The ELSTREE ROTJ Darth Vader Helmet

JRX

Well-Known Member
Here is a big bunch of pics of my Return of the Jedi "ELSTREE" Vader Helmet.

It is from the first run and unfortunately has some Dome Flare, wich soon will
be taken care of, so you can leave that obvious fault out of the discussions.


- How accurate is it / Details / Size / Colors / everything ...

- What are its Origins (100% bulletproof facts only folks.)

- How are its looks compared to other ROTJ Helmets.

- Everything you like to comment about it.

And here we go with the pictures:



























 

kurtyboy

Master Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
WOW. So sharp... so pretty... I'm jealous. Of course I have my fantastic GH ROTJ which also has roots to a screen used ROTJ (but a different one) so its some consolation to me :)
 

GINO

Sr Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
It's been way oversharpened and over-cleaned up. Someone just went a little too sandpaper crazy thinking they were improving it. Another detail that was added in with artistic license is the nose notch on the right hand side when looking at the facemask. It's the part where the gunmetal ends before the transition into the nose.
But in my opinion, the worst aspect of its facemask is in the brow area. This area has been so oversharpened that they seem to almost protrude out like ledges.
 

Too Much Garlic

Master Member
<div class='quotetop'>(GINO @ Jun 10 2006, 03:59 PM) [snapback]1259547[/snapback]</div>
Another detail that was added in with artistic license is the nose notch on the right hand side when looking at the facemask. It's the part where the gunmetal ends before the transition into the nose.
[/b]
Funny that that feature can be clearly seen in ANH screenshots showing that side of the face.



And if this one isn't enough, then I have lots more from the DVDs...
 

JRX

Well-Known Member
Yes it is there on all Helmets on the left side, but I think GINO was meaning
that most seen Helmets (and of course he also means all the Originals) it
is only on the left side and never on the right side ... well from what pics and
stuff we have it seems to be that way ... but why the heck should a sculptor
only sculpt such a nick on one side - that would be totally stupid and absolutely
against the symetry of a sculpt - any sculptor would do it on both sides - :p

Well that detail is also completely erased on some ROTJ Helmets on BOTH
sides - for example the Stunt - ;) ... and on most other caps and pics of
ANH and ESB Helmets it seems to be further back ... but look very closely ...

I have a little ROTJ Screencap for you from the scene where Luke is brought
before the Emperor ... the nick is there - close to the nose as on the Elstree ...

 

GINO

Sr Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
That is a trick of lighting. Every original helmet I've seen does not have that edge.
Also, the elstree has a "fat lip" which seems to have been added to match screen caps from rotj. Only later to find out that the reason for the "fat lip" helmet was only there because of the poorly aligned and mated up clear neck section of the stunt helmet.
 

JRX

Well-Known Member
<div class='quotetop'>(GINO @ Jun 10 2006, 05:02 PM) [snapback]1259568[/snapback]</div>
That is a trick of lighting. Every original helmet I've seen does not have that edge.[/b]

I knew that would be said, so I invite you to watch that whole scene in slomo, and you will
see that the light exactly breaks at that little point all the way when he turns his head - it
does not move like a reflection would - the nick is breaking the light at that point - ;)

Anybody watch that scene on the DVD closely and then get back ...
 

JRX

Well-Known Member
<div class='quotetop'>(KevVader @ Jun 10 2006, 05:42 PM) [snapback]1259592[/snapback]</div>
Inaccuracies and the exaggerated dome flare aside...I love the Elstree...very nice lid.
[/b]
Glad yo like it - I'm very proud to have it - it looks killer - the face is so great.

I'm pretty sure it was "sharpened up", but the eyebrows are not sharper than on
DJ's ANH Helmet - ;)

And funny is that all the small "casting flaws" were left in it - all those small bubbles
and stuff in the nose ridge, were the cheek tubes meet the mouth and cheeks, the
small nicks in the Mouth ... why wasn't all of that erased when it was "cleaned up"
so heavily - more funny is that these small "imperfections" seen also on the screen
used helmets are much clearer and sharper there on this mask as on any other I
have seen - :rolleyes ... well well ... somebody must have "added" them, right.
 

ob1al

Sr Member
<div class='quotetop'>(Cyberman @ Jun 10 2006, 05:19 PM) [snapback]1259616[/snapback]</div>
I think it looks beautiful... So clean a crisp

Cyb.
[/b]
I agree- it looks stunning and very sharp.

Superb.
 

GINO

Sr Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
It's stuff like this that makes the people "in the know" keep to themselves. It's not worth the effort for the debate when people don't want to hear the ugly truth. Everyone wants to feel like what they have is "the" pinnacle item, even when it's not. This is very common among other collectable helmets as well.
As long as you like it, that is all that matters.
It's just that if you leave things like this unchecked, it later ends up becoming gospel and mass opinion.
Like i said before though, most people will believe what they want to believe regardless of what evidence you put before them. So why bother going through the effort. I used to do that in other instances but now I just give my 2 cents, take it or leave it, you're only doing a disservice to yourself.
 

Too Much Garlic

Master Member
Hehe... "those in the know"... the ever returning reply...

Wonder how you explain the MGM Vader...

oh wait... I know... "those in the know" know that that is not a real RotJ Vader or that is shadow or whatever else is used to explain something that is in plain sight for all to see.

Guess "those in the know" who claim to know more but don't wanna share should just be quiet. Just my two scents.

The feature may be enhanced on the Elstree, but the feature IS there on the originals... and since you don't feel the need to substantiate your claims, then why should anyone listen to you? I would think that proving us "noobs" wrong would be more satisfying than "I know, but won't share". That has gotten tiresome all too quickly.

But oh well... us "noobs" will just run around without our heads until the BIG GIANT SECRET is revealed (next year). :rolleyes
 

HDPE

Well-Known Member
<div class='quotetop'>(kurtyboy @ Jun 10 2006, 01:35 PM) [snapback]1259532[/snapback]</div>
WOW. So sharp... so pretty... I'm jealous. Of course I have my fantastic GH ROTJ which also has roots to a screen used ROTJ (but a different one) so its some consolation to me :)
[/b]

Personally I think the GH ROTJ is a superior helmet, much better than the Elstree.

I know we are not supposed to talk about it ( but it's part of the helmet) but the dome is so wrong on the Elstree I think it's an over-estimated high hand piece, seen from a collector point of view and by no means an expert.

That being said the face plate is very sharp and combined with the right dome it will be an awesome helmet well worth having.
 

Too Much Garlic

Master Member
<div class='quotetop'>(HDPE STORMY @ Jun 10 2006, 07:41 PM) [snapback]1259662[/snapback]</div>
<div class='quotetop'>(kurtyboy @ Jun 10 2006, 01:35 PM) [snapback]1259532[/snapback]
WOW. So sharp... so pretty... I'm jealous. Of course I have my fantastic GH ROTJ which also has roots to a screen used ROTJ (but a different one) so its some consolation to me :)
[/b]
Personally I think the GH ROTJ is a superior helmet, much better than the Elstree.
I know we are not supposed to talk about it ( but it's part of the helmet) but the dome is so wrong on the Elstree I think it's an over-estimated high hand piece, seen from a collector point of view and by no means an expert.
That being said the face plate is very sharp and combined with the right dome it will be an awesome helmet well worth having.
[/b][/quote]
Valid points. I think it is a nice stylized piece and would love to own one, but I just think it is a bit out of my range atm. :rolleyes

I don't think I have seen much of the GH RotJ, in fact, until very recently I did not know it existed. Would it be possible to get a separate topic about that one, 'cause I would love to see it. Tbh: it is so rare to see pictures of ESB and RotJ Vader helmets. It all revolves around the ANH helmets and all the controversies that follow those.

Sorry to high-jack the topic...

(Oh yeah, almost forgot... the picture posted in my previous post is not mine - just thought that since it was only a small piece of the MGM Vader image posted that it would be okay, but if not, well - if the owner wants me to remove it, then please let me know. Thanks.)
 

steveo

Sr Member
I think it's an amazing helmet. Are there any comparison shots of the two helmets? Where does one go about acquiring this Elstree helmet?
 

Cyberman

Sr Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
I'd say I have been a bit in the know about ROTJ Vader helmets and this is a prime example of the modifications done by the studio in getting the helmet upgraded for the last in the orginal Trilogy. I don't want to get into a heated debate but this helmet shows all the classic characteristics.

A few points to bear in mind are... Copies of copies... a helmet gets painted and the detail is slightly subdued... Its copied then painted again... This process is repeated and repeated till the detail gets washed away, like a pebble in a river.

Studio clean up.... They decide to sharpen up aspects of the design and enhance it. The nose has been lengthen... what they could do to make it look better has been done. The result was the best helmet of its time IMO. Clean sharp crisp and perfect.

Cyb.
 

lambotour

Well-Known Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
<div class='quotetop'>(NoHumorMan @ Jun 10 2006, 02:01 PM) [snapback]1259670[/snapback]</div>
Tbh: it is so rare to see pictures of ESB and RotJ Vader helmets.
[/b]
While going through my SW chronicles book, I saw the following pic:



Based on the chestbox it's from ROTJ, but that center faceplate looks to be where the DP DLX came from, which was ESB, and the faceplate to the left is an ROTJ. I may have missed this info on another thread, but were ESB faceplates used in ROTJ? Also, I know there have been discussions that some believe the DP DLX dome was ROTJ, this pic could lead to some confirmation of that.
 
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