Predator undermask?

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munson

New Member
Hello fellow hunters.

I need some advice. . .

I want to start building my first Predator undermask. (I apologize if I don't have the correct terminology yet). I ordered a book from The Monster Makers for detailed information and a guide, considering I never build one before. I just have a few questions that weren't asked in this thread (I looked through pages 1-4 and couldn't find a question like mine).

What clay is best to sculpt with if I would sculpt over a few days/weeks and how much clay is typically used in a full mask? What works best for you?

I also have an additional question that would determine the style of the mouth during the sculpture. I have a theory on how to make the mouth open and close. With making a latex mask, would the mouth be able to move from the closed position to the open position and back to the closed position without the latex ripping? If it wouldn't rip, it seems like I should sculpt the mouth open for the extra skin to close--does this make sense?

Thanks in advance for your responses and information, I greatly appreciate it.

Happy Hunting!
 

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spankygnarkill

New Member
Hello fellow hunters.

I need some advice. . .

I want to start building my first Predator undermask. (I apologize if I don't have the correct terminology yet). I ordered a book from The Monster Makers for detailed information and a guide, considering I never build one before. I just have a few questions that weren't asked in this thread (I looked through pages 1-4 and couldn't find a question like mine).

What clay is best to sculpt with if I would sculpt over a few days/weeks and how much clay is typically used in a full mask? What works best for you?

I also have an additional question that would determine the style of the mouth during the sculpture. I have a theory on how to make the mouth open and close. With making a latex mask, would the mouth be able to move from the closed position to the open position and back to the closed position without the latex ripping? If it wouldn't rip, it seems like I should sculpt the mouth open for the extra skin to close--does this make sense?

Well use an oil based clay, they should have some on monstermakers if i remember correctly.
I don't know how much is typically used though :D


And heres the problem of making a mask that moves. You need a few things. You need an undermask, and you need the latex face part. And you would need to make a special latex mask, cause alot of the masks that you see here aren't designed to move as much as you thinking. The only person who has made an affordable moving latex mask is Grusderk, and he's been off the grid for a while. And his masks weren't exactly of that high quality, so he kinda vanished a little bit ago and no ones been able to get a hold of him for a while.

Grusderk Complaint 1
Grusderk Complaint 2

Theres a thread thats talking about trying to improve on the system, but its proving to be tricky adn complicated.

Improving on the Grusderk System

My advice: buy a regular mask in the meantime, and paint that up, and wait for someone to think of something relatively cheap. And trust me, most everyone on the lair would love to get a animatronic mask that works and looks good, if you can think of comething go for it. Im just saying, its alot more trouble than its worth to me.
 

munson

New Member
Thank You for your response SpankyGNARKILL,

I will check out The Monster Makers, as well as some local craft stores, for an oil based clay. I just need to find a mannequin head that's about as big as mine. :D But since the oil based clay will allow me to sculpt over a few weeks without it cracking, that would be a bonus--I wouldn't have to buy a lump some of clay and work on it quickly.

But how would you make the oil based clay ready to go to the next step in the mask making process?

I took a look at his masks, and my theory is very different then his. I'm making a prototype for me to see how it will work. I still want to take a crack at it.

Here is a video from youtube with his working mask:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XYP6rGn_k0M...feature=related

What type of special mask would be needed? One that's big enough to incorporate an the system?

Thanks and happy hunting!
 

MasterAnubis

New Member
I will check out The Monster Makers, as well as some local craft stores, for an oil based clay. I just need to find a mannequin head that's about as big as mine.
Check to see if you have a sculplting supply near you. I was able to find a great local source of clay doing that.
http://www.arizonasculpture.com/
They wouldn't be a good match for you being on the other side of the country, but they would be willing to awnser questions.

Also, the word your going to use for the maniquin head would be armature. I know Monster Makers head armatures looks pretty standard. Other places would have them too. I doubt that any maniquin head would be big enough. :D But with enough clay it probably wont matter.


But how would you make the oil based clay ready to go to the next step in the mask making process?
This is a mold making question. Some people will clear coat the clay. With sulfer based clay its required and no one I know uses sulfer based clay anymore. Then you just make your mold.


What type of special mask would be needed? One that's big enough to incorporate an the system?
Did you read through the links SpankyGNARKILL gave you? The mask would need to be made to the system for best results.
 

spankygnarkill

New Member
Thank You for your response SpankyGNARKILL,

I took a look at his masks, and my theory is very different then his. I'm making a prototype for me to see how it will work. I still want to take a crack at it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XYP6rGn_k0M...feature=related

What type of special mask would be needed? One that's big enough to incorporate an the system?

You need to make a special mask for that system, or for any system such as that. The latex would need tobe molded thicker in different places, thinner in different places, and it's be a mess if it anything goes wrong. You need to design an underskull system, and then cast a mask on top of that system.
 

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munson

New Member
You need to make a special mask for that system, or for any system such as that. The latex would need tobe molded thicker in different places, thinner in different places, and it's be a mess if it anything goes wrong. You need to design an underskull system, and then cast a mask on top of that system.
I'm in the process of designing an underskull system. I pretty much have a design drawn up for the mandibles and a theory of how to make them open/close. I'm in the process of designing a "skull cap" and how to connect it all. I want to be able to put the system on like a football helmet. That's the plan so far.

You mentioned about making the latex thicker in certain spots. Is that to support an underskull system or to make it thicker so that the mandibles could move without tearing the latex mask? Or both?

About casting a mask on top of the system. Do you mean one that will be big enough to hold the system and my head? I imagine it would be better if I construct the system first, that way I can measure the overall dimensions and make the sculpture big enough to hold all of it.

But thanks for the information, I greatly appreciate it!

I was going to contact Usurper about a mask, but I want to take a crack at it. I know it isn't easy, but I still want to give it a go.
 

spankygnarkill

New Member
I'm in the process of designing an underskull system. I pretty much have a design drawn up for the mandibles and a theory of how to make them open/close. I'm in the process of designing a "skull cap" and how to connect it all. I want to be able to put the system on like a football helmet. That's the plan so far.

You mentioned about making the latex thicker in certain spots. Is that to support an underskull system or to make it thicker so that the mandibles could move without tearing the latex mask? Or both?

About casting a mask on top of the system. Do you mean one that will be big enough to hold the system and my head? I imagine it would be better if I construct the system first, that way I can measure the overall dimensions and make the sculpture big enough to hold all of it.

But thanks for the information, I greatly appreciate it!

I was going to contact Usurper about a mask, but I want to take a crack at it. I know it isn't easy, but I still want to give it a go.
The latex would be thicker and thinner in different spots to make it so it doesn't rip. And it is better to construct the underskull first so you can make sure it all fits inside the mask. And Usurper feel free to correct me but i dont think his masks are designed to give full motion liker your looking for
 

munson

New Member
Maybe you're right, it might very well be a tough challenge. Especially since I never made a mask before.
 

spankygnarkill

New Member
I mean, if you still want to go for it, then more power to you. if you can figure out a way to make one cost effective and good, then go for it. I'd start out with making a none moving one, or shelling out the cash to get one from some one else.

Dont let me crush your spirit man, i just wanna make sure you know what your getting into.
 

munson

New Member
I mean, if you still want to go for it, then more power to you. if you can figure out a way to make one cost effective and good, then go for it. I'd start out with making a none moving one, or shelling out the cash to get one from some one else.

Dont let me crush your spirit man, i just wanna make sure you know what your getting into.
I've sent Usurper a pm about a mask, I really like his Wolf Predator--it's sweet! He's a sculpture I would like to strive to be like. Even being half as good as he is, I'd be happy.

I've priced all the material for the mandibles alone and it should be around $30 (local hardware store). I looked at Usupers' "review" of the Grusderk's fiberglass design and opted for a ski mask to go right over my head. The design Grusderk is one that to me, and in my opine, I'm very skeptical about. For some initial foam, I'm going to tare apart a ATV/Dirt Bike helmet and use that foam inside it since it's shaped to my head already. I was going to take a basic hockey mask (Jason version) and cut it up for added support for the ski mask and to hold the mandibles. This would be my first attempt: "Prototype V1".

What has me worried is that I've never made a mask. I'm a little lost on making the mask thicker in some spots. I've purchased a book from The Monster Makers for a guide since I really didn't find any thread about making a mask.

My initial goal (which is as big as Mt. Everest) is to make a fully body suit as close to the movie as possible. Some parts I would find and purchase of my fellow hunters (if they would be so kind to see some). I really like the dual plasma canon's the one hunter is selling, I just don't have the $250 for it.
 

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Usurper

Well-Known Member
My masks are DESIGEND to look like predators.

Having said that mine are made medium to thick, but latex is a very flexible material, and i would not see a problem getting MOST masks lower jaws to work as long as the mechanism is well made, alot depends on the design of the sculpt.
 

munson

New Member
My masks are DESIGEND to look like predators.

Having said that mine are made medium to thick, but latex is a very flexible material, and i would not see a problem getting MOST masks lower jaws to work as long as the mechanism is well made, alot depends on the design of the sculpt.
Thanks for the advice Usurper, I appreciate it. Would you be as kind to lend a novice some sculpting advice?
 

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