Suggestions/advice for bright lights behind visor.

juntari

New Member
Hi, I'm improving a project I did a few years back and would like some help. I have a visor which is tinted a dark black. I'd like to have the eyes/mouth light up a bright green.
J6-HelmPromo-350x.jpg

I've been looking up a few ways to do it and narrowed it down to two possibilities. Either using EL tape or some sort of LED set-up.

So my questions are, would the EL tape be bright enough to shine through a tinted visor? Or even a clear one? They seem pretty good but I've never seen one in person, especially during the day.

If I went with the LED way, are there any suggestions to make it bright and even? I've seen people diffuse it but couldn't find any specifics to what they were using to do it. Are there different quality LEDs to use? Right now I have two small ones shining straight down mounted in front of the visor and they aren't very bright.

I don't have much experience with electronics but would love to learn, so this would be my chance to get it right with the help of some of you here. I have a basic understanding of how it works but if there are new techniques/materials people would like to share I'd love to hear it.

Thanks!
 
LEDs are the best option. I use Oznium.com for cheap LEDS if you are practicing and may burn a few. Remember that they have positive and negative ends and resistors will help with the lifespan! Nice looking lid!
 
This may not help this much but if it was me doing this, I would do one 'eye' of each to see which is has the best result. This will also help you with learning how to use these lighting techniques.

But in saying this I do have more practice with led's than El wire so i would probable start with them and how they look, but on the other hand after Tron Legacy El wire seems to be the way of the future.
Nerds Unite
 
If I go the LED way, what should I use to diffuse the light so that it doesn't look like a bunch of LEDs in my face?
 
I'm doing some LED light boxes as I type. Well, not quite as I type, I'd get styrene cement on the keyboard, but you know what I mean.

Green LEDs are traditionally the weediest. There are better ones, now, which use the same sort of technology as the blue ones and achieve both more brightness and a deeper, richer colour. The old style green ones, which is probably what you have in your computer keyboard and that sort of thing, are really rather pale and yellowish, and not very satisfactory. You can also, of course, use white ones and filter them, although that'll cost you a lot of efficiency. It does let you have any shade of green you like, though.

Yes there certainly are different types of LED. Some are low-current and intended as indicator lights, some are intended for absolute maximum output, some include optics to diffuse or concentrate the beam, etc. Absolutely all LEDs must be used with a current-limited power supply, which is a pedantic way of saying they need a series resistor, always, or as near to always as makes no difference outside an electronics lab. People will tell you that you don't need one in certain circumstances, but you are crashingly unlikely to encounter those circumstances when building costumes, especially if you want maximum output. Resistors are cheap and it's easy to calculate the value you need. Skipping this may work for a few hours, but the light output will gradually degrade and the device will eventually fail.

Diffusing light will make it less bright, of course. If you're after an even block of colour, especially if you need to do it in limited depth (as you do for a helmet) there are effectively two solutions: you can use electroluminescent panel, as beloved of the Tron people, or you can use an edge-lit panel as is done in things like television backlights. EL panel is easy, can be cut to shape, is flexible, very thin, and lights up evenly, but it's expensive and frankly not that bright unless driven very hard which limits its life to a few hours (and remember, it's expensive). It can be hard to make EL panel look good outside of controlled lighting situations such as a club or night exterior. With the edge-lit panel, it's effectively a chunk of acrylic sheet with a coating on one or both sides that diffuses light into an even (within limits) field, into the edge of which you fire LEDs. The Perspex brand name is "S-Lux", though there are probably others, and it's used to make things like poster display frames and point-of-sale displays in shops. There is no limit, other than battery power, heat and physical space, to the amount of light you can pump into a bit of this stuff and it can be much, much brighter than EL panel. It isn't even that expensive, although most places are used to selling 6x4 foot sheets of it for promotional displays and you may get funny looks if you ask for a three inch square. It's not particularly magic, it's just plexiglass with a frosted finish, albeit carefully optimised for this application, and you can probably get workable results by sanding the surface of clear sheet. I scored some bits of S-lux just by asking for a sample pack - the amount in the sample, about the size of a sheet of paper, is probably enough to do the job for you.

If you have enough depth you can build a light box and just put layers of diffusion filter in the front. If you do this, try putting one bit of diffusion half way down the box and another bit of diffusion at the end, otherwise you can end up with a weirdly directional looking thing. Mock it up in cardboard and sticky tape first and ensure you're getting results you like. Diffusing filter material is made for the film and theatrical industries by people like GAM, Formatt, Lee Filters, etc, and can be bought off the roll. Lee #216 is my favourite for this sort of thing, but in general you're after frost or diffusion filters. They also make filters for colouring light and you can pick your shade of green - get on the phone and ask for a swatch book of samples.

In general, though, it's quite difficult. LEDs look intense, but that's only because they're emitting over a very small area. Diffuse it, and you lose that punch. So, you may find you end up needing very large amounts of power (and large amounts of batteries to run it) to get the look you want. In the movies, things like this are done in very controlled lighting conditions, and possibly enhanced in postproduction.

HF
 
Thanks for the detailed explanation! I really appreciate it. For the edge lit piece, the LEDs are mounted on the edges as the name implies and not directly facing the flat edge? And to prevent blinding myself I just blacken out any side that faces my eyes?
 
You'd fire the light into the edge of the sheet of acrylic, at 90 degrees to the angle of view. As the light bounces around, fiber-optic-style, inside the sheet, which is water-clear, it eventually hits the front diffused viewing surface and is scattered.

Your laptop screen probably works very much like this, although display backlights are often patterned so that the inevitable falloff in intensity from edge to centre is balanced out by a change in the degree of diffusion. It's all quite clever.

If you can get hold of an old laptop display and dismantle it for its backlight, you may find it has some of the prismatic stuff in it which is used to collimate the light forward after it's come out of the diffusing layer, for increased efficiency. It looks a bit like the stuff you get on those pictures that change as you look at them from various angles.

Look at this link (skip to 26 minutes 45 if the link doesn't work right):

Extreme teardown - Lumix digital camera - YouTube

He disassembles the LCD module on a modern digital camera, and you can see all of the components and how backlights are built commercially.

HF
 
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