Recasters page on FaceBook

Utinni

Sr Member
hmmm... quick question...

TheSt.LouisKid- are you Steven M.? And is that FB page yours?

I'm just asking a simple question, not claiming anything.

You created this thread to announce that FB page back in Dec. If you're not the owner or have Admin status, does anyone here know who runs that FB page? It can't be some unknown person, I'm sure they want to stay quiet so the outed recasters won't go after them, I don't blame them.

But this whole grudge against Proptopia is REAL fishy to me, and several others.

We ask about the statement of recasting, Steven M pops up and talks about something other than recasting, and gets into it with AJ. Myself and Sean B (owner of Proptopia) continue to ask the Admin for proof of their claim only to get a response along the lines of "I don't have time to answer as I have better things to do." Then my post gets deleted and all of Sean's posts get deleted as well as him getting banned from the page...

How does that even make sense?

Who's the man behind the curtain........ :confused
 

Utinni

Sr Member
Ok... that facebook page and it's Admins have lost all credibility... Just like I said would happen... swept under the rug!!!


Movie Prop Replica Recasters The entire thread regarding recaster supporting sites has been removed. The post was "done" since it wasn't constructive yet some still felt the need to discuss further. It was asked why Sean was banned and that was because he seemed to think profanity was an option even after it was already posted that insults stop. It was asked why SOME posts were deleted and that was because some people commenting were either abuse, here for no constructive purpose, or they were reiterating a friends already abusive comment. Currently there is an actual recaster here and he seems to behave himself. Two people here have a dispute and it hasn't come down to a fight or name calling so hopefully that will be resolved amicably. Examples to show it is possible to be civil.
Let's break it down, but not as the Admin would want you to know as truth.

"The post was "done" since it wasn't constructive yet some still felt the need to discuss further."
It was NOT done because the Admin who claimed Proptopia supports recasting NEVER ONCE gave any example or proof of the claim, even after the owner of Proptopia requested it. And we continued to ask and no response, so yes we discussed it further.


"It was asked why Sean was banned and that was because he seemed to think profanity was an option even after it was already posted that insults stop."
That was only after he asked for proof and the Admin came back with a snarky reply along the lines of "I don't have time to tell you". And then went silent after Sean continued to ask why. So yeah... he called you a name. He was in the right to do so. You then banned him.

"It was asked why SOME posts were deleted and that was because some people commenting were either abuse, here for no constructive purpose, or they were reiterating a friends already abusive comment."
How were my posts asking about the original claim not constructive? And my post about the issue that Steven M. brought up about GBCam? All of his posts stayed on the board, but my response with actual answers to his posts were deleted. And we can't ask why the owner of Proptopia was banned?

"Currently there is an actual recaster here and he seems to behave himself."
I have not idea why you posted that... nice trick to change the subject.


We have an idea of who the Admin is or at least who they're connected with, not too hard to figure out. Yes, we believe it's some one in this very thread. With an obvious personal grudge with Proptopia and decided to smear a trusted board through the gutters for his own enjoyment and personal gain.

If I were you, I'd "unlike" that page as it's obviously not run by someone that can respect and follow their own rules of stating fact, not fiction. And see no problem "altering history" to fit their MO.

- Jeff
 

Utinni

Sr Member

venkman71

Well-Known Member
Yeah that's a very convenient and one sided version of events and very easy to post when you've muzzled anyone who'll challenge you.

It's specifically designed to sound like I dropped in and started cussing and being disruptive.

Since we're on a board where he can't silence his detractors we can tell the real story and it goes exactly how Utinni laid it out.

I posted directly on the site the other day, apart from the other thread, a simple question? "Shall we have a conversation today? Because I can't WAIT to hear your theories." Or something to that effect and after a day or so he finally deigned to reply thusly,...

I'm sorry Sean. There are other things to be done during the day rather than be sure your posts are answered as quickly as you would like.
But he had plenty of time to play cat and mouse with people in the other thread where he answered nobody either,...just posted selective finger-wagging replies like,...
AJ Quick, speak your mind but edit your statements to remove insults. No insults and name calling was noted previously. This is topic is done as it's going nowhere. Perhaps speaking on behalf of the RPF is inappropriate.
And when I continues to ask for one simple answer,..."What proof do you have that my old board harbored recasters?", I got this,..

Further comments will be deleted.
That was when I realized that first, he had NO proof and NO argument and second,..he was wasting everyone's time jerking us around and that was the point. When I realized that,...I got pissed and put up a few more posts for him to delete.

So I'll recap it in a nutshell,...Whomever this tiny clown is, he started a grudge board to call out people he has a problem with, (which from what we can all tell is everyone), he named my old site as "recaster-friendly". When several of us from said old board took issue with this blanket statement and asked for proof and then correction,....we got ignored for two days and when he did show up,...simply wagged his finger at everybody like Dennis Nedry from Jurassic park,.."Uh! Uh! Uh! Uh! Uh! Uh! You forgot to say the magic word!"
Never answered a question,...never talked to anybody, then muzzled everyone when we continued to press him for one simple conversation.

argument = invalid.

Why don't you buy a horse and go live in the mountains and stop bothering people.

Or go back to clown college.

Or yodeling school?

Or maybe take an improv class. That's where you'll find a lot of other jokes.
 

Utinni

Sr Member
And what do ya know... my reply was deleted!

Movie Prop Replica Recasters

4 hours ago

Policy updates in the "About" area.


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  • Movie Prop Replica Recasters The entire thread regarding recaster supporting sites has been removed. The post was "done" since it wasn't constructive yet some still felt the need to discuss further. It was asked why Sean was banned and that was because he seemed to think profanity was an option even after it was already posted that insults stop. It was asked why SOME posts were deleted and that was because some people commenting were either abuse, here for no constructive purpose, or they were reiterating a friends already abusive comment. Currently there is an actual recaster here and he seems to behave himself. Two people here have a dispute and it hasn't come down to a fight or name calling so hopefully that will be resolved amicably. Examples to show it is possible to be civil.
    3 hours ago · Edited · 1

  • Movie Prop Replica Recasters That matter is ended so no further comments please.
 

Bilious

Active Member
I usually lurk in these threads and just read out of morbid curiosity, but seeing so many 'Who cares' people pop up this round, (sock puppets or not) figured I'd toss in my two cents. I know most people are like ARGG STOP TURNING THIS INTO A DISCUSSION but I missed out on past opportunities to join in so....

(sorry this got long, I've read so many threads about this but never have put in my thoughts on the subject. This is mostly directed at those who still argue the point. Otherwise, please ignore the text wall, it's preaching to the choir, I'm sure.)

Let's put the situation in an entirely different context for a moment.

Let's say Someone on Deviantart drew a really beautiful piece of Pokemon fanart. It has a million favorites and is the person's most popular piece and they decide to sell prints of it at a convention. Yes, it's fanart, no the parent companies do not care about fans selling prints of unlicensed fanart. Someone ELSE wants the immediate gratification of being called an awesome artist without drawing the pokemons themselves. They save the deviantart image. They print it out. They upload it to their own DA and sell it as though it's their own. They get in loads of trouble when it comes out they 'art thefted' the picture. Their DA account is shut down by administration.

Grey area: The person is learning. They really like this pokemon art. They take the original image into photoshop. They trace it, color it, and finish it themselves. They post it as though it's their original work and for the most part, yes, they put in all of the work but the original "basic sketch" which was "stolen" from the original piece. They are still considered to be performing "art theft". There are tons and tons of "artists beware" sort of websites that call out people like this who "pose reference" by way of tracing or outright copying other artists to warn people who might commission them.

In the drawing-art community, this sort of thing is absolutely considered the same as recasting in the prop-art community. It boils down to did they recast to LEARN? Or did they recast for the immediate gratification of being considered a higher level of training and talent? If they're making a profit? Bad news bears.

I can see where some people get bitchy about there being no difference between recasting a screen used prop vs. recasting something a fellow fan made. HONESTLY there is no difference to me- the real difference does lay in the fact when it's been recast from an original they usually say as much up front. It's more acceptable to be honest about the origins than just DOING IT. I think at this point a LOT of professional studios that do let their screen used props out into the public are aware that it will probably be recast, and they're fine with it, or they would say something outright when selling it to the highest bidder. Using screen-used items to recast and adapt to accommodate cosplay is the purest way to get the most accurate costume out there.

Besides the fact those original studio artists already made thousands of dollars for their work, the job is done for them, their bonus comes from selling off the piece later if they still have rites to their creation at all.

Replica makers, meanwhile, often are simply investing their own time and money into an endeavor. They DO loose out when trying to make their investment back by doing a run when someone short-cuts their hard work to make a quick buck and a bit of ePopularity. Recasters doing new generations of older props WITH PERMISSION from the original fabricator are in the clear.

Hell, my first mold I made for my AMCW badges came out terribly- I had something wrong with my vacuum pump, I ended up making a new mold but still do use the first mold to help my production, they just take a ton more cleanup before I let it out the door. I will eventually recast my own work when I have time to make more, fresher badges. Obviously I give myself permission to make new molds from clean castings since my original wax sculpt is a bit worn at this point.

For as many "Art theft Alert" websites out there for the graphic arts community, I'm HAPPY to see a "recaster alert" site out there for the same community protection. The internet is full of wiseguys thinking there's an easy way to work around putting the real work in. This facebook is a fabulous idea for all of those prop makers and costumers out there who are trying to get their own names out there and start a business, hobby-side-business or more.

I have not been recast (yet) but I have been "art thefted" before, and it was silly and stupid, especially since my way of drawing is very identifiable to my friends and fans and it was pointed out to me immediately and the Deviantart people immediately banned the offenders, one time before I even got to enjoy the sight of the ridiculous offense.

It's all the same thing. The nay-sayers out there who support dishonest business need to get a clue and help the community, not hinder it by supporting this sort of behavior. Just learn the tricky differences and respect the nuances of the proper etiquette.

And that's all I have to say about that.
 

Bilious

Active Member
P.S. I know nothing about that other site that's currently being discussed.

It is important to avoid witch hunts, blah blah blah. Even if he's not discussing the points properly, at least it was removed and he seems to be trying to only list "confirmed" recasting.

Still support the FB in concept at least.

Bili out.
 

AJ Quick

Well-Known Member
For as many "Art theft Alert" websites out there for the graphic arts community, I'm HAPPY to see a "recaster alert" site out there for the same community protection. The internet is full of wiseguys thinking there's an easy way to work around putting the real work in. This facebook is a fabulous idea for all of those prop makers and costumers out there who are trying to get their own names out there and start a business, hobby-side-business or more.
The thing is. That Facebook page wasn't created to be a haven of information or place to post alerts. It was done as a way for 1 person to push his personal agenda to other people, under the disguise of it being a helpful 'recaster' alert page. It is worse that no one knows who exactly that person is that is running it, and they just made their intentions on how it will be run clearly. No proof is required when the page is the one making a baseless claim. Anyone who disagrees will be silenced.

The person running the page could be a recaster themselves looking to out his competition for all we know.
 

Bilious

Active Member
The thing is. That Facebook page wasn't created to be a haven of information or place to post alerts. It was done as a way for 1 person to push his personal agenda to other people, under the disguise of it being a helpful 'recaster' alert page. It is worse that no one knows who exactly that person is that is running it, and they just made their intentions on how it will be run clearly. No proof is required when the page is the one making a baseless claim. Anyone who disagrees will be silenced.

The person running the page could be a recaster themselves looking to out his competition for all we know.
Eeesh good point. |B I love the idea in theory, but from what you guys are saying it's not being managed properly at all. I agree, and find it strange that whoever started the page isn't stepping up to say "Hi guys it's me, let's do this right."

The art-related "beware" sites I've seen often do allow for discussion to happen, often for updates on bad situations (Like I've seen people call out bad-business here on RPF) or for the artist themselves to step forward and clarify (or condemn) themselves. They only moderate it in some cases when it's escalated into lemming-style flames that don't help anything.

It's a shame that doesn't seem to be going on here.

There's always the danger of finger pointing to get out of control but... Sigh. If they really remain anon and keep their agenda up, perhaps someone non-anon (finger on nose- not it!) start another community and list them as being not reliable? In retrospect, that would lead to an endless cycle of muddying of waters, though.

Man, it all boils down to intellectual property and art on the Internet is Srs Bsns. This all saddens me.

But hopefully none of this ongoing fear will stop anyone from doing their runs and passion work.
 

jasonw2112

Sr Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
Yep! If they can't fess up, and tell us who they are, they have no balls!

That's why I put my actual name in my avatar, I've got nothing to hide!

Mr, "Facebook" basically doesn't exist!


The thing is. That Facebook page wasn't created to be a haven of information or place to post alerts. It was done as a way for 1 person to push his personal agenda to other people, under the disguise of it being a helpful 'recaster' alert page. It is worse that no one knows who exactly that person is that is running it, and they just made their intentions on how it will be run clearly. No proof is required when the page is the one making a baseless claim. Anyone who disagrees will be silenced.

The person running the page could be a recaster themselves looking to out his competition for all we know.
 

Bilious

Active Member
I think I got confused originally to think the OP of this thread was the creator of the FB account, somehow I missed where that got clarified (if it did!) and wasn't even considering that issue at first. Will have to comb the thread again for those details I overlooked while catching up.

How ridiculous! The internet: Never a dull moment.
 

Bilious

Active Member
I always think of this when someone says something about someone or something else on the internet. It makes me smile every time.
HAH. Yes. Exactly my thoughts too XD

I understand people's reputations are at line in some cases... but it usually boils down to the above. I like to think that when consulting lists like this, the people searching for answers will consider the source. If the general reputation in the core communities (Like RPF) for a thing understand so-and-so is a biased source, it will get around to the right ears. Or so one can hope.
 

EvilRocketeer

Master Member
I think I got confused originally to think the OP of this thread was the creator of the FB account,

thest.louiskid = steven = movie prop replica recasters

his reasoning to delete that post is hilarious....

"wasnt constructive yet some still felt the need to discuss further".....

it wasnt constructive because slk wasnt giving any proof to the matter...when things didnt go his way....he ran off and hid behind the movie prop replica recasters group name to comment...when you accuse someone of wrong doing, you need to have proof to back up your comments....he slander a perfect website forum because things didnt go his way years ago and he had to still cry about it 5 years later......and here is proof to show proptopia didnt support recasters.....Proptopia banned the user Prop Fan for recasting a trigger tip ring.....it happened at the same time slk had his little incident with GbCam.......

http://www.therpf.com/f9/prop-fan-recasting-my-trigger-tip-ring-46533/index3.html
 
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Utinni

Sr Member
Well, we know Steven M. is TheSt.LouisKid. We don't have 100% proof that he is the Admin of that board. However, the context of the issue and obvious grudge against Proptopia and Sean B. as well as him starting this thread a couple days after the FB page was started and him the only one pipping up against Proptopia in the now deleted and hidden thread... it's hard to not connect the 2. If it's not him, I'm sure he's directly linked in some way.

There just isn't that many people that were banned from Proptopia with as much of a grudge as he seems to hold. Proptopia has always been a small board, made mainly of long time friends that know each other off the board as well, in the last year or so I'd say majority of us were spending more time off the board with each other than on it. It's always been made up of a core group of less than ~30 people. So most of us know pretty much everything going on over there. We tend to weed the Clownshoes out rather fast. So that's why we've been up in arms over this whole thing, it's our clubhouse, our 2nd home away from Sean's garage , lol. The attack felt personal.

I'm sure this whole thing will be forgotten by the masses by next week, but just be aware that the Admin(s) of that board do not follow their own rules and is a self serving board. I wouldn't trust a thing they post...

And I'll just leave it at that.

- Jeff
 

AParrette

New Member
this is starting to really get good

and i resent the post count comments very early in the thread
i'd rather read and enjoy the forum than to blather out the garbage that comes from my mouth

the train just flipped on their brakes, lets see if it can stop before killing a bus full of orphans, kittens, puppies and nuns.
 
jeez... here we go again :lol
Look, I don't care who recasts what from who especially when it's property of the OFFICIAL rights holders. I'm not defending the actions of these people but it's kinda silly and funny when people say they were ripped off by having an item copied when the original "artist" ripped it off from the rights holders.:lol
Seriously people putting a facebook page is only drawing attention to you from the rights holders. Once they get wind of the people selling items they will start going after the recasters AND the person who selling it "originally" :facepalm

I don't care if an artist makes a prop totally from scratch or copies a screen used prop that was used in a film (Star Trek as an example) let's use a phaser for an example. Joe makes a STIII phaser (cast from a screen used or not) but sells it as a phaser, we all know its a phaser. it gets copied, the "artist" complains "this guy recasted MY kit! In fact it isn't your kit and you in fact ripped off the studios and didn't pay them a dime for selling their property.
So all this "recasters awareness" is only making the studios aware of both parties. Think it about it:behave

Then in time everyone will start complaining there isn't any runs or offerings anymore because stupid actions like this got all the recasters and "artists" C&D'ed

Face it, we all don't like it but there is NOTHING we can do about it except live it and move on but putting a facebook page naming the recaster and the person who they recast from brings attention to the studios to who is selling recasts and who is selling or sold the original..... total bonehead idea people.
Oh, just because the original person is not selling it anymore the studios do have the legal right to request records of previous sales and still come after you.

just saying...
This guy is a golden god
 
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