Same here.
They should get their crap together, fix all the legal shizzball mumbo jumbo Before trying to create new Trek.
Star Trek: Picard
- Thread starter renaissance_man
- Start date
They should get their crap together, fix all the legal shizzball mumbo jumbo Before trying to create new Trek.
patrickivan
Sr Member
I hear you on that. Though I was referring to the in universe point that they seem to radically re-design all uniforms every 10 years or so. Probably because of how easy it is.
That said, having looked at some close ups just now, they don't all appear to be onesies.
patrickivan
Sr Member
Almost exactly? No. Straight across the breast. Top colour all uniform. Black undershirt. No rank badge drop down. Shoulder colours come to a classic point, not squared off.
Not almost exactly.
Lightning
Master Member
If it is, then its wrong since Starfleet uniforms of that era should look like this:
View attachment 1019566
But then again, this is the Prime Universe, not the Star Trek Canon universe, the 25% rule and all that.
All the episodes that we see the AGT uniforms in were erased by time travel shenanigans. Absolutely nothing is preventing the uniform design from being different when the "real" timeline reaches it. I fully expected them to be different anyway, since the AGT uniforms were specifically designed to make people look old (high waists, etc.) Clearly the Endgame incident (the last time we saw this uniform) caused a divergence that changed the decision about the next uniform.
Strikerkc
Sr Member
That's retarded. It's all fictional stories. There's no "reality" or "real" to it or not. To act like one fiction is "fake" while another related fiction is "fact" is nonsense.
Having the same characters in stories that don't need to follow each other, or use different backgrounds, or for at the same time in history, doesn't invalidate EITHER story. They're BOTH make believe.
If you think internal consistency in a fictional universe is "optional", or whatever, you're as bad as Braga. You have to be mindful of what came before, whether you agree with it or not, for that universe to have any perceived "reality" to it. Can't just ignore it to blithely tell whatever stories you want to tell, or it ends up a disjointed mess no one cares about. Oh, wait...
I consider one of the hallmarks of a good writer to be how well they work within an established fictional history of a fictional universe they're getting to play in.
You have to be mindful of what came before, whether you agree with it or not, for that universe to have any perceived "reality" to it. Can't just ignore it to blithely tell whatever stories you want to tell, or it ends up a disjointed mess no one cares about. Oh, wait...I consider one of the hallmarks of a good writer to be how well they work within an established fictional history of a fictional universe they're getting to play in.
Strikerkc
Sr Member
You're getting a franchise confused with a series. If a series isn't internally consistent it's bad writing. If a franchise isn't internally consistent it's an artistic decision.
just because all of the predator movies don't fit perfectly together, and don't fit perfectly with the Predator comic books, and don't fit perfectly with AVP video games, doesn't mean they can't be enjoyable.
same goes for Star trek it's been an incredibly long running franchise, and there's just been too damn much of it. Meaning that if anyone's going to write any new stories they have to start disregarding some of the old ones, there's just no room to have any more stories with established characters if you have to follow EXACTLY what was written down by unaffiliated writers a decade ago.
comic book companies do this kind of thing all the time. They put out a run of comics that is internally consistent. Then they might put out another run of comics that happens at essentially the same time that disregards what happened in that previous one. They use the same characters in different types of settings and they just make sure that whatever they mean to work together works together. and now even the MCU is going to have the opportunity to do that sort of stuff, like the comic companies that spawned it have been successfully doing for decades.
acting like a new television show has to be beholden to a ****** costume design from 10 years ago or else your brain can't handle it, is retarded.
just because all of the predator movies don't fit perfectly together, and don't fit perfectly with the Predator comic books, and don't fit perfectly with AVP video games, doesn't mean they can't be enjoyable.
same goes for Star trek it's been an incredibly long running franchise, and there's just been too damn much of it. Meaning that if anyone's going to write any new stories they have to start disregarding some of the old ones, there's just no room to have any more stories with established characters if you have to follow EXACTLY what was written down by unaffiliated writers a decade ago.
comic book companies do this kind of thing all the time. They put out a run of comics that is internally consistent. Then they might put out another run of comics that happens at essentially the same time that disregards what happened in that previous one. They use the same characters in different types of settings and they just make sure that whatever they mean to work together works together. and now even the MCU is going to have the opportunity to do that sort of stuff, like the comic companies that spawned it have been successfully doing for decades.
acting like a new television show has to be beholden to a ****** costume design from 10 years ago or else your brain can't handle it, is retarded.
nwjedidave
Sr Member
Anyone save the new Picard Starfleet uniform pocture before paramount had it taken down?
With Trek the franchise is the series- all the different shows are tied together. Events and people are cross referenced, overlaps occur and what happens in one affects those which follow. Trek is a very complicated universe and the consistency of the universe is part of what makes it work. When you go against that established canon then you have problems with the fan base.
Some say to that - so what?- we want a bigger audience that just those existing fans. Well Discovery did that, the outcry and ratings caused them to re-tune the second season. One big draw with 'Star Trek- Picard' is the anticipation of returning to that established universe and it's familiar trappings. If they choose to just make another in name only series with a revered actor playing a different role but having the same name, then they will not get a wonderful embracing reception.
I do not care at all about costume designs- Trek has been reworking the uniforms with every series created already.
Some say to that - so what?- we want a bigger audience that just those existing fans. Well Discovery did that, the outcry and ratings caused them to re-tune the second season. One big draw with 'Star Trek- Picard' is the anticipation of returning to that established universe and it's familiar trappings. If they choose to just make another in name only series with a revered actor playing a different role but having the same name, then they will not get a wonderful embracing reception.
I do not care at all about costume designs- Trek has been reworking the uniforms with every series created already.
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Strikerkc, exactly what Richard Baker said above. If continuity between the series wasn't that big a deal, Gene wouldn't have spent so much of the early days of TNG banging home that it was the same universe as TOS by bringing McCoy onto the new Enterprise, by referencing TOS episodes... Even the re-use of TOS/TFS ship models, uniforms, and equipment ties them all together. From the airing of "The Man Trap" (Fox wasn't the first to air a series out of order) through Voyager's "Endgame", it's all one shared universe with internal consistency. They got most things right, and many of the errors are due to only one or two people who feel the same as you -- that continuity doesn't matter. Time-travel issues aside, I can point to only a handful of things throughout that entire thirty-five year span that Don't Work™:
• Mike (and later Denise) Okuda and their on-again-off-again research skillz (from Constuitution-class registries to Kirk's birth year to when TOS is set -- I won't go into that essay here), that, unfortunately, newer productions adhere to.
• Ron Moore not knowing or not caring about the distinction between job (Transporter Chief) and rank (Chief Petty Officer) and making Lieutenant Miles O'Brien a crusty old enlisted man. I like the trope, I love the character, but let him remain an officer -- maybe even started out enlisted, got a battlefield promotion under Maxwell, and then he went to OCS, but not what we got.
• Scotty at the launch of the Enterprise-B, seeing Kirk "die", and then after he comes out of his transporter stasis thinks Kirk came looking for him. That one's on Brannon "that was one episode -- who's going to care about that?" Braga. (He also wanted to make Zefram Cochrane a woman in First Contact to be Picard's love-interest for the film, people pointed out we'd met the guy in TOS, his response was a similar "that was thirty years ago -- who's gonna remember?", wiser heads prevailed, and Lily Sloane was written in.)
• The TNG films in general. I can grudgingly find ways to work with the first three, despite the Enterprise-E, despite characters acting out-of-character (see: Kurlan naiskos), and so on, but Nemesis is a hot mess all through. It needs a full rewrite to potentially even maybe work, and is why I end my span with "Endgame" in '01 and and not Nemesis in '02.
Altogether, that's not bad for so many hours of content, on the production schedule they were under. Far more is consistent across those than inconsistent. Including uniforms. DS9 introduced the new "work uniforms" inspired by TNG's Academy uniform, but also still showed the TNG uniforms used for more formal occasions. TNG reciprocated by using the "Class C's" in Generations. Generations also introduced the new commbadge design that then went into use on DS9, and also in Voyager when it premiered shortly after. First Contact introduced the new BDUs and they then went into use on DS9 (and on the people back home on Voyager). And so forth. Not counting Valeris, we've only had a few minor uniform goofs across all the series.
And one thing that TNG, DS9, and VOY all share is glimpses of a possible future for each set of characters where the same uniform is in use by Starfleet in the respective time periods (2395 for "All Good Things...", 2422 for "The Visitor", and 2404 for "Endgame"). I don't necessarily hold that that uniform was in use, unchanged, for a good thirty years, but -- citing the movies' "monster maroons" (at least 2278 to at least 2294, but as late as after 2311 per secondary sources) -- there would be precedent. My takeaway is more that, even with whatever temporal tweaking having those glimpses of a future allows those witnessing them to make -- intentionally or un -- the general tone is that a change to that uniform and insignia sometime in the late-24th/early-25th century is "inevitable".
Tracking all this crap isn't that hard. I've been doing it for decades, with help up until a few years ago from James Dixon. Not bothering or not caring shows a lack of respect for the setting/universe/property.
• Mike (and later Denise) Okuda and their on-again-off-again research skillz (from Constuitution-class registries to Kirk's birth year to when TOS is set -- I won't go into that essay here), that, unfortunately, newer productions adhere to.
• Ron Moore not knowing or not caring about the distinction between job (Transporter Chief) and rank (Chief Petty Officer) and making Lieutenant Miles O'Brien a crusty old enlisted man. I like the trope, I love the character, but let him remain an officer -- maybe even started out enlisted, got a battlefield promotion under Maxwell, and then he went to OCS, but not what we got.
• Scotty at the launch of the Enterprise-B, seeing Kirk "die", and then after he comes out of his transporter stasis thinks Kirk came looking for him. That one's on Brannon "that was one episode -- who's going to care about that?" Braga. (He also wanted to make Zefram Cochrane a woman in First Contact to be Picard's love-interest for the film, people pointed out we'd met the guy in TOS, his response was a similar "that was thirty years ago -- who's gonna remember?", wiser heads prevailed, and Lily Sloane was written in.)
• The TNG films in general. I can grudgingly find ways to work with the first three, despite the Enterprise-E, despite characters acting out-of-character (see: Kurlan naiskos), and so on, but Nemesis is a hot mess all through. It needs a full rewrite to potentially even maybe work, and is why I end my span with "Endgame" in '01 and and not Nemesis in '02.
Altogether, that's not bad for so many hours of content, on the production schedule they were under. Far more is consistent across those than inconsistent. Including uniforms. DS9 introduced the new "work uniforms" inspired by TNG's Academy uniform, but also still showed the TNG uniforms used for more formal occasions. TNG reciprocated by using the "Class C's" in Generations. Generations also introduced the new commbadge design that then went into use on DS9, and also in Voyager when it premiered shortly after. First Contact introduced the new BDUs and they then went into use on DS9 (and on the people back home on Voyager). And so forth. Not counting Valeris, we've only had a few minor uniform goofs across all the series.
And one thing that TNG, DS9, and VOY all share is glimpses of a possible future for each set of characters where the same uniform is in use by Starfleet in the respective time periods (2395 for "All Good Things...", 2422 for "The Visitor", and 2404 for "Endgame"). I don't necessarily hold that that uniform was in use, unchanged, for a good thirty years, but -- citing the movies' "monster maroons" (at least 2278 to at least 2294, but as late as after 2311 per secondary sources) -- there would be precedent. My takeaway is more that, even with whatever temporal tweaking having those glimpses of a future allows those witnessing them to make -- intentionally or un -- the general tone is that a change to that uniform and insignia sometime in the late-24th/early-25th century is "inevitable".
Tracking all this crap isn't that hard. I've been doing it for decades, with help up until a few years ago from James Dixon. Not bothering or not caring shows a lack of respect for the setting/universe/property.
PotionMistress
Sr Member
I LOVE that Picard appears to be back at his family vineyard in France. I hope that this series is going to focus more on the character/s development and evolution and lean less on explosions and wars that is so pervasive in shows these days. Its good to see his face again...it just makes me happy!
Could it be a quiet series that takes place completely at the Picard ancestral vineyard, as the setting, with the series arc being Picard’s struggles to resurrect the family label after the loss of his brother’s family in “Generations”? Awesome—make it so!!
Seriously, I’m still hoping for the best until I see the series. I place a lot of trust in Patrick Stewart that he will not give us Jake Picard suckling down green wine and muttering that “it’s time for Starfleet...to end”.
TazMan2000
Master Member
There's gonna be some drainage problems on those 3 middle rows of vines.If he's back at the vineyard, like he was on All Good Things, isn't he supposed to have that neurological disease or Terets Syndrome? Starfleet Academy would want him back after that? Maybe he's not an instructor at the Academy, maybe he is a patient at Star Fleet Medical, which could explain the "food court". You could imagine what zany adventures that an ex-captain could get into, in a hospital as they experiment on him, trying to learn mor about his affliction. Losing his memory and wandering into labs, operating rooms, holodecks and nurses.
TazMan2000
Now that would be worth tuning in for... Picard struck down by the gods with Tourette’s Syndrome...launching into random swearing sessions (CBS would gladly welcome as many “F-Bombs” as he could lob in a single episode).
I do wonder if the context of “the unimaginable” that is described in the trailer will include the loss of the remainder of the TNG crew at some climactic battle?
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Who knows?
I already pitched a Picard/ Walter Blunt hybrid and was laughingly shot down !
For those who have never seen it I thought it was Patrick’s best work in years “Blunt Talk”
Time will tell...
I already pitched a Picard/ Walter Blunt hybrid and was laughingly shot down !
For those who have never seen it I thought it was Patrick’s best work in years “Blunt Talk”
Time will tell...
