Suicide Squad (Post-release)

CutThumb said:

Also ALOT of the Joker/Harley scenes were cut because of some EXTREMELY negative responses. You can guess why and from where. I know, I know, that's how its is in their comics history but these are modern times and whilst its alright to be an empowered, deranged and sexily dressed killer, its not OK that they are the victim of domestic abuse.

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"Modern times" does not mean that you should censor or tame down anything that might offend people. Obviously domestic abuse not okay, but it absolutely can be essential to a story. To not include that because it's uncomfortable to watch is just stupid. It absolutely should be uncomfortable to watch! It's domestic abuse! It isan integral part of the character's history and relationship. That's what made this relationship so interesting and heartbreaking to watch in the animated series and the comics (at least imo). That's what makes these characters deep and 3 dimensional.

And another thing: "It's not okay to be a domestic abuse victim"? I'm sure you didn't mean it like this but that is essentially victim blaming. And being a survivor of abuse does not mean you suddenly lose any empowerment. Try taking a look at the Jessica Jones Netflix series. The whole series is about domestic abuse, traumatic relationships, and how these characters cope and move on and become stronger because of it. And that is some of the best television around today. Shying away from touchy subjects is a disservice to people and to survivors of domestic abuse.

Snikt Listen mate, we get it, you don't like what DC is putting out. You didn't like BvS and kept trashing it, now it's Suicide Squad. They're far from perfect, they have tons of things that need fixing, but they're still enjoyable. Just how hard is it for you to comprehend this ? I found Age of Ultron subpar, and Civil War weaker than what it could have been, yet you don't see me popping up regularly and their respective thread whining about how people can enjoy these movies. For god's sake, let people enjoy them. And don't come twisting my word : I'm not saying you can't like it or be critical with it, it's that sh*tty attitude toward those who enjoyed it that's getting on my nerves, and on quite a few others too I bet.

teragon said:

@Snikt Listen mate, we get it, you don't like what DC is putting out. You didn't like BvS and kept trashing it, now it's Suicide Squad. They're far from perfect, they have tons of things that need fixing, but they're still enjoyable. Just how hard is it for you to comprehend this ? I found Age of Ultron subpar, and Civil War weaker than what it could have been, yet you don't see me popping up regularly and their respective thread whining about how people can enjoy these movies. For god's sake, let people enjoy them. And don't come twisting my word : I'm not saying you can't like it or be critical with it, it's that sh*tty attitude toward those who enjoyed it that's getting on my nerves, and on quite a few others too I bet.

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Well said Teragon!!!!

For starters I hated Civil War and yes, I liked BvS better. There I said it [emoji41]

We get that certain ppl didn't like SS, no need to keep basing it.

Reel

It's so much more refreshing to go into a movie without seeing the reviews beforehand. I saw BvS during the fan screening before anyone could put their opinions out there and it was great formulating my own. But after reading reviews for SS and then seeing it i kept thinking about "oh thats what they meant" "yeah maybe that didnt work". I went back a second time and enjoyed it much more. Never reading into critics minds again before seeing an anticipated movie. It just clouds your judgement because you don't want to be different so you find yourself agreeing with them. Overall liked BvS better but this was okay to enjoyable.

teragon said:

@Snikt Listen mate, we get it, you don't like what DC is putting out. You didn't like BvS and kept trashing it, now it's Suicide Squad. They're far from perfect, they have tons of things that need fixing, but they're still enjoyable. Just how hard is it for you to comprehend this ? I found Age of Ultron subpar, and Civil War weaker than what it could have been, yet you don't see me popping up regularly and their respective thread whining about how people can enjoy these movies. For god's sake, let people enjoy them. And don't come twisting my word : I'm not saying you can't like it or be critical with it, it's that sh*tty attitude toward those who enjoyed it that's getting on my nerves, and on quite a few others too I
bet.

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Exactly. And I want to point out that critically whether it is good or not does not necessarily mean you like it or dislike it.Take something like Requiem for a Dream for example. Absolutely phenomenal film but not something that I necessarily enjoy or would want to see again. On the other hand, something like The Amazing Spider-Man, which maybe did not receive stellar reviews, is a film that I dearly love. Looking at a film emotionally and objectively are not the same thing.

teragon said:

@Snikt Listen mate, we get it, you don't like what DC is putting out. You didn't like BvS and kept trashing it, now it's Suicide Squad. They're far from perfect, they have tons of things that need fixing, but they're still enjoyable. Just how hard is it for you to comprehend this ? I found Age of Ultron subpar, and Civil War weaker than what it could have been, yet you don't see me popping up regularly and their respective thread whining about how people can enjoy these movies. For god's sake, let people enjoy them. And don't come twisting my word : I'm not saying you can't like it or be critical with it, it's that sh*tty attitude toward those who enjoyed it that's getting on my nerves, and on quite a few others too I bet.

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It's like the Ghostbusters thread redux with the same cast of characters.

Snikt said:

No offense to you Mola Rob, but this bothers me. Any idea why they are trashing the DC movies? Its because they arent good. Its not just "an online trend" and the problem with people THINKING that it is, makes the studio think its ok to release movies like this. There wouldnt be a Suicide Squad or half of all these superhero movies if Xmen didnt pave the way in 2000. Yeah, does X1 hold up today? Not so much. X2? Its my favorite one in the franchise. And Im not here to defend Xmen in particular, but DC looks to make cool moments and not a cool movie. The tone of this crap was ALL wrong. I cant believe nobody mentioned this yet. @Rotwang had an almost perfect review/summary of things that were wrong, but nobody had mentioned the tone. The same reason why MoS and BvS were pretty awful. I just dont get how people can "love" this film, when fundamentally it has SO many problems. Its like they want to like it because its a DC property, and I wanted to like it too, because the trailer made it look fun, and the animated movie was great, but man. Its really bad. And what the studio thinks is that they are doing something right because its going to have a big opening, so they will have the same shoddy filmmaking pushing them along. It sucks. I wouldnt have even seen it if I knew Zack Snyder had a hand in it. Im sure as hell not spending money on JL.

And the idea that this group of clowns would even stand a remote chance against Superman, or anyone of the JL members (with the exception of maybe Bats) is a joke. Harley Quinn uses a damn bat for most of the movie. How the hell would she pull her weight in a real super powered fight? :facepalm

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We'll be closer aligned on this one, but I'll still be the light side of the coin, versus your dark I think.

This wasn't a great movie - I have unfortunately a list of things I would have changed, which I won't go into.

However (you knew it was coming) - there is no perfect template for these films - any superhero films. MCU doesn't knock it out of the park every time, but they get it right (for the general audience and the fans) often. I think assuming one way (that all critics are biased) or the other (that people who enjoy these films are idiots) is idiotic in itself.

There are great moments in Suicide Squad, and plenty that will carry through the DCEU to great affect. All three of these films are not bad, at all. Saying they are definitely bad is very short sighted. The GA doesn't have to love a film for that film to be objectively a great film - there are plenty examples of critics loving and audience not being enthused with them. Not even taking into account peoples different tastes, the internal consistency within Man of Steel and BvS is actually high. It stands up to most criticisms that don't come from outside the property (ie. I wouldn't do it this way, thats not how they should be, I hate this interpretation) etc.

And I think this is where Suicide Squad suffers. I think internally the film wasn't as consistent. I've only watched it once, so I'm definitely going to solidify a few moments with a second viewing, but the story idea inherently was weak towards the end. Absolutely won't argue that. I thought enchantress and her brother were rubbish if I'm honest. I didn't even really enjoy the last act with El Diablo. However, I enjoyed his story as it went through up until he started speaking more in that final battle. I actually feel like I could have written those scenes better, and thats a problem. I shouldn't feel that (and I mean that genuinely, not how people suddenly imagine they could write a decent superhero film etc).

I don't like Suicide Squad because its a DC property, I like the moments that Ayer managed to bring to the screen that I really enjoyed, and there were plenty of those. He didn't bring a solid story to the table though, and thats disappointing.

Btw - if people didn't go to see these films and they flopped financially, that would mean you wouldn't get DC films on screen at all - it wouldnt mean that you'd suddenly get a reboot and it'd be fixed. I'd rather each film have the chance to make its way to greatness than have nothing to see at the cinemas (and I sit on the side of heavily enjoying the DCEU).

Also - you're questioning how Harley Quinn can be effective with a pistol and a bat? Therefore you'd believe the same about non powered characters in the comics, and the DCEU, and the MCU etc right? How does Widow fight Chitauri? How does Batman fight parademons? This is definitely one of those examples of you disliking something that is actually inherent in the comics - dont hate to hate chief! In the comics, it isn't usually just a one on one fight - and I don't recall many instances of JL vs Suicide Squad actually. I'm sure there are some out there of course.

I bashed this movie pretty well over the last few months ( see older post in here) It's not what I wanted or think a lot of others wanted either. Especially in the juggalo, sorry I mean joker. I know some said they enjoy this joker. How I don't know other than you must like to go chicken hunting. But everyone to their own and I'm still thinking he isn't the "real" joker. I think there will more to come of this guy later on in the other movies. I could wrong, but don't care really if I am. Just a gut feeling really. I do think they needed to show more abuse between the joker and Harley. It what made them appealing in away. Domestic violence isn't right, but it what their relationship is.

Now, even with all the flaws and I can't believe they went this way moments. It wasn't a bad movie. I have told others to go see it and just watch it with an open mind. Sadly most only know Harley from the cosplay photos and hot topic clothes. So they are getting that merchandise special treatment. So far none of my friends loved it, it was ok to them. They had good time and just enjoy it for what it was. Like most others, they want a stronger film next time.

No way could these fools take on the JL. But if some other badies start showing up. It could get real crazy on the battlefield. JL vs LD

one thing I wished they had shown tho was during the happy dream parts. When deadshot had killed batman. They should have shown Batman with a blown out eye ball smoking socket or half his mouth missing. Cause someone has to think to just shoot his ugly mug in those two spots to stop him for once.

Also the joker had black hair and not his normal green in Harley's dream thingy. Does that mean she never wanted him to be crazy or changed by the chemicals?? If so, he wouldnt be who he is. Unless she dreamed that she cured his mental issues and he got an oil change with George McFly.

jasonsshin said:

"Modern times" does not mean that you should censor or tame down anything that might offend people. Obviously domestic abuse not okay, but it absolutely can be essential to a story. To not include that because it's uncomfortable to watch is just stupid. It absolutely should be uncomfortable to watch! It's domestic abuse! It isan integral part of the character's history and relationship. That's what made this relationship so interesting and heartbreaking to watch in the animated series and the comics (at least imo). That's what makes these characters deep and 3 dimensional.

And another thing: "It's not okay to be a domestic abuse victim"? I'm sure you didn't mean it like this but that is essentially victim blaming. And being a survivor of abuse does not mean you suddenly lose any empowerment. Try taking a look at the Jessica Jones Netflix series. The whole series is about domestic abuse, traumatic relationships, and how these characters cope and move on and become stronger because of it. And that is some of the best television around today. Shying away from touchy subjects is a disservice to people and to survivors of domestic abuse.

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There was some strong feedback that some of the more difficult scenes depicting the relationship between Joker/Harley didn't go down well and were therefore cut.
This was actually a wise decision given that ,according to Box Office Mojo, the film got an A- from the majority of the female viewers.So by downplaying the perception that Harley is a victim in the relationship it appears that it has strengthened her overall popularity.
I actually watched a couple of TV reviews by seasoned critics, who obviously had no knowledge of their story history together, who both raised the fact that the Joker abusing her 'really,really badly' scene wasn't really acceptable cinema. Which is fine excepting as a character the Joker pretty much tortures ,murders and abuses everybody, regardless of gender. Its what he does. And given the body count in SS they singled it out specifically for comment.
I just find it odd that given all that Harley Quinn is and does, this aspect caused the apparent problems that it did. But as I said these are modern times, and as such changing the dynamics for the wider less well comic versed audience makes sense. And WB decided to play it safe by keeping a lot of these possibly 'controversial' Joker scenes out.

Monkey67 said:

Also the joker had black hair and not his normal green in Harley's dream thingy. Does that mean she never wanted him to be crazy or changed by the chemicals?? If so, he wouldnt be who he is. Unless she dreamed that she cured his mental issues and he got an oil change with George McFly.

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I think that was mostly up to interpretation. In my opinion I think that that was how she really sees him. Or maybe that she thought she could change him. I don't know really.

What's not to like ?

Harley is getting her own movie, so they can explore her and Joker's relationship there. That sort of stuff doesn't really belong in a Suicide Squad movie. Its not all about those 2 all the time. Let this movie be about the actual team in the title.

Fawbish - I agree with you a lot on the DC movies up to this point.

Like I said earlier I thought Suicide Squad started strong but ran out of gas and is a very inconsistent movie. Do I think it was a good movie? Not really but it's not the worst I've seen either. I'm not trying to elevate the public perception of DC movies because I read DC growing up I just think the criticism has reached the "mob" mentality level and taken on a life of its own. As to the tone of the DC movies I don't have a problem with them, I don't need to see boy scout Superman or Batman year one again, it's been done already and I don't need to see it again right now. I like the fact they're exploring the effect a man who can fly and is nearly indestructible has on the world. I like the older bitter Batman in BVS who is on the verge of finally going totally overboard and becoming the thing he has been fighting against. I agree that Man of Steel and BvS are highly consistent in tone and are a good beginning.

Just in case anyone thinks I hate Marvel let me say I've enjoyed the crap out of most of the Marvel movies. My point is that Marvel has had their failures as well. I thought the first X-Men movie was dull as hell, I actually like the second one a lot but it's still not the most exciting thing I've seen. Daredevil, Ghost Rider 1 and 2, The Fantastic Four not once but three times (four if you count the 1994 movie), X-men Origins: Wolverine, and Electra are not really good movies but no one said Marvel should stop and never make a movie again.

I will continue to support the DC franchise, I'm sure it will hit its stride. I just wish the studio executives would stop second guessing the people creating the films and let them do their work.

Be prepared to see a ton of little girls in shorty shorts, white face paint and pig tails this Halloween.

annanake said:

Be prepared to see a ton of little girls in shorty shorts, white face paint and pig tails this Halloween.

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If you're just trying to redeem this film it's kinda working.

dascoyne said:

If you're just trying to redeem this film it's kinda working.

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LOL
Personally I don't think it needs redeeming but that's just my opinion , which also includes not really liking any of the captian America movies.
But I don't love or hate SS or the Cap movies enough to go on a tirade either .

While I won't complain about seeing older girls dressed up however they want. I can already hear the parents of young girls putting their foot down on them dressing or rather non dressing up like Harley .
hell the way Harley swung the bat in the movie she should be called Bat Girl .!!!

jasonsshin said:

"Modern times" does not mean that you should censor or tame down anything that might offend people. Obviously domestic abuse not okay, but it absolutely can be essential to a story. To not include that because it's uncomfortable to watch is just stupid. It absolutely should be uncomfortable to watch! It's domestic abuse! It isan integral part of the character's history and relationship. That's what made this relationship so interesting and heartbreaking to watch in the animated series and the comics (at least imo). That's what makes these characters deep and 3 dimensional.

And another thing: "It's not okay to be a domestic abuse victim"? I'm sure you didn't mean it like this but that is essentially victim blaming. And being a survivor of abuse does not mean you suddenly lose any empowerment. Try taking a look at the Jessica Jones Netflix series. The whole series is about domestic abuse, traumatic relationships, and how these characters cope and move on and become stronger because of it. And that is some of the best television around today. Shying away from touchy subjects is a disservice to people and to survivors of domestic abuse.

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I believe Paul Dini's original intent with Mad Love was to illustrate how someone CAN love too deeply, too dependently, and too far. And it can have good and bad consequences. I always love that stories in any medium can tell important themes - and Paul Dini is an absolute charm to listen to on interviews and such.

Movie is at 73% audience approval on RT.

Bryancd said:

It's like the Ghostbusters thread redux with the same cast of characters.

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*GROAN* Oh my god dude. So according to you @Bryancd Im not allowed to not like something, and if I do, you compare me to NeilT and the Ghostbusters thread? I have never had a discussion with more whiny people than I have in this forum. "Oh god dont bash the film, oh no, the poor people that liked it, wahhh" Are you kidding me? If you like the film, great, good for you, but that doesnt mean that I have to understand why you do, because, objectively, it was a poor film. I wanted to like this film. I didnt agree with all the choices they made from the trailers but I thought "hey, let me give this a shot" and you know what? I paid the damn 14 bucks. When you buy something, what do you expect? Do you expect to be satisfied with the money you spent? I sure as hell do, to get some amount of enjoyment? And like I said, I enjoyed the beginning of the movie, then it went down hill at the start of the second act. Its like in order to say anything on these forums you have to sugar coat everything with rainbows and unicorn **** or else you get attacked. It makes me not want to post on here. And of course the ones that gave me crap will be like "good, dont do it then, blah blah blah". Im not bashing the people that like this film. Im bashing the film makers for making a dumb, boring, paint by numbers movie when it should have been a ton better. Why accept an inferior product? Just because they force feed it to you?
@teragon thats the thing, for the price, it wasnt enjoyable. For 14 bucks I would have got more enjoyment from a rack of ribs from the local BBQ place than that movie. Im not even a marvel fan boy either. I like both marvel AND DC, especially Supes and Bats, who the current DC slate of movies is centered around. Thats why Im upset about it. But hey, apparently around here thats not acceptable. :facepalm Its hard for me to comprehend why people like this interpretation of these characters, and the film. I dont understand. Maybe our ideas of whats entertaining and what isnt is the problem. I would rather sit through Ice Pirates than watch this movie again. At least that gave me a good laugh.

Bryancd said:

Movie is at 73% audience approval on RT.

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How many of you, after seeing a movie, post it on RT? Im not even trying to be snarky or anything, Im genuinely asking.