Well, the answer is in the facts. The two biggest films of all time were released in Dec. The reason Dec. is likely better then May? You don't set box office records selling tickets to kids, you do so selling tickets also to women and families. That's why Avatar and Titanic reign supreme, the demographics were very broad. Dec. provides a very family oriented time of the year. The numbers don't lie. I think TFA has been crafted to have that kind of broad appeal. I'm very happy they have a strong female co-lead. From the spoilers I have read this film has a lot of heart and I hope that will bring in more then just the young male demo.
Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Pre-release)
- Thread starter Warpaint
- Start date
Well, the answer is in the facts. The two biggest films of all time were released in Dec. The reason Dec. is likely better then May? You don't set box office records selling tickets to kids, you do so selling tickets also to women and families. That's why Avatar and Titanic reign supreme, the demographics were very broad. Dec. provides a very family oriented time of the year. The numbers don't lie. I think TFA has been crafted to have that kind of broad appeal. I'm very happy they have a strong female co-lead. From the spoilers I have read this film has a lot of heart and I hope that will bring in more then just the young male demo.
JD: You are talking utter rubbish now.
Film production these days is incredibly fast, thanks to alot of digital software designed by the people who worked for Lucasfilm. Although the development of " Jurassic World" was an incredibly lengthy process ,principle photography started April 2014 and ended August 2014. So that's just over nine months before it was released!! These fast turn around times with effects heavy films are not unusual at all. TFA is, by all accounts, very well forward and has been anything but rushed.
The debate about the pickups has been whether its just additional footage to help extend Mark Hamils appearance at the end of the film, which was reportedly briefer than fans might have liked and so has since been lenghtend or whether its a deliberate refilming of a key scene,due to possible script secrecy. But the film itself is apparently in a fairly healthy state of completion, thanks to the vast amounts of digital effects data already stored at ILM. Extra filming at this stage is more the norm these days than not
The December release date was totally the result of Disney Marketing whose product strategy for TFA and Star Wars line product released in time for Xmas 2015 is enormous. They are looking for BILLIONS worldwide, not just from TFA, but from re-releases of OT product, Rebels etc. It will kick in from September, and the release of information about TFA is timed to hit the peaks of interest from retailers and the public precisely .Most of the product is already manufactured and ready for release.
The Disney Corporation is a brilliant marketing strategist and they are looking to clean up at the cinema and RETAILING stores this Christmas. THATS why this film is being so carefully and cleverly handled.
So please stop this "trolling" for attention. You haven't a clue and you are starting to sound a bit foolish.
Film production these days is incredibly fast, thanks to alot of digital software designed by the people who worked for Lucasfilm. Although the development of " Jurassic World" was an incredibly lengthy process ,principle photography started April 2014 and ended August 2014. So that's just over nine months before it was released!! These fast turn around times with effects heavy films are not unusual at all. TFA is, by all accounts, very well forward and has been anything but rushed.
The debate about the pickups has been whether its just additional footage to help extend Mark Hamils appearance at the end of the film, which was reportedly briefer than fans might have liked and so has since been lenghtend or whether its a deliberate refilming of a key scene,due to possible script secrecy. But the film itself is apparently in a fairly healthy state of completion, thanks to the vast amounts of digital effects data already stored at ILM. Extra filming at this stage is more the norm these days than not
The December release date was totally the result of Disney Marketing whose product strategy for TFA and Star Wars line product released in time for Xmas 2015 is enormous. They are looking for BILLIONS worldwide, not just from TFA, but from re-releases of OT product, Rebels etc. It will kick in from September, and the release of information about TFA is timed to hit the peaks of interest from retailers and the public precisely .Most of the product is already manufactured and ready for release.
The Disney Corporation is a brilliant marketing strategist and they are looking to clean up at the cinema and RETAILING stores this Christmas. THATS why this film is being so carefully and cleverly handled.
So please stop this "trolling" for attention. You haven't a clue and you are starting to sound a bit foolish.
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Well said.
JD
Master Member
LOL :lol :facepalm Only one is an undisputed record holder - 3 out of the top 10 are winter releases. How is this even a debate? Because 1/3 of the top movies did extremely well? Now you're just arguing to hear your own voice.
Bryan - you're huge proponent of rumors/spoilers. You use, quote and allude to those rumors (spoilers are rumors until proven otherwise) all the time... I'm not making the case that Disney isn't happy, I'm merely saying what's out there from established sources. Since you're so 'in the know' you should already be aware of Disney not being happy about not getting their May release.
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And I am telling you based on the totality of their plans for STAR WARS that is not the case. May was off the table very early in production once the Arndt treatment was jettisoned. In regards to merchandising, that could have been ramped up but they are sighing with relief that they didn't get product stuck in the LA port dock work slowdown. So is Hasbro, another company I own and follow. That would have been devastating to their on the shelves merchandise for May 2015. Having a Dec. release dovetails perfectly with merchandising. The conflict with Avengers would have forced a change of that release date which would have been very problematic in regards to that films merchandising efforts. The only reason they had pencilled in May was tradition as SW invented that summer release date. I have listened to all of Bob Iger's conference calls with analysts discussing the film. They recognized the issues with May and adjusted accordingly.
JD
Master Member
Oh dear... we can't come up a real discussion so we attack - who is the troll?
You talk quite about about TFA not being rushed during production. I talk about TFA (possibly) being rushed during pre-production. (But, you'll conveniently ignore that so that you can call people names).
I talk about JJ being brought in after initially declining and Vaughn and Bird's not taking the director's job. I also mention that Arndt's was heavily involved, already had a treatment and working on a script - that Disney was reportedly very happy with. I also mention that this movie was already delayed from May until December - and that JJ and Kennedy wanted to push it back even further. It's also not unreasonable to think that Disney Marketing has a lot of pressure on production of this film. I'm sure there are real reasons they wanted to do this. It's very reasonable to think that some aspects of this movie have been or are being rushed.
So please: educate yourself.
Brad Bird turned down TFA because he already had committed to Tomorrowland and Clooney had signed. It had ZERO to do with the script. And Vaughn's involvement has never been verified and he is still in the running potentially for a SW film.
http://www.cinemablend.com/new/Brad-Bird-Said-Star-Wars-Episode-VII-Here-Why-67696.html
http://www.cinemablend.com/new/Brad-Bird-Said-Star-Wars-Episode-VII-Here-Why-67696.html
JD
Master Member
As CutThumb infers in his post, they can rush out the toys and they can develop their strategies and produce things quite fast. They had plenty of time to get that ball rolling... Mr. Thumb also says "Most of the product is already manufactured and ready for release" - now, I don't pretend to know if that's true, but it certainly seems it was possible, had production gone completely as planned, had they stayed with the May target date.
Please provide some proof that December 18th was decided on due to the Avatar and Titanic success.
JD
Master Member
I don't think I said anything contrary about Bird.
I know Vaughn was rumored to have been offered this movie. Since so many refer to rumors here as fact - after I posted that Vaughn's involvement was rumored, I included it other posts with the idea that this was based on that rumor.
Now you are scrambling! I provided proof that your idea that a May release date would be financially superior was WRONG. It is not coincidental they chose Dec. 18th, nor was it that Avatar and Titanic picked that date, it's a proven time slot that works well with the holiday schedule. In regards to toys and Hasbro, they do struggle with production demands in China as well as getting product to stores. Hasbro was VERY relieved to not have to try and deliver Avengers and TFA product in May. They now have a comfortable lead time and Disney has created a very tightly orchestrated product release cycle beginning in September with books and toys, moving to games in Nov.
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But you framed his not becoming involved int he film as part of your theory the films production has been problematic. That's on you. By the way, you know I don't think you are a troll, but you are trying to drive home some points that are missing the mark.
Riceball
Master Member
I'm with JD on this one, Summer is the traditional blockbuster session for movies, that's when studios like releasing all of their big, effects laden action flicks. Traditionally, Winter is good family fare and/or things they don't want competing with all of the other big Summer blockbusters. As JD says, while there are exceptions to this rule they are just that, exceptions.
Even though Disney may have originally wanted a May release I do think that that may have been blown out of proportion with a lot of fans obsessing over the idea of a May 4th release and how cool that would be. I'd imagine that one thing that serves as a consolation to Disney about a Dec release will be the general lack of competition. Who's going to want to release some modest family friendly movie at the same time Star Wars comes out? While there will almost certainly be movies released the same day and the week after TFA comes out, most studios still most likely sold releasing anything they hope will do well right before and for at least 2 weeks after the release of TFA.
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Even though Disney may have originally wanted a May release I do think that that may have been blown out of proportion with a lot of fans obsessing over the idea of a May 4th release and how cool that would be. I'd imagine that one thing that serves as a consolation to Disney about a Dec release will be the general lack of competition. Who's going to want to release some modest family friendly movie at the same time Star Wars comes out? While there will almost certainly be movies released the same day and the week after TFA comes out, most studios still most likely sold releasing anything they hope will do well right before and for at least 2 weeks after the release of TFA.
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The plan seems to be to try and put Episode 8 back into May of 2017 and I have to go and check when the next Avenger film is scheduled. Once they have the product pipeline properly working, they will have a lot of flexibility with the main series films and the Anthology films released dates. And I agree the May date was really a fan driven desire more then an economic one.
JD
Master Member
You were the one that said his post was "well said" - not me. I find it odd that China can struggle with production demands... but, a movie production can't have similar issues?
You have provided zero proof that a winter release is financially superior or that a summer release isn't the preferred release date for these blockbuster films. Like I've said 7/10 of our top grossing films are not winter releases. Historically, the blockbusters are released in the summer... we can point to Avatar, Titanic and Lord of the Rings and a few others as successful December/winter releases - they have had great success; but, that doesn't mean summer isn't the bigger movie season.
I'm sure LFL and Disney did lots of research into the December 18th date and many factors went into it. Did Avatar/Titanic play a factor? Sure (I'd wager Avatar more than Titanic).. but, I think other movies coming out at this time had just as much (if not more of) a factor.
I think Bird being offered and refusing to direct show some delay in the pre-production of the film - nothing more, nothing less. Had he accepted when offered, production might be a little further along... or possibly already been release.
Let's be honest with ourselves. It doesn't matter one iota of anything when this movie comes out. It will break every record out there regardless. There will be countless people that will see this movie 10 times before the first box office figures are even released
The summer is not prime time for selling much other than outdoor toys and "Jurassic World" was already tipped as being reasonable competition in the market place way back when its release date was estabished. Thats why all the major players do it, it is ALL about marketing. Just google the amount of stuff out there for Jurassic World. That, the summer holiday costs which traditionally affects family spending and the general lack of ANY Christmas competition in 2015 made moving the release date an absolute no brainer for everybody.It also gave the manufacturers a pretty good lead time to complete the orders placed by retailers at trade shows in the spring of 2015 for Xmas 2015 and they are have placed very healthy orders indeed apparenty . Star Wars The Force Awakens is set to dominate the market this Christmas in every conceivable way you and Disney can think of. This is one of the biggest promotions tied to a film franchise ever!!!
There were also a large number of "filler" novels and comics that could only have been written and readied for release by autumn, once the TFA script was finalized (which is why if you check all Amazons release dates you'll see what I mean). There is no way the authors could complete them any earlier or for them to be satisfactorily marketed by the May release date.
The May date would also have meant a fair amount of decreased interest by the Christmas 2015 interms of product release, which will be boiling with the later date. Many will buy the early released product JUST so they can glean a few more extra clues as to what happens in the film. And remember many of the Jurassic Worlds "secrets" were leaked via toy product.
And" Avengers: Age of Ultron" was already scheduled for the spring 20,15 and at well over a billion plus I see no reason why Disney would be upset by JWs stellar returns, with "Ant Man" yet to come.
Whilst I am hugely impressed by Disneys and Lucasfilms overall strategy and thinking around TFA I am far less taken with all the reasoning and "facts" as you present them JD.
There were also a large number of "filler" novels and comics that could only have been written and readied for release by autumn, once the TFA script was finalized (which is why if you check all Amazons release dates you'll see what I mean). There is no way the authors could complete them any earlier or for them to be satisfactorily marketed by the May release date.
The May date would also have meant a fair amount of decreased interest by the Christmas 2015 interms of product release, which will be boiling with the later date. Many will buy the early released product JUST so they can glean a few more extra clues as to what happens in the film. And remember many of the Jurassic Worlds "secrets" were leaked via toy product.
And" Avengers: Age of Ultron" was already scheduled for the spring 20,15 and at well over a billion plus I see no reason why Disney would be upset by JWs stellar returns, with "Ant Man" yet to come.
Whilst I am hugely impressed by Disneys and Lucasfilms overall strategy and thinking around TFA I am far less taken with all the reasoning and "facts" as you present them JD.
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We're practically guaranteed another "biggest movie of all time" every few years. It's meaningless.
The human population keeps growing
There is ongoing currency inflation in lots of western countries.
Movie ticket prices are arguably going up even aside from inflation.
Greater IMAX & 3D ticket prices are driving up earnings too.
The human population keeps growing
There is ongoing currency inflation in lots of western countries.
Movie ticket prices are arguably going up even aside from inflation.
Greater IMAX & 3D ticket prices are driving up earnings too.
JD
Master Member
For the sake of clarity and trying to shed some of the drama that's attached itself to this...
I think some of the plot elements (either that we've seen or that's rumored) of TFA are kinda weak. You can disagree about that all you want - that's my opinion on it.
I think evidence suggests that some aspects of TFA (mostly pre-production) were rushed. There is also ample evidence to support that Disney JJ/Kennedy wanted to push TFA to May 2016 - Disney was locked on December 2015.
- JJ turned down the directors job initially. Brad Bird turned it down, Matthew Vaughn is rumored to have turned it down.
- Michael Arndt was hired - he worked on a treatment and was rumored to be working on the script. Disney was reportedly very happy with his work.
- JJ took the job, Arndt was let go.
- JJ and Kasdan took up writing duties.
Does this mean that things were rushed? Not outright. However, it's not hard to see how it may have possibly rushed pre-production - these thing's take up valuable time while doing work on a movie - this is time that could have been spent developing a (potentially) better plot (or course it could also have been a worse plot).
I think some of the plot elements (either that we've seen or that's rumored) of TFA are kinda weak. You can disagree about that all you want - that's my opinion on it.
I think evidence suggests that some aspects of TFA (mostly pre-production) were rushed. There is also ample evidence to support that Disney JJ/Kennedy wanted to push TFA to May 2016 - Disney was locked on December 2015.
- JJ turned down the directors job initially. Brad Bird turned it down, Matthew Vaughn is rumored to have turned it down.
- Michael Arndt was hired - he worked on a treatment and was rumored to be working on the script. Disney was reportedly very happy with his work.
- JJ took the job, Arndt was let go.
- JJ and Kasdan took up writing duties.
Does this mean that things were rushed? Not outright. However, it's not hard to see how it may have possibly rushed pre-production - these thing's take up valuable time while doing work on a movie - this is time that could have been spent developing a (potentially) better plot (or course it could also have been a worse plot).
JD
Master Member
The May release of the Star Wars prequels put a serious dent on their toy sales - Lucas and his family practically starved because toy sales weren't what they had hoped for.
Episode 8 and 9 are both slated for a May release. Is Disney looking to move Christmas to early June in 2017?
JW strong opening shows Disney that the May 2015 was a winning date - whereas, December - still a very likely success - could have issues (weather, economy, etc).
You can have your issues with me - but facts are facts.
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The international market is also a much bigger player now than it has been - I don't know if that's reached it's peak or if that may continue to grow. Seeing that China just got the old SW movies, I'm guessing there is yet another market for SW to capitalize on.
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