Jurassic Park: Stan Winston 1:1 Raptor

Turdbol

New Member
Just wanted to share some photos of my 1:1 scale Stan Winston Jurassic Park Raptor! Jurassic Park is my favorite movie, and have dreamed of owning a raptor for years. When one happened to come available, I pulled the trigger immediately! Thankfully, my wife was also happy! I have no idea how to finish it, and I am scared to ruin it.....so I think I will make a mold, and then put the original here away for safe-keeping! I think of making two, one with the original JP colors, and one as "Blue" from the new Jurassic World.







Here's what it looks like complete.

 
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TJack

Master Member
Community Staff
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
so I think I will make a mold, and then put the original here away for safe-keeping! I think of making two, one with the original JP colors, and one as "Blue" from the new Jurassic World.
Does this not fall under the category of recasting someone else's work? I apologize if I'm mistaken.
 

Turdbol

New Member
Does this not fall under the category of recasting someone else's work? I apologize if I'm mistaken.
My knowledge is that it's only frowned upon if I am selling them. There is less than a 0% chance I would let one of these go for sale. I may be wrong, I am fairly new to this, but from my research here on the RPF, that's what I discovered.
 
Does this not fall under the category of recasting someone else's work? I apologize if I'm mistaken.
If he want's to make a practice cast so he doesn't dick up the real one I see no problem with that. Especially if he's not planning on selling it.
 

Turdbol

New Member
If he want's to make a practice cast so he doesn't dick up the real one I see no problem with that. Especially if he's not planning on selling it.
Thank you. I honestly have no idea what I am doing, and am so scared to ruin it. I definitely don't want to be labeled as a recaster, and that is certainly not my intent.
 

dbalschi

Sr Member
If he want's to make a practice cast so he doesn't dick up the real one I see no problem with that. Especially if he's not planning on selling it.
Except that's not what he said. He stated he wanted to make 2 copies for himself and finish those and put the original away.
 

cavx

Master Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
Does this not fall under the category of recasting someone else's work? I apologize if I'm mistaken.
My knowledge is that it's only frowned upon if I am selling them. There is less than a 0% chance I would let one of these go for sale. I may be wrong, I am fairly new to this, but from my research here on the RPF, that's what I discovered.
Not to hi-jack the thread, but my $0.02 worth.

"Re-Casting" is simply making a copy of something.

A "Re-caster" (by definition of this forum) is someone who takes someone else's work, makes copies of it to sell for their own financial gain and does not reference the original artist, rather they claim it as their own = VERY POOR FORM! No different to stealing.

Re-casting will always be frowned upon because it has so many shades of grey and many "artists" are denied an income from others copying and selling their work.
The only time it is truly OK is when you are the original artist and you are making the mold and casting from that mold.

In this case, @Turdbol, has referenced the source of the work in the thread title and has stated that he wishes to preserve the original piece and that any copies made are for his own personal collection or use.

Beautiful piece by the way.
 

Broilermaker

Sr Member
F what these other guys say, you bought it, make a mold and duplicate it for yourself, show them to us when they are painted up, funny thing is if you had just done it they'd been "eyeing and aweing"and asking to buy it
 

dbalschi

Sr Member
F what these other guys say, you bought it, make a mold and duplicate it for yourself, show them to us when they are painted up, funny thing is if you had just done it they'd been "eyeing and aweing"and asking to buy it
So you would be ok with somebody buying something you made and making 2 copies of it which in turn would take money away from you?
 

Moviefreak

Master Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
So you would be ok with somebody buying something you made and making 2 copies of it which in turn would take money away from you?
Not to mention, in a couple years, they usually end up on the market when people lose interest and then it is sold as "I'm not sure exactly where these came from... I, uh... Picked them up on eBay, uh... Yeah, eBay and I don't know the I origin". :lol
And then those are bought and recast and the recasting cycle begins again.
 

Broilermaker

Sr Member
So you would be ok with somebody buying something you made and making 2 copies of it which in turn would take money away from you?
I have GIVEN stuff away and have seen copies passed off as og. But this guy here is doing it for himself. We copy others art work all the time, every time we make a lightsaber, or other prop we steal someone elses idea, how is this different
 
I have GIVEN stuff away and have seen copies passed off as og. But this guy here is doing it for himself. We copy others art work all the time, every time we make a lightsaber, or other prop we steal someone elses idea, how is this different
Exactly, this whole site is dedicated to finding something someone else worked hard to make and then replicating it, sometimes exactly. Some prop guy worked really hard to make the JP cryo shaving cream can and now someone is selling them for $250+ on eBay*. Just because they re-engineered it doesn't make it theirs... that's the whole idea behind patents.
Anyway the guy bought the damn dino so he can do what he want's with it. He never said he'd pass it off as his or sell it. Chill out. The only reason he wanted to do it was to preserve the integrity of the original and for that I admire him. Hell, museums do that all the time.



*Doesn't mean I won't buy one though.
 
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TJack

Master Member
Community Staff
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
I know that I would not be ok with someone buying one of the items I make then tossing some silicone on it so they could then make an additional copy - even if it was for their own personal use. As Moviefreak stated above -
Not to mention, in a couple years, they usually end up on the market when people lose interest and then it is sold as "I'm not sure exactly where these came from... I, uh... Picked them up on eBay, uh... Yeah, eBay and I don't know the I origin". :lol
And then those are bought and recast and the recasting cycle begins again.
I'm willing to bet that any of the artists who sell in the junkyard will tell you the same.

If you want more than one copy of an item then you should be purchasing them directly from the artist.
 

ARKM

Sr Member
I know that I would not be ok with someone buying one of the items I make then tossing some silicone on it so they could then make an additional copy - even if it was for their own personal use. As Moviefreak stated above -

I'm willing to bet that any of the artists who sell in the junkyard will tell you the same.

If you want more than one copy of an item then you should be purchasing them directly from the artist.
With that logic, if you buy an mp3 of a song, you should only be able to put it on one device and never make a backup of it in any way, shape or form. Sorry but that's not how I roll. That song is going on all the USB drives that I use in each of my vehicles, a DVD backup, the hard drive on my PC, a USB stick for the portable stereo in my shop and if I owned one, a portable MP3 player (my cell phone doesn't count as I am middle aged and set in my ways and only use it as a phone). I have no wife or kids so that song is only for me and that's what really matters in this situation, how many people the song (or raptors) is really for. If a person looks down on me for that, they need to reevaluate their life.
 
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Rylo

Master Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
To be clear, you're suggesting that it's okay to copy work that someone spent the time to engineer?

In other words, a prop sets undone, unreplicated for years until artist 'A' digs in and does the work. But, now that artist 'A' has done all the work, it's perfectly acceptable for 'whomever' to replicate that artists work. Reverse engineer it, now that the works been done for them?

Let's use the JP goggles that I spent over a year engineering. Now that I've done all the work, spent thousands of dollars, etc; it's perfectly acceptable for someone to come in and drop a pair (my work) in rubber and continue to sell that which I worked so hard on?

Don't get it twisted; someone can replicate anything they want provided they start from scratch on their own. BUT, to take the work of another, claim it as your own and sell for a profit is a one way ticket off this forum.

As you mentioned. Numerous people sell cryocan replicas. Sadly, the majority are replicas of mine. Now, if a guy wants to sell cryos and do his own leg work on measurements, details, etc. that's his own business, but to take mine (or anyone else who created their own interpretation) and reverse engineer it is another matter.

I spent a tremendous amount of time researching that piece years ago to end up with the the final result. In fact, a number of us did. Until the final design was replicated, it differed from the others out there because my final reference was ultimately off that of an original...something nobody else had. So, if someone wants to make sure they're producing the best replica possible they've got a great starting point now.

Interesting how those who copied mine swear they didn't and say they got their design by viewing screen caps. You can't study 0.001/inches by eye-balling screen caps. Better yet, it's the inner dimensions that are the most humorous. Most people who replicate my work still seat all the inner cuts (not visible on film) at exactly the same locations, threads, sizes, etc. that I use. If one knows the slightest thing about machine work/engineering they understand the mathematical impossibility of such things. Don't make the mistake that many a new member have made by presuming it's all fair game because a different artist made the original piece.

I do hope I'm misreading you.

-Rylo

NOTE: Casting from an original studio creation has some shades of gray. It rather depends on how one came by the piece. There are hundreds of threads authored on the topic, so I won't be getting into it here. Use the search feature.

Cool dino just the same!


Exactly, this whole site is dedicated to finding something someone else worked hard to make and then replicating it, sometimes exactly. Some prop guy worked really hard to make the JP cryo shaving cream can and now someone is selling them for $250+ on eBay*. Just because they re-engineered it doesn't make it theirs... that's the whole idea behind patents.
Anyway the guy bought the damn dino so he can do what he want's with it. He never said he'd pass it off as his or sell it. Chill out. The only reason he wanted to do it was to preserve the integrity of the original and for that I admire him. Hell, museums do that all the time.



*Doesn't mean I won't buy one though.
 
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TJack

Master Member
Community Staff
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
Let's say that you wanted to make a prop that requires multiples of an item - for example a Han in carbonite. It requires 8 volvo panels to complete it properly, so according to the logic of some of you here, I should just buy ONE panel from someone like Bigturc and make myself a mold to cast the other 7 rather than purchase all 8 from him?
 
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To be clear, you're suggesting that it's okay to copy work that someone spent the time to engineer?

In other words, a prop sets undone, unreplicated for years until artist 'A' digs in and does the work. But, now that artist 'A' has done all the work, it's perfectly acceptable for 'whomever' to replicate that artists work. Reverse engineer it, now that the works been done for them?

Let's use the JP goggles that I spent over a year engineering. Now that I've done all the work, spent thousands of dollars, etc; it's perfectly acceptable for someone to come in and drop a pair (my work) in rubber and continue to sell that which I worked so hard on?

Don't get it twisted; someone can replicate anything they want provided they start from scratch on their own. BUT, to take the work of another, claim it as your own and sell for a profit is a one way ticket off this forum.

As you mentioned. People sell cryocan replicas. Sadly, most are replicas of mine. Now, if a guy wants to sell cryos and do his own leg work on measurements, details, etc. that's his own business, but to take mine and reverse engineer the sweat off my brow is another matter.

I spent a tremendous amount of time researching that piece years ago to end up with the the final result. Until my final design was replicated, it differed from the others out there because my reference was that of an original...something nobody else had. So, if someone wants to make sure they're producing the best replica possible, simply copy mine.

Interesting how those who copied mine swear they didn't and say they got their design by viewing screen caps. You can't study 0.001/inches by eye-balling screen caps. Better yet, it's the inner dimensions that are the most humorous. Most people who replicate my work still seat all the inner cuts (not visible on film) at exactly the same locations, threads, sizes, etc. that I use. If one knows the slightest thing about machine work/engineering they understand the mathematical impossibility of such things. Don't make the mistake that many a new member have made by presuming it's all fair game because a different artist made the original piece.

I do hope I'm misreading you.

-Rylo

NOTE: Casting from an original studio creation has some shades of gray. It rather depends on how one came by the piece. There are hundreds of threads authored on the topic. Use the search feature.
First let me say, Rylo, you do great work and if I could afford your replicas I would def buy them from you. However, I can't but that's beside the point.

That said, all I'm saying is we copy stuff. Sometimes a lot of effort is put into those copies (i.e. your pieces). In fact maybe more effort than what went into the originals. The point I'm trying to make is I don't think we should jump on him because he wants to preserve his original by doing some castings. Sure, they may get sold way down the line but that still doesn't mean he can't do what he wants with his property. We can't predict what might happen to them but saying "OH, this could possibly happen in the future." isn't justification for not doing it. I just don't think it was fair for everyone to get on his ass about it when, technically speaking, we're all copying something someone else came up with.

Do you know the guy that designed the cryo can? or the goggles? I know you put a lot of work into your replicas but how much of your money has gone back to the original designers? You're making a profit (presumably) but he's doing it for preservation and personal reasons. That's your choice and this is his choice. Because of your choice there are jerks out there pawning off your hard work but that was a risk you took. Doesn't make it right but it, sadly, is the way things go. Also doesn't mean you should stop doing good work or selling stuff, just means there are always going to be vultures regardless.

I'm not looking to start a fight and I agree that it's sketchy territory making molds of other pieces but given the statements the OP has said I think this went wrong. Let's issues some words of caution, warn him to think it through and be sure he knows that selling it would not be ok. Am I wrong in my thinking here? I don't believe I am but that's how I feel. These are opinions I have so take it or leave it I guess.
 
Let's say that you wanted to make a prop that requires multiples of an item - for example a Han in carbonite. It requires 8 volvo panels to complete it properly, so according to the logic of some of you here, I should just buy ONE panel from someone like @Bigturc and make myself a mold to cast the other 7 rather than purchase all 8 from him?
If that's the way you want to go about it that's your prerogative. Sure, buying all 8 is the way it should be done but what are the circumstances behind your making copies? Is it because you want to pawn it off as your own? Maybe you don't have the cash to buy all 8 but are passionate about building the prop and this is the only way you could do it. Does that mean only people that can afford the 8 should be making Han's? Maybe you want to change it a bit to make it your own. That's perfectly all right legally by the fair use laws. Look at the guy that took peoples Instagram photos, made a couple changes and is now selling them for big bucks. Crappy thing to do but it's still legal.

This is quickly de-evolving into an ethics battle which is ripe with opinions, conjecture and shoulds and shouldn'ts. I agree that taking other people's work as your own is bunk and cheap and shouldn't be done but circumstances are everything. His circumstance is personal use and preservation.
 
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