Paint crinkling on my 1:24 TIE - Looking for input and advice on repairs.

[skahtul]

Awesome RPF members, looking for a bit of input on what you think might have gone wrong here. I am also looking for advice on the best way you blend in repairs?

I am pretty terrible and fixing paint jobs so far as they stick out like a sore thumb when I attempt them... I really don't want to re-paint the entire model and may just leave it as-is unless it gets worse. If I had airbrushed this it would be much easier but as you will see below it was done with a spray can.

You do not notice it until you get super close to it. I never even noticed it before until I took a super close picture yesterday...

Here are my finishing processes for this part of the 3D Print.
-Light sanding
-Wipe down with lint-free cloth and alcohol
-Tamiya Fine Surface Primer
-Wait at least a day for this to be 100% dry
-Paint with 2 or 3 coats of paint, in this case, I used > Rust-Oleum Painters Touch Ultra Cover Slate Blue (which is an excellent TIE color IMHO).
-Gloss Coate with Tamiya TS-13
-Decal and weather with Abteilung oil paints (thinned with Kleen Strip Mineral Spirits)
-(I have since moved away from that thinner and now use Abteilung's own Odourless Thinner, it seems WAY less harsh on the paint jobs).
-I let the oil paints dry for at least a week.
-Final coat is 2 or 3 coats of Tamiya TS-80 flat.

This is a similar process I have used on a bunch of models, the only real difference is the Rust-Oleum paint. I 'suspect' after reading the label more carefully that this paint takes 5-7 days to fully bond to plastic which could have been my issue?

I know it was the first part of October when I finished this so it was still warmish out here. As it starts to cool down I usually paint in the garage, let it sit for a minute or so, and then bring it inside where it's warmer.

I don't know when it happened but it was sometime in the last few weeks I 'think'. I also only see it on this one part of the model, so far.

Any and all input welcome, thanks in advance!!!

 

[joberg]

Well, these are marks that a fast re-entry creates. I would leave those as they are great wear and tear effects (my 2 cents of course)

 

[skahtul]

Well, these are marks that a fast re-entry creates. I would leave those as they are great wear and tear effects (my 2 cents of course)

That's amazing, I was just telling my kids earlier today that I like doing star wars models as most mistakes can just be left alone or with a bit more paint easily turned into weathering and damage

 

[Rogviler]

Tamiya is lacquer, Rustoleum is enamel. When you put lacquer on top of enamel it eats it, which leads to lifting/crinkling. Unfortunately you would have to repaint it to solve the issue. Although that's a great color, you would have to find a compatible paint if you're dead set on using the Tamiya clears, or find a clear that's compatible with the Rustoleum. Definitely run a test piece before committing to the model.

 

[TazMan2000]

Try and stick with one paint brand, if possible. Before you used different types of paint, try and test them out to see if they react. Keep in mind the reaction may take weeks, but it will save you a lot of re-work if something does react poorly.. Mineral spirits can be used to thin paint, so your weathering method may have contributed to the paint crinkle as it seems like where the weathering was, the crinkle was more evident.

Just because you mix paint types won't guarantee bad results. It depends on the chemicals in each paint that react with one another and the application method...i.e. spray can, airbrush. Temperature plays a big part as well.

Paint manufacturers will change their formulas from time to time, sometimes in order to save money, and other times to comply with EPA guidelines. So just because there is no reaction in the past with that brand, it doesn't mean there won't be a reaction next time you use it.

TazMan2000

 

[Jedi Dade]

Rogviler Beat me to it - you're mixing types of paint. I think its "OK" to mix types of paint when doing some weathering but not for base coats and primers. but its best to stick with one type and use clear coats to "seal" things before switching types of paints.

If you want to use that color as your base color - primer with a rustoleum primer (lots of light coats - you may want to decant it into your airbrush as the primer comes out heavy from the can in my experience.

Jedi Dade

 

[rbeach84]

Yup lacquer thinner is great for cleaning up most any other type of paint and hence nigh impossible to apply over other types especially a 'wet' coat. You might consider letting the model set on a shelf to cure for a couple of weeks. If the crazing is restricted to a few spots, mask around those panels, give a light sanding and see how it looks, repaint if necessary. If you can live with the results, temper your remediation efforts accordingly.
Basic rules: lacquer paint and thinners can not go over acrylics or enamels or even plastic in heavy wet coats. It dries fast though because it is so volatile. Not bothered by acrylic or enamel overcoats. Adhesion to plastic is excellent due to the solvent action.
Arylics are good under enamels and oils, as long as you stick with the more gentle thinners. They dry relatively quickly but take a while to cure; low setting hairdryer can speed up the process. Creates a film and adhesion is always a consideration.
Enamels can go over acrylics and lacquers of course and are slower to cure fully, sometimes a week or more. Oil paints are similar.
Hope this helps!
Regards, Robert

 

[skahtul]

Thanks, everyone for all the great advice. I certainly have changed my processes a bit for sure after reading all your replies. I do typically let my oil paints dry for at least a week before I flat coat everything but other than that I for sure have some areas of improvement.


Thanks!

 

[Analyzer]

For oils you might also consider "water-mixable" oils. They are oil paints and work the same way, the difference being they can be thinned/cleaned with water instead of turpenoid and other more toxic thinners

The other benefit to those is the wash/thinner will not interact with Bandai plastic if it is seeps into joints and stuff

Windsor-Netwon makes some nice ones ( I think they are branded as Aristan Oils)

 

[rbeach84]

Indeed! As do we all!

 

[JSConnolly]

Awesome RPF members, looking for a bit of input on what you think might have gone wrong here. I am also looking for advice on the best way you blend in repairs?

I am pretty terrible and fixing paint jobs so far as they stick out like a sore thumb when I attempt them... I really don't want to re-paint the entire model and may just leave it as-is unless it gets worse. If I had airbrushed this it would be much easier but as you will see below it was done with a spray can.

You do not notice it until you get super close to it. I never even noticed it before until I took a super close picture yesterday...

Here are my finishing processes for this part of the 3D Print.
-Light sanding
-Wipe down with lint-free cloth and alcohol
-Tamiya Fine Surface Primer
-Wait at least a day for this to be 100% dry
-Paint with 2 or 3 coats of paint, in this case, I used > Rust-Oleum Painters Touch Ultra Cover Slate Blue (which is an excellent TIE color IMHO).
-Gloss Coate with Tamiya TS-13
-Decal and weather with Abteilung oil paints (thinned with Kleen Strip Mineral Spirits)
-(I have since moved away from that thinner and now use Abteilung's own Odourless Thinner, it seems WAY less harsh on the paint jobs).
-I let the oil paints dry for at least a week.
-Final coat is 2 or 3 coats of Tamiya TS-80 flat.

This is a similar process I have used on a bunch of models, the only real difference is the Rust-Oleum paint. I 'suspect' after reading the label more carefully that this paint takes 5-7 days to fully bond to plastic which could have been my issue?

I know it was the first part of October when I finished this so it was still warmish out here. As it starts to cool down I usually paint in the garage, let it sit for a minute or so, and then bring it inside where it's warmer.

I don't know when it happened but it was sometime in the last few weeks I 'think'. I also only see it on this one part of the model, so far.

Any and all input welcome, thanks in advance!!!

View attachment 1370263

ALSO... if you are using a "RATTLE CAN" then Put it into a Bath of SUPER HOT WATER UPSIDE DOWN!
If you are using an "AIR BRUSH"... Put the Paint onto a similar "BATH" of Uber HOT Water AND Run your Air Line through that type of bath!
I use an "Aquarium Heater" in a Large Glass Pickle Jar for my "Heat Bath" for the cord and I cut out Two "U-SHAPED NOTCHES" In the Lid so I can close the jar!
I keep it set at a pretty High Heat!
THIS will ensure that the Thinners in the paint "CURE" VERY Quickly!

I do this with ALL of my paintings and it WORKS!

When I've built Models of Vintage Dirt Track Modified Stock Cars where the Frames are ALL "WHITE" I encountered this,
and guys in all three of my model clubs that I belong to said this EXACT Same thing that I am imparting to YOU Now!

Good Luck!

I THINK this looks AWESOME!!!

Just Sayin'!

Joe

 

[JSConnolly]

ALSO... if you are using a "RATTLE CAN" then Put it into a Bath of SUPER HOT WATER UPSIDE DOWN!
If you are using an "AIR BRUSH"... Put the Paint onto a similar "BATH" of Uber HOT Water AND Run your Air Line through that type of bath!
I use an "Aquarium Heater" in a Large Glass Pickle Jar for my "Heat Bath" for the cord and I cut out Two "U-SHAPED NOTCHES" In the Lid so I can close the jar!
I keep it set at a pretty High Heat!
THIS will ensure that the Thinners in the paint "CURE" VERY Quickly!

I do this with ALL of my paintings and it WORKS!

When I've built Models of Vintage Dirt Track Modified Stock Cars where the Frames are ALL "WHITE" I encountered this,
and guys in all three of my model clubs that I belong to said this EXACT Same thing that I am imparting to YOU Now!

Good Luck!

I THINK this looks AWESOME!!!

Just Sayin'!

Joe

ALSO I will add... In THIS case where you already HAVE SUCH a Nice Model and I wouldn't want to destroy the OTHER Painted parts...

I would "Light Sand" the "Crinkled" areas then us a matching "Acrylic" paint and literally "BRUSH" paint the effected areas for the repair.
That's what I would do in this case!
For FUTURE Paint jobs... do the "Heating" Process!

Good Luck. And My the Force Be With You!

Joe

 

[skahtul]

ALSO I will add... In THIS case where you already HAVE SUCH a Nice Model and I wouldn't want to destroy the OTHER Painted parts...

I would "Light Sand" the "Crinkled" areas then us a matching "Acrylic" paint and literally "BRUSH" paint the effected areas for the repair.
That's what I would do in this case!
For FUTURE Paint jobs... do the "Heating" Process!

Good Luck. And My the Force Be With You!

Joe

Awesome, thanks for both posts and advice. Normally on models this large I do use a rattle can. All my small models I airbrush and I have not had any issues there.

I have been doing some experiments and one of those was using a less 'harsh' thinner with my oil paints.

I will give the hot water bath a try for sure, I have a new project I am working on that is much larger than this one so I will give some of your tips a try for sure.

I have not noticed that it's any worse so for now I have just left it alone, but the future will tell

Thanks again.

 

[JSConnolly]

Yea the "Hot Water Bath" works BECAUSE of the Propellant AND Solvent within the rattle can!
When they are heated up they Expand AND make paint flow MUCH Better eliminating "Orange Pee" AND Crackling!

I first found this out from old "Military Modelers" back in the 80's when I was in High School.
There are some GREAT Modeling and Model Painting Books available that talk about this too!

I have two of the Newly Released "TIE" Fighter Toys AND a Darth Vader Tie X-1 Advanced that I plan to re-paint!

The Regular "TIES" are all great... but the Darth Vader Tie Advanced needs ALOT of Re-Work with the Body and all SORTS of things!

I have the Accurate Blue Prints and I sized them on a copier so that I have accurate reverence for what needs to be corrected!
It will ALSO Get Lights and Sound effects courtesy of a cheap "Power Sword" that I bought for sale when the K-Mart near me closed up!
They were selling things at Bargain Basement Prices and I snagged the DV Tie Advanced toy for $10.00. and the Power Sword for $2.00.
The Tie's Box was all beat to **** but the TOY was in Perfect Shape!

I MIGHT Post pics of it here when I start on THAT Project!

Joe