Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Pre-release)
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seelsa73
Sr Member
Presuming, of course, it's a good movie, which we all expect it will be.
cboath
Master Member
Keep in mind a clone of vader from DNA would be hayden Christiansen
He would no longer require the suit, helmet, or any of it.This ^ They used the spherical Q7 astromechs. Though they flew rather than rolled..
MooCriket
Master Member
Keep in mind a clone of vader from DNA would be hayden Christiansen
This is true. I'm not a hater though. I enjoy him in Jumper, and think with good dialog, he could put it a decent performance. Of course, I don't see any of this coming to fruition though. If they were to clone Vader, I think they would end up casting another actor or somewhere on the web something would have been leaked by now.
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seelsa73
Sr Member
Hayden has made some bad choices in movies and/or his acting, but he can give a great performance in the right circumstances. See Shattered Glass and Life as a House and you can really see what I mean. I don't think you can really blame him for Star Wars...he was coached to act the way he did. Just see what he did in his audition for AotC...if George had just let him do his thing, all of them really, like he seemed to have done for the actors in the OT, we might have gotten better received movies (I won't say better, because I actually liked the PT, despite it's flaws).
Riceball
Master Member
I don't disagree that a lot of the wooden acting in the prequels was all Lucas' fault but I do feel the need to point out that of the 3 movies that make up the OT, he only actually directed one, the first Star Wars and that was it.
seelsa73
Sr Member
Yea, but even in that one movie, the acting is far superior to all of the PT, despite having top notch actors in those movies (far more so than the OT).
Criticallly the problem with the standard of acting came down to the huge amounts of green screen used. Virtually everyone suffered from the "missing set" syndrome, which is why the new film has been so highly praised, people actually felt they were "in" the Star Wars universe, and thats a huge aid for actors to give a more convincing performance. Its hard enough to deliver poorly written dialogue but if there is literally nothing around you but green curtains then all that necessary unconscious interaction with the physical world is also missing. Audiences also pick that up that because the information is missing in the performance, because literally everything about the actors "looks" staged and rigged. Its subtle effect but unmissable.
Which is why most effects heavy films (after the prequels have gone for physical sets, admittedly smaller than before (because CGI can generate very convincing backgrounds which our eyes mostly ignore) but that central area where the actors are is essential for producing better and more realistic results.
Which is why most effects heavy films (after the prequels have gone for physical sets, admittedly smaller than before (because CGI can generate very convincing backgrounds which our eyes mostly ignore) but that central area where the actors are is essential for producing better and more realistic results.
astroboy
Master Member
I disagree with the "missing set" being the problem. I've been working in theatre for 20 years and any actor with even a little experience would have been trained without a set. The fundamental text for modern acting taught us that acting can be believable in an empty parking lot. Actors spend all of their rehearsal without a set. Either in a rehearsal hall or in their trailer.
If you can't make the dialogue work, there's no way the acting will be good.
So I blame the lack of "working the text" with the writers, director, and actors. I think that the director felt that if the effects are good, the audience will believe it.
If you can't make the dialogue work, there's no way the acting will be good.
So I blame the lack of "working the text" with the writers, director, and actors. I think that the director felt that if the effects are good, the audience will believe it.
Darth Lars
Master Member
It was not so much as a missing set as there having been missing actors to interact with.
Anthony Daniels didn't seem to be a blue screen fan..
Here's Anthony Daniels at Emerald City Comic Con, describing his thoughts on filming the movie:
Here's Anthony Daniels at Emerald City Comic Con, describing his thoughts on filming the movie:
There was one other aspect to the new films that Daniels felt was noteworthy, and asked aloud, “Do you know what we have in Episode 7?”
Several audience members made guesses at characters or items from the mythology, but the actor merely shook his head and grinned. “We have scenery,” he replied. “No more of the green screen. No more of the expansion of blue … and blue used to be my favorite color.”
The audience laughed and he continued, “The use of green screen? When necessary – yes. If you’re only coming out of the doorway of a great temple or something, you don’t have to build a whole temple. But having a reality to the set brings a reality to the performance. As an actor, you have something to react to.”
Several audience members made guesses at characters or items from the mythology, but the actor merely shook his head and grinned. “We have scenery,” he replied. “No more of the green screen. No more of the expansion of blue … and blue used to be my favorite color.”
The audience laughed and he continued, “The use of green screen? When necessary – yes. If you’re only coming out of the doorway of a great temple or something, you don’t have to build a whole temple. But having a reality to the set brings a reality to the performance. As an actor, you have something to react to.”
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astroboy
Master Member
That's fair, but anthony daniels is hardly what I would call an experienced actor. Especially compared to the heavyweights around him
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That's fair, but anthony daniels is hardly what I would call an experienced actor. Especially compared to the heavyweights around him
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JD
Master Member
The man is wearing a golden robot suit - any comment about the sets being not real from him becomes moot. Seriously - what's his vision even like in that mask?
Actor - to act. You're playing pretend. Do stage actors bitch about their sets not being real or that the "fourth wall" is not there and an audience is in its place?
Remember what Alec Guiness thought about his dialog? "new rubbish dialogue reaches me every other day on wadges of pink paper – and none of it makes my character clear or even bearable."
Lucas' style with actors is not something new with the prequels.
Actor - to act. You're playing pretend. Do stage actors bitch about their sets not being real or that the "fourth wall" is not there and an audience is in its place?
Remember what Alec Guiness thought about his dialog? "new rubbish dialogue reaches me every other day on wadges of pink paper – and none of it makes my character clear or even bearable."
Lucas' style with actors is not something new with the prequels.
"Audiences also pick that up that because the information is missing in the performance, because literally everything about the actors "looks" staged and rigged. Its subtle effect but unmissable."
"Staged and rigged" is exactly what you see on a theatre set. And I would point out its rare to have a hit theatre production that consists purely of a couple of actors talking just dialogue surrounded by nothing else but green curtains. The difference between a stage and cinema performance for an actor is substantial. Physical thearte sets are essential to the success of the play, for both the players and the audience. Every actor feels their performance picks up once the stage is constructed and they have somewhere for their character to exist. If you've been working for that long in the theatre I'm surprised you don't acknowledge that. Its primarily why cinema and theatre are very different things. Virtually every actor on the prequels all commented on how disappointing and difficult it was to react to anything whilst shooting as there was often nothing except flooring and body imaging to represent a character. Its also why there are three brilliant hardback books on "The Making of" the original trilogy that are loved by thousands of SW fans yet the "The Making of ROTS" is comparativiely uninteresting, consisting mainly of pages of concept art and actors stood infront of blue screens. It looks more like a theatre or TV production than a SW film.
"Staged and rigged" is exactly what you see on a theatre set. And I would point out its rare to have a hit theatre production that consists purely of a couple of actors talking just dialogue surrounded by nothing else but green curtains. The difference between a stage and cinema performance for an actor is substantial. Physical thearte sets are essential to the success of the play, for both the players and the audience. Every actor feels their performance picks up once the stage is constructed and they have somewhere for their character to exist. If you've been working for that long in the theatre I'm surprised you don't acknowledge that. Its primarily why cinema and theatre are very different things. Virtually every actor on the prequels all commented on how disappointing and difficult it was to react to anything whilst shooting as there was often nothing except flooring and body imaging to represent a character. Its also why there are three brilliant hardback books on "The Making of" the original trilogy that are loved by thousands of SW fans yet the "The Making of ROTS" is comparativiely uninteresting, consisting mainly of pages of concept art and actors stood infront of blue screens. It looks more like a theatre or TV production than a SW film.
glunark
Sr Member
A lot of trouble with things that are put in later is the lack of weight and interaction, take the levitating fruit in AOTC, at no point did it convince that there was anything there, same with any of the fights against droids or clones.
Compare to guardians of the galaxy where Drax pats Rockets back, that looked more real because he was patting the back of a stand in who was later removed.
Compare to guardians of the galaxy where Drax pats Rockets back, that looked more real because he was patting the back of a stand in who was later removed.
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