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    3 Weeks Ago  Jun 4, 2017, 5:23 PM - A theory on the ESB hero graflex pics intensive #1

    When I finally got my hands on my vintage graflex 3 cell I had to make a replica of Luke's ESB lightsaber. Empire has always been my favorite movie so off to the RPF for help in building my own replica. Wow what a challenge. Screws vs rivets, ranch saber.... and screen grabs of scenes from the movie with grips with no cut outs black screws,shinny screws, broken grips.... and some curious anomalies that I feel I had to replicate for me to get the best possible replica I could make. So let's begin with those anomalies that I have found. First up did the ESB saber use the clamp screw? Here is a picture of the prop that I think shows it being there. So I left my clamp screw on my replica. Now moving on to the grips. I read that during filming the grips were coming off due to the cold temperatures during filming. Screws or rivets were added to keep them on. The only existing source we have is the ranch saber. And it does use Phillips head screws at the cutouts and some type of flat head screw at the top of the grips. To me this makes since that these were added to keep them on. I have found a few neat pics online and I take no credit for these as mine but only for evidence supporting my theory. Again we look at the clamp screw pic. I have added red markings to identify what I believe to be the top grip screws like what appears on the ranch saber. Also a template for the ESB saber showing the top grip screws countersunk with the grips so they sit flush. I decided on my build I would include all these little details that may or may not be there but to me it makes since. I took pics of my replica about a foot away from the camera and if you weren't looking you would never know they were there.
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  2. Member Since
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    3 Weeks Ago  Jun 4, 2017, 8:11 PM - Re: A theory on the ESB hero graflex pics intensive #2

    Another thing that may support my theory is the vader mom rotj saber. Looking at it it also has the grip holes by the clamp because they can be seen peaking out of the 7 grips when the esb six were removed. I made a replica of this saber as well using a vintage top section that was badly scratched..... that's why it's so weathered lol.
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  3. halliwax's Avatar
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    3 Weeks Ago  Jun 4, 2017, 9:54 PM - Re: A theory on the ESB hero graflex pics intensive #3

    hey revan. i have been researching this topic for a long time. I'm trying to prove that the ranch saber is the wampa cave, and dagobah saber. after spending hundreds of hours looking over the screen captures, and pictures of the ranch saber that pop up here and with a google search. the grips looks the same, in fact there is 1 grip ( i call it grip 2 ) that has a dent that i think matches perfectly on the ranch saber.

    i so strongly believe if the texture tape was removed off the clamp a black slot headed screw would be there.

    i can't say I've ever seen the small black screws on the t track on screen captures. we know the vader saber (casino no prop store) today has the same small black screws in the grip, but during filming it did not.

    i think the black screws were added later after filming just to safely secure the grips.

    those small black screws you have found look amazing!! do you have a picture of them out of the grip? to show the profile and length? I think you ESB saber is coming along great, keep up the good work!

    as for why the screws were added into the graflex for ESB there is no official explanation, but a lot of great theories that have come up on here. and what you've posted from your research i truly believe as well, cold weather, grips popped off, add some screws!
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    3 Weeks Ago  Jun 4, 2017, 10:34 PM - Re: A theory on the ESB hero graflex pics intensive #4

    These are gun screws I found at my local ace hardware. They are pretty long so I cut them to fit in the graflex bottom section. They are about as think as the track so that's why I countersunk them. They look identical to the ones on the ranch saber in my opinion. Here are some pics
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    3 Weeks Ago  Jun 4, 2017, 10:40 PM - Re: A theory on the ESB hero graflex pics intensive #5

    If you notice in my pics of my saber you would never know they were there. Lighting pays a huge part in hiding them as,well as them being black and countersunk. To me it makes since that they were there since other props had them as well. I really like the look they give too. I tried to replicate everything that I could.. even denting my kobold lol
  6. halliwax's Avatar
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    3 Weeks Ago  Jun 4, 2017, 10:52 PM - Re: A theory on the ESB hero graflex pics intensive #6

    gun screws I'm going to have to check see if i can find them. i too like the small screws
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    3 Weeks Ago  Jun 4, 2017, 10:55 PM - Re: A theory on the ESB hero graflex pics intensive #7

    Yep let me know if you can't find them I can get you some if you cant. I still think they were there just hidden by lighting and camera angle lol
  8. SethS's Avatar
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    3 Weeks Ago  Jun 4, 2017, 11:57 PM - Re: A theory on the ESB hero graflex pics intensive #8

    The "R2 bump" pic when lightened in photoshop shows the clamp screw.
  9. Member Since
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    3 Weeks Ago  Jun 5, 2017, 12:01 AM - Re: A theory on the ESB hero graflex pics intensive #9

    Hey SethS can you post a pic of it?
  10. Sym-Cha's Avatar
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    2 Weeks Ago  Jun 5, 2017, 5:09 AM - Re: A theory on the ESB hero graflex pics intensive #10

    Nice ESB lightsaber REVANSSkywalker and welcome aboard ... did you just missed to add the silver short 'fingers' in your activationbox strip? ... If so you can either use paint or silver solder. Nice Vader ROTJ Stunt too

    Cha´m
  11. halliwax's Avatar
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    2 Weeks Ago  Jun 5, 2017, 7:04 AM - Re: A theory on the ESB hero graflex pics intensive #11

    SethS said: View Post
    The "R2 bump" pic when lightened in photoshop shows the clamp screw.
    Get out of here!!! Do u happen to have a picture?!


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
  12. mortifactor's Avatar
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    2 Weeks Ago  Jun 5, 2017, 7:39 AM - Re: A theory on the ESB hero graflex pics intensive #12














    Not my pics originally, but did the notes and used these pics when I did my Luke ESB

    They are from a publicity shoot, and the hallway bespin scene.

    I think they are the same saber as the small black clamp screw is visible. I am not sure why one grip appears broken in one of the shots though.

    One of those pics is a very high res (considering what is available) shot of the grips and I don't see any screws - I thought about it myself when I was building, but went against it based on the pic.

    Can't identify the clamp screw but I used a small, black machine bolt similar to those gun ones you used.


    I thought the screws/rivets on the grips had to be black due to the way the light hits them. I got my black screws to look shiny and almost silver under strong lighting, but in the pointed out pics you can see where the light isn't directly on the screw/rivet and they look dark. They definitely appear black in the bespin scene IMO, but maybe just darkened silver in the promo pics. Perhaps they aren't the same saber.
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    2 Weeks Ago  Jun 5, 2017, 8:21 AM - Re: A theory on the ESB hero graflex pics intensive #13

    Do you think they could of just painted the original clamp screw black? Trying to find a black one that fits the square nut inside the the top section would be hard. Time to break out the paint lol
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    2 Weeks Ago  Jun 5, 2017, 8:31 AM - Re: A theory on the ESB hero graflex pics intensive #14

    I did miss the silver strip lol. Now to find another one!!!!
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    2 Weeks Ago  Jun 5, 2017, 8:38 AM - Re: A theory on the ESB hero graflex pics intensive #15

    Just curious....does anyone know where these two pics came from? I got these off of Google and who ever did these included the top grip screws.
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  16. halliwax's Avatar
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    2 Weeks Ago  Jun 5, 2017, 8:44 AM - Re: A theory on the ESB hero graflex pics intensive #16

    Revan with all respect to who ever made those they are out of date. I would use Roys prints that he has on wannawanga as they are the most recent and give excellent measurements


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  17. halliwax's Avatar
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    2 Weeks Ago  Jun 5, 2017, 8:49 AM - Re: A theory on the ESB hero graflex pics intensive #17

    mortifactor said: View Post
    https://c1.staticflickr.com/6/5572/1...80e8a895_b.jpg




    https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3831/1...8f259d8045.jpg

    https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/400/19...b05979da_b.jpg

    https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/509/19...26bb083b_o.jpg



    Not my pics originally, but did the notes and used these pics when I did my Luke ESB

    They are from a publicity shoot, and the hallway bespin scene.

    I think they are the same saber as the small black clamp screw is visible. I am not sure why one grip appears broken in one of the shots though.

    One of those pics is a very high res (considering what is available) shot of the grips and I don't see any screws - I thought about it myself when I was building, but went against it based on the pic.

    Can't identify the clamp screw but I used a small, black machine bolt similar to those gun ones you used.


    I thought the screws/rivets on the grips had to be black due to the way the light hits them. I got my black screws to look shiny and almost silver under strong lighting, but in the pointed out pics you can see where the light isn't directly on the screw/rivet and they look dark. They definitely appear black in the bespin scene IMO, but maybe just darkened silver in the promo pics. Perhaps they aren't the same saber.
    The reason I have to say there is no screws is. We have a good picture of vaders saber with out screws during filming.

    So now if Luke's grips fell off because of the cold and they used Screws to hold them on (including the small black screws)

    What is the chance the crazy prop department has the same exact (matching black) screws after filming to put on vaders

    I just find it hard to believe. This is why I'd love to see what Seth has.

    On a personal note I love the touch of the little black screws but if they don't have them on in the wampa scene I don't want to add them

    I'm hoping for little black screws


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    2 Weeks Ago  Jun 5, 2017, 9:07 AM - Re: A theory on the ESB hero graflex pics intensive #18

    Roys template was used for my grip measurements they are 10mm from the bottom with a 8 mm gap. For some reason I still think they are there lol. I just love the look of them I guess. If I'm wrong I'm wrong but to me it makes since. Even though those are old at one time some one thought the same way I do...... and like I said you cannot tell they are there except when a light is shined on them directly. It's kinda funny that in this pic you see some type anomaly in the exact same position where a top grip screw would be if it's there?
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    2 Weeks Ago  Jun 5, 2017, 9:10 AM - Re: A theory on the ESB hero graflex pics intensive #19

    halliwax said: View Post
    The reason I have to say there is no screws is. We have a good picture of vaders saber with out screws during filming.

    So now if Luke's grips fell off because of the cold and they used Screws to hold them on (including the small black screws)

    What is the chance the crazy prop department has the same exact (matching black) screws after filming to put on vaders

    I just find it hard to believe. This is why I'd love to see what Seth has.

    On a personal note I love the touch of the little black screws but if they don't have them on in the wampa scene I don't want to add them

    I'm hoping for little black screws


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Let me know if you cannot find the screws and I will get you some.
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    2 Weeks Ago  Jun 5, 2017, 9:18 AM - Re: A theory on the ESB hero graflex pics intensive #20

    Mortifactors pics show the same anomaly. To me it's the top grip screw lol
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  21. Member Since
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    2 Weeks Ago  Jun 5, 2017, 11:50 AM - Re: A theory on the ESB hero graflex pics intensive #21

    Thanks for the kind words Symcha on my build. I will take some pics of the ritj vader and post them up soon.
  22. scarf man's Avatar
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    2 Weeks Ago  Jun 5, 2017, 1:17 PM - Re: A theory on the ESB hero graflex pics intensive #22

    REVANSSkywalker said: View Post
    Just curious....does anyone know where these two pics came from? I got these off of Google and who ever did these included the top grip screws.
    Those were done by a member of the RPF called DARTH SABER.
    Look in the gallery here on the RPF for a bunch more blueprints by the above mentioned member.
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    2 Weeks Ago  Jun 5, 2017, 3:02 PM - Re: A theory on the ESB hero graflex pics intensive #23

    halliwax said: View Post
    The reason I have to say there is no screws is. We have a good picture of vaders saber with out screws during filming.

    So now if Luke's grips fell off because of the cold and they used Screws to hold them on (including the small black screws)

    What is the chance the crazy prop department has the same exact (matching black) screws after filming to put on vaders

    I just find it hard to believe. This is why I'd love to see what Seth has.

    On a personal note I love the touch of the little black screws but if they don't have them on in the wampa scene I don't want to add them

    I'm hoping for little black screws


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Vaders saber wouldn't need the screws because he wasn't in any scenes except for one when in invades echo base. Also I thought alot of the vader scenes in empire he didn't have his saber on his belt? That means those extra screws were not needed lol
  24. Sym-Cha's Avatar
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    2 Weeks Ago  Jun 5, 2017, 3:27 PM - Re: A theory on the ESB hero graflex pics intensive #24

    REVANSSkywalker said: View Post
    I did miss the silver strip lol. Now to find another one!!!!
    No need to find another strip ... like Slothfurnace you can use silver solder to make the one you have more accurate ... it's the propmaker's way to keep within budget

    Cha´m
  25. mortifactor's Avatar
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    2 Weeks Ago  Jun 6, 2017, 2:54 AM - Re: A theory on the ESB hero graflex pics intensive #25

    REVANSSkywalker said: View Post
    Mortifactors pics show the same anomaly. To me it's the top grip screw lol
    I took the pic to mean there are no top screws

    The idea that there are screws comes from the ranch saber pic, but the screws in this picture don't look countersunk and are rather larger than the anomaly on the other pictures. Also, what about the other grips? No sign there. I think the top screws look cool and will possibly include them on my ESB Vader, but I don't think they are in the other pictures.

    Also the clamp screw when painted black is too large and the paint will scratch off very easily, I tried it out. I think it really is a small black bolt (not so hard to find) OR damaged plating from the original screw that has corroded somewhat. Or it could just be some other random object, very hard to tell.

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