Probe Droid
Master Member
Another vote for nickel over brass.
Graflex Variations: Facts and vs. Replica
- Thread starter scottjua
- Start date
modelcitizen
Sr Member
if by chrome you mean mirror shine like the mpp or a heiland then no, not chrome
Bmkristiansen
New Member
Hello guys.
I'm new to the scene, but I have always wanted a Graflex flash. I almost bought one a couple of years ago, but I passed. After the TFA teasers the prices skyrocketed, and now it's kind of crazy I think. After browsing eBay in the UK I found what I believe was a reasonable price, and pulled the trigger. While waiting I have been browsing both RPF and fx-sabers, along with all the major saberparts company sites. After checking Yoda's Graflex lightsaber origin thread on fx-sabers I had to take a second look at my newly bought Graflex. The thread explains how the bottom end has a patentnumber, and after what I can see on the pictures of the one I bought, this one doesn't. I found this thread and looked through the pictures, and it looks like half of it is genuine, and the bottom may be a replica.
The seller listed it as "genuine", but now I'm not sure. Can you guys help me by taking a look at the pictures in the listing?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Star-Wars-G...vrC9nfxk9x1ip3i4bxCi0%3D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc
The D-ring looks like the one that Parks puts on their sabers. The bubblestrip have 8 heads, with the two at each end cut in half, just like Parks sabers.
Thank you.
I'm new to the scene, but I have always wanted a Graflex flash. I almost bought one a couple of years ago, but I passed. After the TFA teasers the prices skyrocketed, and now it's kind of crazy I think. After browsing eBay in the UK I found what I believe was a reasonable price, and pulled the trigger. While waiting I have been browsing both RPF and fx-sabers, along with all the major saberparts company sites. After checking Yoda's Graflex lightsaber origin thread on fx-sabers I had to take a second look at my newly bought Graflex. The thread explains how the bottom end has a patentnumber, and after what I can see on the pictures of the one I bought, this one doesn't. I found this thread and looked through the pictures, and it looks like half of it is genuine, and the bottom may be a replica.
The seller listed it as "genuine", but now I'm not sure. Can you guys help me by taking a look at the pictures in the listing?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Star-Wars-G...vrC9nfxk9x1ip3i4bxCi0%3D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc
The D-ring looks like the one that Parks puts on their sabers. The bubblestrip have 8 heads, with the two at each end cut in half, just like Parks sabers.
Thank you.
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I don't see anything about the top that makes me think it isn't real. I'd like to see it in brighter light so see the finish. Also the top of the bunny ears pin.
The clamp does look to have somewhat shallow engraving, but I'm not certain. Not enough info for the bottom. I'd like to see the inside of the bottom tube.
Many here own a Parks and would have a much better opinion.
The clamp does look to have somewhat shallow engraving, but I'm not certain. Not enough info for the bottom. I'd like to see the inside of the bottom tube.
Many here own a Parks and would have a much better opinion.
Bmkristiansen
New Member
I will post more detailed pictures of the whole handle, included one of the bottom without the D-ring attached once I recieve it. I have also e-mailed Parks sabers and asked if they recognize it as one of theirs.
That top looks 100% real. Its got the correct wear\corrosion\grime that you normally see on a vintage Graflex. Someone would have to go to great lengths to fake that. The clamp and bottom look pretty good, but I'd have to see better pics to say for sure. I'd say its pretty good odds that you have a genuine Graflex. Congrats.
Bmkristiansen
New Member
Looks like you're right. I just got an answer from Jeff Parks:
"Thank you for your email and patience.
Graflex appears to be real, with one of my conversion kits installed.
Evidence:
1. Patent number on the bottom of the flash.
"My replicas copied the patent pending version and did not have patent numbers."
2. Top bulb clamp has a pressed pin as the hinge.
"My replicas used a custom shoulder screw."
3. Satin nickel finish on button and lens.
"My replicas had a chrome finish.
4. Patina and grime around plug ports and knobs.
"My replicas are much cleaner due to age."
If I can be of further service, please let me know.
Sincerely,
Jeff Parks"
Is this something you guys would confront the seller with if you were me? Or is it a insignificant problem?
I bought the handle thinking the whole handle was vintage and genuine. I paid 155£, which equals about $244. Will it affect the value? This is less than what the handles with patentnumbers in good shape goes for on eBay. I reached out to the seller and he claim's that it was "real" as far as he knew.
I guess it all comes down to what I can live with. I just want to check with you who have more knowledge than me if you have any advice. I guess it still will be a nice piece.
"Thank you for your email and patience.
Graflex appears to be real, with one of my conversion kits installed.
Evidence:
1. Patent number on the bottom of the flash.
"My replicas copied the patent pending version and did not have patent numbers."
2. Top bulb clamp has a pressed pin as the hinge.
"My replicas used a custom shoulder screw."
3. Satin nickel finish on button and lens.
"My replicas had a chrome finish.
4. Patina and grime around plug ports and knobs.
"My replicas are much cleaner due to age."
If I can be of further service, please let me know.
Sincerely,
Jeff Parks"
Is this something you guys would confront the seller with if you were me? Or is it a insignificant problem?
I bought the handle thinking the whole handle was vintage and genuine. I paid 155£, which equals about $244. Will it affect the value? This is less than what the handles with patentnumbers in good shape goes for on eBay. I reached out to the seller and he claim's that it was "real" as far as he knew.
I guess it all comes down to what I can live with. I just want to check with you who have more knowledge than me if you have any advice. I guess it still will be a nice piece.
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I think parks is saying that it only might be his bottom part, with his "conversion kit" being the bubbles and the grips. Post more pics, still a chance the lower tube is real. The top definitely looks real (and parks seems to say so, too)
The only thing he is saying to back up the "not real" argument is that his tubes were without patent number, like this one. That doesn't mean this one is necessarily fake.
edit: what kind of dirt is inside the bottom of the tube? context is great, if it is aged or has scratches from battery in-and-out usage, it is 99.9% real imo.
The only thing he is saying to back up the "not real" argument is that his tubes were without patent number, like this one. That doesn't mean this one is necessarily fake.
edit: what kind of dirt is inside the bottom of the tube? context is great, if it is aged or has scratches from battery in-and-out usage, it is 99.9% real imo.
Bmkristiansen
New Member
You are right. I will post more pictures when I recieve it.
I jumped to the conclusion that the bottom is a reproduction because when I look at the reference photos on the first page of this thread, it doesn't look like the early version of the Graflex with no patent number. The lettering looks (to my novice eyes) too new, and when I compare the spaces between the outer edge and the lettering, It seems like the lettering is closer to the edge than on the original one.
To me it looks exactly like the reproduction.
The fact that the bottom has parts probably from Parks, and that Parks reproduction pieces is so accurate help me lean towards that conclusion.
My suspicion is that some one had a vintage top and clamp and needed the bottom along with the convertion kit, and got that from Parks. IF this is the case, it won't bother me that much, unless it will mean that I paid way more than I should. At this point it's all speculation, and to be honest, I find the investigation a bit interesting - no matter what the outcome is
I jumped to the conclusion that the bottom is a reproduction because when I look at the reference photos on the first page of this thread, it doesn't look like the early version of the Graflex with no patent number. The lettering looks (to my novice eyes) too new, and when I compare the spaces between the outer edge and the lettering, It seems like the lettering is closer to the edge than on the original one.
To me it looks exactly like the reproduction.
The fact that the bottom has parts probably from Parks, and that Parks reproduction pieces is so accurate help me lean towards that conclusion.
My suspicion is that some one had a vintage top and clamp and needed the bottom along with the convertion kit, and got that from Parks. IF this is the case, it won't bother me that much, unless it will mean that I paid way more than I should. At this point it's all speculation, and to be honest, I find the investigation a bit interesting - no matter what the outcome is
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Sym-Cha
Master Member
Until you have it in your own hands .... the bottom might still be genuine vintage ... the way the font are pressed seem a lot deeper than the ones on my Parks :wacko
Another mather is what are your intentions? ... Is this G R A F L E X going to represent a Luke ANH ... in which case you need another set of 7 bubbles and a D-ring i.e. from Roy at wannawanga.com and you're left with an additional hole in the bottom that needs to be covered or filled in ... or if the bottom is genuine and screen-accurate as per ESB, which not many of us own, do you intend to go Luke ESB and replace those bubbles for a new activation board strip and get a Kobold clip preferably vintage, which will cost you even more than the saber :wacko ... and also try to find another vintage red button . . . or is this going to be the TFA in which case you'll probably have to swap those bubbles for an activation strip and get a more accurate replica Kobold D-ring?
By the way ... welcome aboard
Chaim
Another mather is what are your intentions? ... Is this G R A F L E X going to represent a Luke ANH ... in which case you need another set of 7 bubbles and a D-ring i.e. from Roy at wannawanga.com and you're left with an additional hole in the bottom that needs to be covered or filled in ... or if the bottom is genuine and screen-accurate as per ESB, which not many of us own, do you intend to go Luke ESB and replace those bubbles for a new activation board strip and get a Kobold clip preferably vintage, which will cost you even more than the saber :wacko ... and also try to find another vintage red button . . . or is this going to be the TFA in which case you'll probably have to swap those bubbles for an activation strip and get a more accurate replica Kobold D-ring?
By the way ... welcome aboard
Chaim
Bmkristiansen
New Member
Thank you, Sym-Cha!
My intentions is to go straight for a TFA hilt. This because I like the glass-eye lens better for some reason, and because there's already two holes in the bottom. I have ordered a ESB conversion kit, without the second red button. I believe that the Kobold D-ring will either fit or cover the existing holes.
My intentions is to go straight for a TFA hilt. This because I like the glass-eye lens better for some reason, and because there's already two holes in the bottom. I have ordered a ESB conversion kit, without the second red button. I believe that the Kobold D-ring will either fit or cover the existing holes.
If it was £155, that is about what 2-cells are going for at the moment (unfortunately lol) so you haven't lost a great deal. Keep looking for another 3 cell, then you can put a kobold on the bottom and 6 t-tracks and have a "saber set" where you just change the bottoms out to go between ANH and TFA! I'm looking to do something similar with my ESB/ANH sabers.
adiemilio
Active Member
I own a vintage Graflex and a Parks, and what I can tell the top part is definitely genuine and so is the clamp, you can see the G of graflex starts before the stripes and not after. For the bottom when you have it in your hands, if you are going TFA you will have to remove the grips, give it a good clean without any product that will make it shine, the reason is to compare how much brightness the bottom has with the clamp and top, Parks replicas have a more dull finish than a vintage, whatever is being reflected on the chrome will look dimmer on the reproduction piece. That's one way, also Vintage Graflex flashes the interior of the bottom will be chromed, whether a Parks interior only the top part is, having the bottom showing the brass.
This thread is great!! it help me 2 weeks ago identify and get a like new repro Graflex ESB version which the seller was posting as a vintage, from $500 to $230, I messaged with him about the tells and he agreed.
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Sym-Cha
Master Member
@ adiemiIio ... I was not aware the Parks bottom interior is still brass ... I never opened up mine :facepalm ... so good to know this as an additional tell ... and please post some pictures of your G R A F L E X sabers ... also welcome aboard
Please guys post some pictures here or start a new thread of your works in progress ... G R A F L E X threads are always such fun to read because most of us started with Luke's lightsaber
Chaim
Please guys post some pictures here or start a new thread of your works in progress ... G R A F L E X threads are always such fun to read because most of us started with Luke's lightsaber
Chaim
adiemilio
Active Member
Would have never notice if 3cell did not mention, but Yes, at least for parks that is, will have to wait to see what Roman´s version tell is.
Here is what the inside of the bottom is, parks on left. It seems they tried whatever they could to make it less costly, even the weight on the clamp and top body is less, the top body is thicker on the vintage graflex.
Here's the difference in shine, though it will not be so noticeable since the picture is not in daylight and I gave it a little polish with P2000 sandpaper as recommended on another post, I could have polish it more but I have a feeling the chrome plating is thinner than on a Vintage Graflex. Replica Top body on the right with vintage Clamp and Bottom.
And here are my two babies, Replica with the 2nd Red Button. Waiting for the TFA Full Trailer that is probably 2 weeks away to know what kind of Activation switch is used, if it will have rivets on grips or not, and what kind of Belt Clip is used before making more progress.
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adiemilio
Active Member
Had to reply on this one, my dad has worked on the metal industry for more than 30 years, on different kinds of plating and patina finishes, and back when I was a teen with my first Graflex he immediately told me it was chromed, you can tell by certain lighting condition it has a blue like finish, but definitely nickel goes before the chrome.
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