his first season. His strategy would have NEVER worked during his second term if anybody had seen his first season, and would certainly never work again, for him at least. That's why he gave up after the second time. He knew his game play was blown. Yes, someone may come along and do it again but they will have the advantage of their main strategy being unknown to their fellow contestants.. Even Boston Rob finally totally changed his game play in order to win (whether the producers helped him or not).

I will NEVER be in the corner that says Russell was the greatest player, never ever.