Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Post-release)

If that's the case then they are definitely going to have to differentiate them A LOT more than they have, otherwise it's just lame to have them be the same exact thing, only they had to call them something different because the emperor copyrighted the name and Snokes only real fear is lawsuits.

It's poking holes in a plot where no hole previously existed... Up till now good guy force users were called Jedi, bad guy force users were called Sith... If they now make Sith just the clubhouse name of specific bad guy force users, it weakens things like Luke showing up in Rotj dressed like a Sith (balance), not to mention...

How did anyone know they were Sith in the prequels?

No one ever asked Maul if he was Sith...He was a bad guy force user and everyone accepted that bad guy force user equals Sith.


Now I've said before and still say: if they want to just scrap prequels altogether that's just fine by me. For now, a couple of the movies have everyone assuming that being a bad guy force user and being Sith are the same thing and ending up being completely right about it.
 
Go to Europe - specifically Frankfort. They still use those staircases pretty much primarily. Only things i saw not using them were A300-800's and 747's.

Whenever I exit a plane on those rolling stairs, I always want to shout "The Beatles!!" and be met by cheering fans.

I'm hoping they'll make Snoke seem to be more evil than Palpatine, then at the end of Episode IX we find out he's actually a benevolent overlord who wants peace and prosperity throughout the universe.

Okay, not really, but nobody would see that coming. :D

So....Snoke = Leto II?

If that's the case then they are definitely going to have to differentiate them A LOT more than they have, otherwise it's just lame to have them be the same exact thing, only they had to call them something different because the emperor copyrighted the name and Snokes only real fear is lawsuits.

It's poking holes in a plot where no hole previously existed... Up till now good guy force users were called Jedi, bad guy force users were called Sith... If they now make Sith just the clubhouse name of specific bad guy force users, it weakens things like Luke showing up in Rotj dressed like a Sith (balance), not to mention...

How did anyone know they were Sith in the prequels?

No one ever asked Maul if he was Sith...He was a bad guy force user and everyone accepted that bad guy force user equals Sith.


Now I've said before and still say: if they want to just scrap prequels altogether that's just fine by me. For now, a couple of the movies have everyone assuming that being a bad guy force user and being Sith are the same thing and ending up being completely right about it.

I think it's more that they want to present a more expansive universe than what the PT presented. I mean, realistically, "bad Force users = Sith" is only a thing because the Prequels did it that way. There's no reason you couldn't have bad Force users = any number of other things (e.g., "Dark Jedi," "Fallen Jedi," "Black Knights of Idej," etc.).

So, I don't think they're explicitly "overruling" or "retconning" the PT so much as they're expanding beyond its confines. You could argue that the PT prophecy where Anakin destroys the Sith ends up being accurate. He does destroy the Sith by killing Palpatine and then dying on his own. (Unfortunately, he also killed the Jedi, because there's no equivalent of Tyrion Lannister in the Star Wars universe to warn people about how prophecy kicks like a mule...)

After that, we have new Jedi of sorts, and the Knights of Ren, and whatever else may follow.
 
Whenever I exit a plane on those rolling stairs, I always want to shout "The Beatles!!" and be met by cheering fans.



So....Snoke = Leto II?



I think it's more that they want to present a more expansive universe than what the PT presented. I mean, realistically, "bad Force users = Sith" is only a thing because the Prequels did it that way. There's no reason you couldn't have bad Force users = any number of other things (e.g., "Dark Jedi," "Fallen Jedi," "Black Knights of Idej," etc.).

So, I don't think they're explicitly "overruling" or "retconning" the PT so much as they're expanding beyond its confines. You could argue that the PT prophecy where Anakin destroys the Sith ends up being accurate. He does destroy the Sith by killing Palpatine and then dying on his own. (Unfortunately, he also killed the Jedi, because there's no equivalent of Tyrion Lannister in the Star Wars universe to warn people about how prophecy kicks like a mule...)

After that, we have new Jedi of sorts, and the Knights of Ren, and whatever else may follow.


Yeah, I don't see this as undermining the PT al all. I think if anything it honors what the PT and OT established in regards to the rise of the Sith and their eventual destruction by Anakin. The Sith have been destroyed thanks to self sacrifice, it would suck if 30 years later they are back already. Let's do something new.
 
Well I think the PT utterly failed in explaining exactly what being a Sith really means or why they are so powerful and unique. However, I assume Qui-gon could tell Maul was a Sith via some visual cue or fighting style (maybe yellow eyes are unique only to Sith or something) when he reported to the council that he believed the attacker was "a Dark Lord of the Sith". We know from TPM that the Jedi believed the Sith were extinct but that wouldn't rule out other darksiders. The Sith were just a particularly dangerous and threatening sect (for reasons that largely remain unexplained). Unless lightsabers are solely ceremonial, I assume there was still a practical reason why Jedi carried them and were so good at saber to saber combat. I think it could be chalked up to more than simple training.

The PT introduced the notion of "bringing balance to the Force" and the "chosen one" stuff, which I always thought was stupid because it never made any sense as it was explained. However, I wonder if that could've been intentionally nonsensical. Maybe the Jedi were mistaken and too self absorbed to correctly determine what the prophecy actually entailed. I think that could be where the ST is going with things. The only way there can be balance is to recognize that everyone has a darkside and not banish or ignore it. There can only be balance with equal parts light and dark. Maybe that's what Luke is coming to realize. George had said many years ago the ST would be more philosophical and explore the "shades of gray". Good and evil might not be so black and white.
 
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I told you @annanake :)

Yep don't know what I was thinking ?

If I ever run into someone wearing jackboots and an all black officer uniform who has found Hitlers skull, keeps it on a shrine and talks to it .
Who has his own personal gas chambers built .
Who goes to a Jewish school and wipes it out with a custom built Walter ppk looking side arm.
I will know better than to call him a Nazi .
He is not .
he is the new archetype of dark side practitioners that has emerged to fill the void left by the Nazis demise obviously !


And Kylo's master.
who has Plagueis exact back story of secretly controlling events from the Shadow's for years, same expected physical wound's from surving Palpatines attack, and musical cues but of course is not Plagueis.

Give me minute I'm trying to get this strait in my head.

The writers *came up* with Snoke all by themselves. some have claimed they never even heard of Plagueis before they just happen to write snoke as exactly the same . they then have Ben training to be Jedi but who gets woo'd away by Snoke. is ordered to return to kill all the students. And is now 2nd in command of a rising empire seconded only by a leader who appears as a huge hologram dressed in a black robe.
Those writers presented there ideas.

which make perfect sense if it is the Sith continuing there reign .

But said here is the twist, you're gonna love this even though we completely retold parts of every star wars movie that came before this one to some extent our idea is , wait this is really good !

there not even Sith BOOM fresh and original .

So ultimately what your saying is the wook is right ?!?

They are trying to passed off the same old story as original?!?!?!?

I could accept the circular storyline if this is the same 20,000 year old battle between the Jedi and the Sith .
But to rehash the past story and then try to put your fingerprint on it by changing the name of the Villain's while leaving literally everything else the same is complete B.S.

Everyone keeps saying things like let's do something new . or it is expanding the universe.

but new or expanding is NOT a name change while leaving everything else EXACTLY the same now is it ?
 
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If the Sith are not the only Dark Force users, then the Jedi are not the only Light Force users.

It could be that the division between Dark and Light has more to do with the school of study, methodology and philosophy and not just bad feelings vs. good feelings.

If that is the case, then by destroying most of the Jedi and then destroying the last of the Sith, Anakind DID fulfill the prophecy by bringing balance to the force instead of it being divided into two sects.

I have long thought that rules of taking kids from their parents at early ages, then no marriage or other 'attachments' was too cult-like. And add to that Qui-gons references to the 'living force' that the Jedi council seemed not to be keen on and there is plenty of room for something above and beyond the Jedi 'good guys' as much as there is plenty of ways to use the dark side without being a Sith.
 
If the Sith are not the only Dark Force users, then the Jedi are not the only Light Force users.

It could be that the division between Dark and Light has more to do with the school of study, methodology and philosophy and not just bad feelings vs. good feelings.

If that is the case, then by destroying most of the Jedi and then destroying the last of the Sith, Anakind DID fulfill the prophecy by bringing balance to the force instead of it being divided into two sects.

I have long thought that rules of taking kids from their parents at early ages, then no marriage or other 'attachments' was too cult-like. And add to that Qui-gons references to the 'living force' that the Jedi council seemed not to be keen on and there is plenty of room for something above and beyond the Jedi 'good guys' as much as there is plenty of ways to use the dark side without being a Sith.

Yes, and now it's interesting that the First Order is doing the exact same thing with their recruits.
 
in my opinion the Jedi did not know what the he'll they were talking about most of the time .

The prophecy said the chosen one would balance the force they take it as the ten thousand Jedi defeated the two Sith ????

If it doesn't exist in the archives then it doesn't exist.( opps found it)

If you leave now without completing your training save you're friends you might . but only a fully trained Jedi knight could defeat Vader . ( uh oh weekend warrior Luke Wins)

The list goes on .
 
in my opinion the Jedi did not know what the he'll they were talking about most of the time .

The prophecy said the chosen one would balance the force they take it as the ten thousand Jedi defeated the two Sith ????

If it doesn't exist in the archives then it doesn't exist.( opps found it)

If you leave now without completing your training save you're friends you might . but only a fully trained Jedi knight could defeat Vader . ( uh oh weekend warrior Luke Wins)

The list goes on .

Maybe this franchise just isn't for you.
 
So, I don't think they're explicitly "overruling" or "retconning" the PT so much as they're expanding beyond its confines. You could argue that the PT prophecy where Anakin destroys the Sith ends up being accurate. He does destroy the Sith by killing Palpatine and then dying on his own. (Unfortunately, he also killed the Jedi, because there's no equivalent of Tyrion Lannister in the Star Wars universe to warn people about how prophecy kicks like a mule...)

After that, we have new Jedi of sorts, and the Knights of Ren, and whatever else may follow.

Which is fine, and could have been more dynamic than the PT, IF they do that.

But what you're suggesting is that they are different, which again, could be good.

Unfortunately, that's not what they've been showing. With Hans death they are explicitly showing the new "bad guy" version to be strait up evil. Sith with a different name.

Which, IF that's so, does retcon the PT, since they had absolutely no reason to assume Maul and Siduous were Sith, if other options are available. It also throws a wrench at RotJ, since we've already been asked to accept that becoming one is a direct result of being dark side. (The entire scene of the Emperor trying to bring out Luke's anger, even if its at him... Not to mention Vaders belief that it's too late, regardless of personal desire, as it's not something you call yourself, it's something you are as a direct result of being dark side).

Again... I'm ok with either... Make them fundamentally different: cool! Or make it just a name of an organization rather than an adjective, scrapping some of what happened in TPM: also cool!

Both together doesn't really work though. Not even if we really reeeeeeeeaaaaaaach for It.






And ultimately, the most logical option available is to stop being stubborn about it and have Ren eventually come to terms with the fact that they ARE a continuation of Sith ... Which frankly he pretty much says flat out that that's what he wants anyway.
 
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Maybe this franchise just isn't for you.

Maybe I just don't have to Get the same thing out of it as you !!!!


As long as we are fine with rubbing peoples faces in it ( which I expect) then giving them a kick to keep them down ( the part I don't expect or appreciate)

One
you predicted Hans death yourself early on and the argued the point with me later . why?

And two.
I want to ask you a question that I have kept to myself in attempt to stay respectful .

Didn't you post you were a stock broker who had millions of dollars in his control and highly recommended Disney stocks at one point ?

I could not find the post when I looked through your predictions as you requested but assumed you had deleted it because you realized it sounded arrogant and this was not the place to give stock tips. ( or I just did not see it as there are literally hundreds of pages).

But when I brought up the fact star wars was only helping the massive drop in Disney stock price but not stopping it. you were the only one to respond leading me to believe I remembered correctly.

If not then whoever posted that needs to follow your sage like advice .

Maybe stock broker is not the career for them there blind belief that TFA would cause Disney stocks to rise despite it only being a tiny part of there vast holdings must have cost there clients a ton of money !

See I can be an arrogant so and so too !
 
You're not particularly good at it, though. :) No Disney is up from the 60's to mid '90's. They hit $120 but concerns over subscriber growth at ESPN due to cord cutting has been problematic. Star Wars as a franchise value though has been proven by TFA. New films, theme park attractions, other media, all will be net positives to their earnings going forward after the success of TFA.
 
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You're not particularly good at it, though. :) No Disney is up from the 60's to mid '90's. They hit $120 but
concerns over subscriber growth at ESPN due to cord cutting has been problematic. Star Wars as a franchise value though has been proven by TFA. New films, theme park attractions, other media, all will be net positives to their earnings going forward after the success of TFA.

I agree getting in in the 60's would have been a good idea . and for long term holdings it probably won't hurt .
unless they decide to break up the super corporations like they did last time company's grew this powerful .

But in the last year it is down
And the ol' Axum of buy low sell high works better than buy high and hope it goes higher .:-$
 
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The S&P 500 was down almost 10% year to date at one point. When you have to sell, you sell your winners too. If you would like to know more call my office 480-443-5725. It's too much to explain and this isn't the venue.
 
The S&P 500 was down almost 10% year to date at one point.
When you have to sell, you sell your winners too. If you would like to know more call my office 480-443-5725. It's too much to explain and this isn't the venue.
I agree it is not which is why I did not bring up the post earlier.
thanks for the invite as well but I'm doing fine.

While I enjoying the excuses about Disneys short term drop why did you disagree with me about Han yet when I look at your early predictions you totally called it ?

Plus still have not heard anything that makes me believe the whole Plagueis thing is impossible . after hundreds of years of following that ancient hokey religion he could decide to try his own thing.
Or Kylo's completed training brings him into the Sith order .
Or neo Sith I guess
And if you rermermber my whole point was not that he IS ( although I think I talked myself into it) but that it was not impossible like some keep touting .
 
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And if you stop quoting my and the like I will disappear into obscurity for a year or more because I have said my piece and nothing will be known until then anyway.
i also have no real opinion about Rogue other than I hope it is a good flick .

And you won't have to hear my blatant disregard of your opinions LOL .

P.S. it is not looking good for half price drinks at sonic tomorrow in Arizona .
 
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