Rian Johnson to write and direct a new trilogy of films.. (Star Wars Universe)

I haven't re-watched the film since I saw it in the theater, but how do you feel like he "re-created" scenes?

Some re-treads were the reluctant Jedi Master,....twist is he doesn't train the student,.....a Dark side cave where the student goes in to find out more about themselves

The throne room scene actually has almost quoted lines from the RotJ throne room scene.....the telescope to see the dying fleet.....twist is the Jedi weapon on the right side of the evil leader actually does kill him

...and yes the AT-AT/speeder scene on a white planet

The Resistance & First Order are reset to Rebels & Empire

The Falcon entering a red framed opening where things get tight & the dish gets ripped off

EDIT....there were ANH retreads also,....R2 playing Leia’s holographic message,....the dressing up as imperials/First Order to sneak around the enemy base,....done recently in Rogue One also,

When you think about it,....JJ did less in TFA,....just touched on OT themes

J
 
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At the same time, though, there's a core to these works that has to be maintained. As I've said elsewhere, I think Star Trek provides a cautionary tale about how to lose that core and thereby lose what makes your universe distinctive.

So, for Star Wars to remain Star Wars, you need more than just Jedi Knights, rebels, an Empire stand in, dudes in white armor, blasters, lightsabres, and wookiees. You need to stay true to the setting and the spirit of the films, even as you push the boundaries of the types of stories you tell.

I think -- and have thought for a while -- that we need to get beyond Empires and Rebels and their analogues.

Hey Dan ,

Agree somewhat with these sentiments regarding the ‘ core ‘ substance of a Film / Series .
Let’s not forget that Jedi Knights , Lightsabers , Wookiees et al were what made Star Wars - ‘ Star Wars ‘ and not some ‘ Generic Space Adventure ‘ .
I’m honestly looking forward to New Adventures and stories set in the Star Wars Universe ( with its core intact ) , along with the original protagonists only mentioned in passing - if at all , and the hack RJ isn’t helming the project . IMHO he didn’t NEED to make the decisions he did for TLJ ... He Alone purposely CHOSE to !?:facepalm

:cheersGed
 
Hey Dan ,

Agree somewhat with these sentiments regarding the ‘ core ‘ substance of a Film / Series .
Let’s not forget that Jedi Knights , Lightsabers , Wookiees et al were what made Star Wars - ‘ Star Wars ‘ and not some ‘ Generic Space Adventure ‘ .
I’m honestly looking forward to New Adventures and stories set in the Star Wars Universe ( with its core intact ) , along with the original protagonists only mentioned in passing - if at all , and the hack RJ isn’t helming the project . IMHO he didn’t NEED to make the decisions he did for TLJ ... He Alone purposely CHOSE to !?:facepalm

:cheersGed

Oh, absolutely you need those elements. But you need more in addition to those elements. You need the core aspects of Star Wars beyond just the trappings of it.

My point in comparison to Star Trek is that Trek (on film, anyway -- I haven't watched the new show) seems to have devolved into "Generic Space Adventure" + "Visual elements from the old stuff and characters with the same names." The characters don't really behave as the old ones did, or at least not exactly, and more importantly, the soul of the work just isn't the same. There's so much focus on action and ensuring that the films don't get "boring" that they've forgotten what makes Trek...Trek. Or rather, what makes it Trek at its best. It seems to me that they've lost that.

My point with respect to Star Wars is that it's not enough to only have wookiees, Jedi, blah blah blah. You can't just stick those things in a film and have it be "Star Wars" if you also lose the spirit of the films.
 
High SWIQ post.

Thanks!

I think the difficulty comes in identifying what that "core spirit" of Star Wars is. To me, it's something beyond just the structural elements of, say, a plucky underdog military against a vast oppressive regime. Likewise, it's more than just "Jedi vs. Sith" and such. Most of that is window dressing for deeper stuff.

I think the struggle to define this is what lies at the heart of the current tensions within the fandom. For some, TLJ deviates too much from the core spirit of Star Wars. I don't see it that way, although I do see it as a deviation from the core. It doesn't go too far for me, but it does deviate.

I think what illustrates the core spirit of Star Wars is a few things.

First, it has to have some kind of spirit of adventure to it. Star Wars isn't "My Dinner with Andre." It's not a courtroom drama. I mean, you could have a courtroom drama set in the Star Wars universe, but unless it was part of a larger story, that alone wouldn't really be a Star Wars story as much as it is a story with "Star Wars" slapped on it. The nature of the adventure doesn't always need to be identical, though. It could be a commando raid, a heist, a "space western" that takes place on the frontiers, but there's gotta be some sense of excitement to the story and some sense of journey involved.

Second, it should address certain themes of good vs. evil and the choices we make in navigating that duality. It's worth noting that the duality doesn't necessarily mean polarity. You can have stuff that's morally grey. Likewise, with the Force, while there can certainly be a Light Side and Dark Side, I don't see the necessity of erecting some kind of wall between the two where you have to always be on one side or the other of that divide, or forever give yourself over to evil. But at the core, there ought to be moral decisions that characters have to make about whether to do something for the right reasons or for the wrong reasons, and exploring the consequences of those choices as they play out within the context of the larger adventure.

Third, you probably want to involve some kind of mysticism. I don't think this is necessarily an absolute requirement, but it definitely helps with the overall feel of "Yeah, this is a Star Wars movie." The problem with midichlorians was less that it was a retcon, and more that it was something that seemed to strip away the mysticism of the Force and turn it into a matter of biology. You can find ways to kind of limbo or tapdance around that problem (or just say "Yeah, turns out the Jedi were wrong and were mistaking correlation for causation"), but at the end of the day, the Force isn't science -- it's space magic/mysticism. HOWEVER, mysticism can be introduced in other ways, and we've seen some of that in Rogue One (with Chirrut Imwe's mystical abilities) as well as in some external canon stuff like how the Nightsisters of Dathomir relate to the Force and such. Basically, you don't have to be a Jedi or a Sith to use the Force, and you don't have to necessarily use the Force to do mystical stuff (or at least you don't necessarily need to believe you're using "the Force" and may call it something else). Concepts of the Force can be expanded beyond simply what Yoda and Obi-Wan described, too. Personally, I like the distinction between the Cosmic Force and the Living Force, but I think you can play around with the concept of the Force and ultimately determine that it's bigger and perhaps more unknowable than has been portrayed. That need not invalidate what other characters have said, but rather it can suggest that their description is right insofar as it goes, and there may be more beyond what they described or their description may be accurate but incomplete.

Finally, I think the core of Star Wars has to involve the "good guys" being friends or at least having some sense of cameraderie. The characters have to actually seem to care about each other, even if that sense of caring develops over the course of a film. So, sure, do your Star Wars rendition of "Pale Rider," but recognize that your Eastwood stand-in has to convey that he ultimately cares about and will protect the people of the village or whatever. Do your Boba Fett film, but recognize that he has to work with a crew of likeable characters that we get a sense he cares about on some level, even if he remains an amoral mercenary.


You can probably stray from some of these elements, but you definitely cannot ditch them all completely, and the farther away from them you move, the less your film is a Star Wars film, and the more your film is a film with Star Wars decor.

--edit--

Something else that occurs to me is that the film should probably have a spirit of optimism on some level. Even if it ends with tragedy, it should do so with a sense of hope for the future, that this isn't the end, and that things will turn out right in the long run. I think this is one of the areas that TLJ deviates the most from this core. That's not to say that it's hopeless at the end, but rather that you get the sense at the end of "Oh man...they've got a LONG way to go if they're gonna actually win this thing..."
 
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Rian Johnson is now equal to what Damon Lindeloff's work means to me...
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It might have been this. I saw a short quote from here but just discovered the full article with Ram Bergman, Rian's partner, discussing a bit about their trilogy...which, spoiler alert, hasn't been canceled. :)

https://www.fromthegrapevine.com/ar...producer-ram-bergman-interview-new-characters

Not officially no, but Im pretty sure you are one of a handful of people that dont believe it will never see the light of day. I was surprised you missed out on posting this, even though it contains the same solid details as all other reports about this trilogy do, none. Seems that all of Ruins attention is on Twitter.
 
Not officially no, but Im pretty sure you are one of a handful of people that dont believe it will never see the light of day. I was surprised you missed out on posting this, even though it contains the same solid details as all other reports about this trilogy, none.

That's why I didn't bother, the only part I saw was about the"it's too early" quote, which wasn't really interesting. The complete interview is much better though, so thank you for making me search for it. I had been meaning to see if you wanted to put a little wager on wether or not this actually see's the light of day as you seem very convinced it won't.
 
That's why I didn't bother, the only part I saw was about the"it's too early" quote, which wasn't really interesting. The complete interview is much better though, so thank you for making me search for it. I had been meaning to see if you wanted to put a little wager on wether or not this actually see's the light of day as you seem very convinced it won't.

I think thats around the fifth time youve asked that but I`m pretty sure that gambling is illegal on the forum and I know it is in Arizona so I think I`ll pass. You dont really have anything Im interested in anyway. I only posted as a reference for the future.;)
 
If I was ever going to have a bet with you it would have been over your Solo box office prediction, you were only off by around $400 million.

More like $300M. You missed your opportunity because you lack true conviction, something I posses in spades. I'll make it a gentlemans bet, no exchange of anything except pride and humiliation. :)
 
Sure, your a real self proclaimed numbers man.:lol

Chicken. :) But I will reiterate my previous cogent argument why this project will proceed. Rian and Ram delivered their film on time and in budget. It went on to make sufficient money that Disney, and us shareholdes, were happy with the result. Bob Iger didn't expect it to do TFA money, it performed exactly in line with their expectations. Disney needs as much content out of LucasFilm as possible over the next 5 years + to support their streaming service to compete with Netflix and Amazon Prime. Content is King and Disney is willing to pay for it. They were willing to buy Fox for $56B just for their content. It's way cheaper when you own franchises and studios to crank out $200M productions on their own. how do you like them numbers, pal! :)
 
Your such a drama star when you get triggered..lol Pride and humiliation were automatically put on the table when I said Kennedy and Johnson would be gone long before Ep Nein about a week in to THJ thread months ago and my posting of that link today was just a reminder. Enough with your predictions about what Disney are going to do in the future, in that game your only as good as your last prediction remember.
 
Chicken. :) But I will reiterate my previous cogent argument why this project will proceed. Rian and Ram delivered their film on time and in budget. It went on to make sufficient money that Disney, and us shareholdes, were happy with the result. Bob Iger didn't expect it to do TFA money, it performed exactly in line with their expectations. Disney needs as much content out of LucasFilm as possible over the next 5 years + to support their streaming service to compete with Netflix and Amazon Prime. Content is King and Disney is willing to pay for it. They were willing to buy Fox for $56B just for their content. It's way cheaper when you own franchises and studios to crank out $200M productions on their own. how do you like them numbers, pal! :)


I agree... BUT... I could also see - just with the amount of projects in line - that some will be axed as production goes on... Rian's project could be one no matter what numbers or deadlines met...

There was a CG movie that was boarded and I believe had almost completed animation (4 years work anyway) that starred Hugh Jackman (coming off Logan) and Margot Robbie (coming off I Tonya and Harley Quinn Superstar) and it was Killed.

It was WELL into production and they laid off EVERYONE.


How could that movie NOT have made it's money back. It wasn't even a HUGE budget.

Movies are Crazy.

I worry every day about projects I'm on getting shut down - no matter how happy the studio is or which actors have signed on. Fickle.
 
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