Logan's Run ---- Life Clock

Discussion in 'Replica Props' started by Jintosh, Aug 13, 2015.

  1. Jintosh

    Jintosh Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    IMG_8688.jpg

    Yellow%20lifeclock%20closeup%20small.jpg

    The top image is of Kathy's crystals. The bottom image is of a crystal from Barry Lasky and purportedly an actual prop.

    I used these as reference to make a 3D file in Tinkercad. (pic to follow soon)

    IMG_8688.jpg

    Yellow%20lifeclock%20closeup%20small.jpg
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 8, 2018
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  2. Jintosh

    Jintosh Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Re: Logan's Run -------------------------- Life Clock

    lifeclock.jpg

    Here is the 3D file in Tinkercad. This is the original file before weathering.
    The outside ring is simple. I used only 2 shapes and just alternated them and tilted appropriately.
     
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  3. Jintosh

    Jintosh Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Re: Logan's Run -------------------------- Life Clock

    Crystal 2.jpg

    And here's with weathering using Zbrush's smooth tool. With crystal for comparison.
     
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  4. DrMcoy

    DrMcoy Sr Member

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    Re: Logan's Run -------------------------- Life Clock

    cool project
     
  5. Jintosh

    Jintosh Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Re: Logan's Run -------------------------- Life Clock

    Thanks, mine will be with some kind of reflective backing. The other team is working on possibly adding a battery and light source to theirs.
    Should be interesting either way.
     
  6. jonny5

    jonny5 Sr Member

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    Re: Logan's Run -------------------------- Life Clock

    Why trouble with a reflective backing? Wouldn't the right size watch battery suffice as a reflective surface?
     
  7. Jintosh

    Jintosh Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Re: Logan's Run -------------------------- Life Clock

    A battery, yes, anything metal would probably do. Apparently past replicas have simply used a small piece of aluminum foil.
    I'll probably try several things with different crystals.
     
  8. Apollo

    Apollo Legendary Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Re: Logan's Run -------------------------- Life Clock

    That is what the Screen Used props had



     
  9. nomuse

    nomuse Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Re: Logan's Run -------------------------- Life Clock

    Looks good. I'm thinking that the smoothing is more an artifact of both whatever casting process they used on the film, and the presumed casting from a film-used (possibly stunt version) for the one we all seem to have bought at a long-ago convention (I have a red one lurking around somewhere at the bottom of a drawer). Given the uncomfortable look of some of the tech end in the movie I wouldn't be surprised if the original intent wasn't fairly defined edges.

    Anyhow. Minor quibble; to my eye, the inside edges of the "petals" on your model -- where they face the center -- are a slightly more acute angle than what is shown on the sample prop. It is closer to a straight line there...10-15 degrees maybe? Otherwise, it seems very close.
     
  10. Jintosh

    Jintosh Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Re: Logan's Run -------------------------- Life Clock

    Some match better than others. I'll settle for very close. :)
     
  11. nomuse

    nomuse Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Re: Logan's Run -------------------------- Life Clock

    Don't disagree, and don't want to quibble. But to my eye, one of the things that comes out of the overall look is the sort of two-zone definition; the core, surrounded by the petals. This look happens in the sample because of the roughly parallel lines between inner and outer elements creating a space there:

    Crystal 2mod.jpg

    But I totally understand if other people interpret the shapes differently! You saw a LOT more than I did when I took a first glance at is (such as the way the pair of petals are taller to the outside and taper in....)
     
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  12. Jintosh

    Jintosh Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Re: Logan's Run -------------------------- Life Clock

    Yes, subtle. But there. The large outside petal is hard to define because all the prop petals are rounded and "soft".

    I'll have to go back to the Sharp version of my replica, make the change, and then smooth it again.
     
  13. Jintosh

    Jintosh Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Re: Logan's Run -------------------------- Life Clock

    Crystal 3.jpg

    Okay, here's the new sculpt.
     
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  14. BlindSquirrel

    BlindSquirrel Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Re: Logan's Run -------------------------- Life Clock

    Looking great! I'm hoping you'll be doing a RUN (see what I did there?) of these! I need one to sit by my Sleeper Gun.
     
  15. Jintosh

    Jintosh Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Re: Logan's Run -------------------------- Life Clock

    nomuse was actually very helpful. Hopefully, he'll come back and examine the new design. I need to know if any more changes need to be made before sending the new design off to Shapeways. I've got the prototype design coming on Tuesday, so I'll be able to experiment with that before the updated design arrives. (the one I haven't even sent yet.) :)
     
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  16. Apollo

    Apollo Legendary Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Re: Logan's Run -------------------------- Life Clock

    Looks good needs to be concave though
     
  17. Jintosh

    Jintosh Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Re: Logan's Run -------------------------- Life Clock

    ummmmmm........................

    :eek

    I start to see why the other guy just wanted to cast copies of the one he had.

    1. how important is concave ?
    2. What is the width of the crystal ? (prototype is roughly 1 inch)
     
  18. Apollo

    Apollo Legendary Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Re: Logan's Run -------------------------- Life Clock

    Only important if you are going for what was used on the Production.

    Yeah these are NOT easy to do slipping one in silicone would be much easier. :lol

    Yours looks fine :thumbsup
     
  19. Jintosh

    Jintosh Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Re: Logan's Run -------------------------- Life Clock

    Okay, I found a way to make the surface slightly concave in Tinkercad. Still have to smooth it out in Zbrush. Picture coming later.
     
  20. nomuse

    nomuse Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Re: Logan's Run -------------------------- Life Clock

    Been following with interest. I think you see a lot more of this thing than I do...I'm pretty much playing catch-up.

    Concave? Well, yeah, the bottom I suppose. For comfort (although I remember the one I purchased at a con so long ago always seemed to dig into the tendons..!) Top surface seems, aesthetically, flat, but that's just me reacting to the Dallas Shopping Center architecture look of the rest of the film. I suppose the center diamonds might be slightly fatter and fill in the space a little more solidly, but that could easily be the light and I wouldn't sweat it!
     
  21. Jintosh

    Jintosh Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Re: Logan's Run -------------------------- Life Clock

    crystal 20.jpg

    Ah. Found it. Yes, even the top surface appears concave. Slightly.
     
  22. Jintosh

    Jintosh Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Re: Logan's Run -------------------------- Life Clock

    Crystal 4.jpg

    It's hard to tell, but it is slightly concave. I also adjusted the shape of some of the petals to improve accuracy.

    I think I'm ready to send this as final model to Shapeways.
     
    Last edited: Aug 17, 2015
  23. Jintosh

    Jintosh Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Re: Logan's Run -------------------------- Life Clock

    Received my prototype, just have to find time to mold it.
     
  24. 19narvik40

    19narvik40 Well-Known Member

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    Re: Logan's Run -------------------------- Life Clock

    I can see by your statement here you are continuing with your baseless accusation that I am casting copies of the Life Clock. As I clearly stated in several posts, I am revamping my personally bought crystal. At no time have I declared or even hinted I was going to make available or sell any thing. Unless you can provide irrefutable evidence to the contrary I will have to insist you refrain from making these statements. I personally believe your grievance with me is that you would have competition selling your product as you had stated in an earlier post that you hated I was taking, as you phrased it "a shortcut". I hope you sleep sounder tonight knowing I have no intention and never have had any intention of offering copies of the crystal and your path to fame and fortune are, at least form me, free of obstacles.

    Oh and by the way, the concave shape is likely so it would fit better in the actors palms. The rounded surface on the bottom would gives a larger surface for the glue and therefore better adhesion to the actors hand as the palm is convex by nature. Have several items glued to my hands and appendages gives me some personal experience with this subject,

     
  25. Jintosh

    Jintosh Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Re: Logan's Run -------------------------- Life Clock

    Okay. I will refrain from any more such comments. And I apologize for that last one.

    Thank you for the advice on the convex shape, and as stated, I think your idea to add an actual light is a cool one.
     
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  26. 19narvik40

    19narvik40 Well-Known Member

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    Re: Logan's Run -------------------------- Life Clock

    Jintosh, Thank you for that sir. We can now leave all that behind us and get back to enjoying this hobby.

    To be honest, I think your 3D model might hold the key to how to mount the light and battery. The idea I have is that the crystal needs to be in hollow and in two parts to allow for mounting the components and to be able to change the battery, do repairs, that sort of thing. The issue is how much room is needed and how would this effect the size of the printed crystal.

    I have been haunting model kit lighting sites and watching a ton of Youtube tutorials without coming to a clear conclusion as to what would work best. Then there is the issue of the reflective backing and how to apply it. Putting it on the outside exposes it to the glue and possible damage. Putting it inside may hinder the lights ability to shine bright enough to be any good. I had considered chroming the back side. From what I have seen online, I would need to have a separate bottom section unless I want to chrome the entire crystal. That leads me back to your 3D model. It would be the easiest way to make a two piece model but without the measurements it would be only a guess and probably not a good one at that.

    Once you have your master, were you going to mold it and cast in clear resin? Would you be tinting them to the different stages of life in the dome? What are your thoughts about the reflective surface? So many questions, so little time.
     
  27. Jintosh

    Jintosh Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Re: Logan's Run -------------------------- Life Clock

    I've done one clear casting before, but tinting is new to me. I've ordered translucent green, red, and yellow. I think some combination of green / yellow might match the prop green color. It doesn't look like straight green to me.

    A 3d model would allow you to control the size of the two pieces of the crystal. You could make a basic design where the back is one piece and the main part of the crystal is a separate piece. I found some chromed finish sequins that shine through the crystal to provide a good brightness. They are a chromed stiff plastic, but paper thin. That might allow you to better incorporate them into your design.
     
  28. Jintosh

    Jintosh Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Re: Logan's Run -------------------------- Life Clock

    IMG_0596.JPG IMG_0594.JPG

    Here's the Shapeways crystal. It's not especially clear, but you can still see the effect of the chrome sequin.
    So much more light is coming off the crystal (the right one) that the camera is darkening the shot to compensate for the light.
    The effect should be even better with the castings since they'll have greater translucency.
     
  29. 19narvik40

    19narvik40 Well-Known Member

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    Re: Logan's Run -------------------------- Life Clock

    Now I just need to determine how much space I need for the components.

    - - - Updated - - -

    The difference with the chrome sequin is night and day. It also must be said that the surface relief is just the sort of thing I had in mind to do to mine. Yours is far better than I thought I get after I monkeyed with it. What diameter did you settle at? It could make the difference for which power supply to use.
     
  30. Jintosh

    Jintosh Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Re: Logan's Run -------------------------- Life Clock

    Yes, size. This one is slightly smaller than 1 inch. About 24 mm total width. But 1 inch is a good ballpark. Some of the petals extend slightly outside of the round base. So you could make the base circle 1 inch and the petals would be slightly outside of the circle. I haven't submitted my final concave design yet and haven't decided on an exact size.
     
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2015
  31. Jintosh

    Jintosh Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Re: Logan's Run -------------------------- Life Clock

    Sorry for the bit of drama folks, it has been resolved and I will hopefully get to cast my prototype next week to play with color tinting.
     
  32. captjack

    captjack New Member

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    Re: Logan's Run -------------------------- Life Clock

    Look Great!

    - - - Updated - - -

    Looking really good!


     
  33. Jintosh

    Jintosh Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Re: Logan's Run -------------------------- Life Clock

    Turns out I have little skill at casting such a small item. I would like a slightly curved back AND curved front...but a two piece mold on such a small item isn't something I appear to be good at. I even had trouble casting the Flat crystal.

    Would that be TOO ironic if I asked 19narvik40 to cast copies of it ? At this point, I would just give him the crystal (have to do the final one still from Shapeways) and let him keep any money he can make. I can't seem to cast good copies in the colors I want anyway and I feel regret about any distress I caused him.
     
  34. jhusel

    jhusel Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    I'm in for some! Can't wait to see a finished product! :)
     
  35. Jintosh

    Jintosh Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    19narvik40 has said he'll do the casting. This should be some time in the relatively near future.
     
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  36. 19narvik40

    19narvik40 Well-Known Member

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    I currently have two small issues. One - my resin supplier has not returned my calls and may still be out of town, Thinking the little * stopped off in Vegas for CES 2016.
    Second - my source for the vacuum chamber has just moved and must be approached with caution. He's kinda in the bear with a sore tooth stage. Perhaps an offering of an extra large Tim Horton's Double Double may gain me an audience. I will post when the stars have aligned and can be sure I will be able to do the castings.
     
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  37. Jintosh

    Jintosh Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    We can send him one of my Wonka Golden Tickets. ;)

    Okay, I have several projects going anyway. Possibly the Johnny Depp Golden ticket, and I'm working on the Strange coin from the Destiny game, and the Saint knife.

    Wish I had won that 1.6 Billion lotto so I didn't have to have a normal job.
     
  38. epoxinator

    epoxinator Active Member

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    RE the crystal being concave, I'm not sure they are supposed to be. I bought some in the 90's, and they were all flat. Over time, as the resin has aged, I've noticed that my crystals have shrunken a bit and curled inward. I wouldn't be surprised if even the movie props share a similar fate.

    I think these two models give a pretty good indication of how the crystals should look. The "petals" aren't curved in the larger versions in the film, as in the giant red crystal at the bottom of Carrousel (second photo.): they have sharp, faceted edges. I believe the palm crystals should be that way, too, and maybe started out that way, but in making duplicates they got rounded off a bit, similarly to how the edges of the vacuformed lifecrystal appears in the third picture.
    LifeCrystals.jpg carrousel crystal.jpg TV crystal.jpg
     
  39. Jintosh

    Jintosh Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Flat and NOT weathered ? hmmm...have to think about that. You also have to consider the concept. This is something they've worn for 30 years, and if it is some kind of acrylic (in theory) and not glass, then there could be 30 years of weathering.
     
  40. 19narvik40

    19narvik40 Well-Known Member

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    I have not been able to find an actual screen used life crystal image despite all my efforts. I have tried several Logan's Run fan pages but most are now gone. Here are a couple of links that have life crystals mentioned or displayed.
    http://www.rogermwilcox.com/LogansRun.html#movie_memorabilia - scroll about 3/4s the way down the page.
    http://www.oocities.org/area51/dimension/5357/props.htm - this page is an archived copy, doesn't seem to be online anymore. Gives an explanation of the colours.
    http://www.oocities.org/area51/Dimension/5357/clocks.htm - Not the same page as above,

    Hope this helps a bit.
     
  41. Sean

    Sean Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    I wish hydin would do a run of these In real crystal.
     
  42. epoxinator

    epoxinator Active Member

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    A photo I also just posted in another Life Crystal thread. It shows the crystals affixed to the palm under a latex prosthetic, which put the crystal at or below skin level. The prosthetic also hid the power wires. Sorry for the blur, but I was shooting my bluray on my TV screen with my phone. When I watch the film, it seems to me that the palm crystals glint like faceted crystals, not like the rounded-off copies of copies of copies we get off eBay. Also, another photo of a transparent 2" version I just printed at i.materialize.com. They offer clear and color-tinted transparent materials that aren't offered on Shapeways.com, and the transparent print was roughly the same price as a grainy opaque red one I had done at Shapeways last year.
    Palm crystal prosthetic.jpg red crystal and hand.jpg
     
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2016
  43. 19narvik40

    19narvik40 Well-Known Member

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    I also responded to your other post but I will show what I posted here. This is from the after retrogram shot.
    Palm crystal prosthetic point 01.jpg

    The other main thing I wanted to point out is that the crystal is not smooth on the edge, more like a gear from a clock.
    Palm crystal prosthetic point 02.jpg logans-run(1976)_3038crop point 03.jpg logans-run(1976)_0889croppoint 04.jpg logans-run(1976)_2433 point 05.jpg

    I'm wondering if the wires epoxinator points out could be the lines found in everyone's hand, I cupped my hand and made a similar line in my hand, Any thoughts from the rest of you?


     
  44. Jintosh

    Jintosh Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    http://www.rogermwilcox.com/LogansRun.html

    This is the page where the green crystal can be seen. Scroll down to number 16. This says that (as far as he knows) this is a copy of the crystal that would be worn by the "Extras" in the movie instead of the main characters. This is what my weathered version is based on. This is the best lineage I can find to a close up of a crystal.
     
  45. 19narvik40

    19narvik40 Well-Known Member

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    Considering the crystal he has shown is 40 years old it should be a bit worn, LOL. If you look at the images, it seems to me there could have been sharper edges on the crystal.
    Yellow lifeclock on palm small.jpg Yellow lifeclock at angle small.jpg Yellow lifeclock closeup small.jpg

    I doubt that the crystals would have worn down in the Logan's Run universe but who knows?

     
  46. Rylo

    Rylo Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Dude, you don't have to keep both threads going for the same topic...Good luck just the same.

    -Rylo

    NOTE: I've owned screen used lifeclocks. They all looked like the green one. In fact, most of the ones previously available on ebay were cast from originals. A bunch of my replicas are floating around out there, too. (Also cast from originals) Once you see one up close you can spot one a mile away.
     
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  47. Sean

    Sean Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    That did have me confused awhile ago. I'm subscribed to this one. could we please let the other one die. or at least merge them or something.
     
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  48. Jintosh

    Jintosh Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    (in the Logan's run world) I would think it would indeed be some kind of 3D printed acrylic with bio luminescence built in. The computer can't mine REAL crystal. So, the "crystal" would be installed at birth and slowly wear down by the time they have to die at age 30. (23?)
     
  49. 19narvik40

    19narvik40 Well-Known Member

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    * it jintosh, there you go making sense again, knock it off will ya?;) Okay it's a valid point but that wouldn't explain the pattern in some of the photos as the Doc and Logan were approaching their end of life. Of course they were starring roles and would have had better crystals that the extras, but still.


     
  50. epoxinator

    epoxinator Active Member

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    I presume they ARE supposed to be hard crystals, not acrylic. They do call them crystals. The whole city is pictured with crystals everywhere: in Carrousel, in the Retrogram chair, on the life clock control computers, in Arcade and in the Mazecar stations. Presumably the computer makes them somehow, as they are all the same shape though of different sizes. There are also buildings that look like they are made up of crystals (even though they look like the plastic that covers fluorescent light fixtures.)
     
    Last edited: Jan 28, 2016

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