Is Tony soprano dead

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JOATRASH FX

Master Member
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The last two paragraphs say a lot. He seems to be indirectly admitting that the end is actually undecided from his perspective. Also, look at the jukebox song card closeup. Right under "Don't Stop..." we can see "Any Way You Want It". Do we want Tony dead or alive? A lot of filmmakers that do open endings don't give any power to the audience to come to a conclusion on their own, thus depriving them of ANY sense of closure. The truly great directors and writers do the opposite: leave it open but with enough information and subtext that the creative minds of those willing to decide for themselves, can do so.

Example (well two, actually) from Joss Whedon's Serenity:
At the end, Malcolm Reynolds asks Inara if she's ready to head back to her planet and she replies "I don't know.", leaving the viewer to decide whether or not she (finally) stays with him and puts an end to the will-they-won't-they of the relationship. In the final scene River says "Storm's getting worse" alluding to the fact that a whole mess of trouble has opened up by the events of the film, but Mal's "We'll pass through it soon enough" give you enough that you can decide that they'll all be alright in the end.

Another example is the ending of Green Card:
Depardieu's character gets deported back to France by US immigration after he and Andie MacDowell's character have fallen in love. the film ends with him saying something about waiting to hear the "banging of drums and restless elephants" (or some such... I can't remember the exact line) which is an indirect way of letting the audience know that there's a possibility of a happy ending on the horizon, but since it doesn't give details, we are free to decide for ourselves.
 

0neiros

Master Member
From my POV it really doesn't matter, Tony's screwed. If he's hit it's actually more of a blessing. The Feds are about to scoop him up and toss the key. His crew is Dead or incapacitated, and that very weakness means someone is going to come in and take over, it's just too good an opportunity. And on top of it, he no longer has his shrink to vent to, so he's a walking breakdown/heart attack/stroke waiting to happen. Then again I feel no sympathy, Tony and his crew were all sociopaths, which the writers reminded us of by having them do terrible things every now and then just for a dose of reality.
 

NeoRutty

Master Member
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I haven't seen the series in a LONG time, but plan on re-watching... and one thing I will be re-watching for is if there was ever another a hit against a mafia member that took place in similar fashion... in front of their family, in an open restaurant, in front of a bunch of boy scouts...

I never felt in anyway that he died. But arguing it is pointless cuz there seems to be no real answer. It's whatever you take from it.
 

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JoeG

Master Member
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I haven't seen the series in a LONG time, but plan on re-watching... and one thing I will be re-watching for is if there was ever another a hit against a mafia member that took place in similar fashion... in front of their family, in an open restaurant, in front of a bunch of boy scouts...

I never felt in anyway that he died. But arguing it is pointless cuz there seems to be no real answer. It's whatever you take from it.
In the final season there was a hit in the middle of a restaurant, but the victim's family wasn't there. Also, Bobby got hit in the model train store in front of kids.
 

Lear60man

Master Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
Thats what the whole abrupt cut to black thing was about, he died. No fade to black, no pan left, no roll credits.........CUT TO BLACK. The fact that people are still discussing the ending was the magic of it. The director not being up front and saying, 'Yea, hes dead.' is kind of a cop out. But it was his baby and he wants it to still be relevant years later.
 

NeoRutty

Master Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
Hard cuts don't equal death.

If you want to go that route, then it being a shot OF him when it cut to black, would indicate his kid's POV and the kid is the one who got hit.
 
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R.P. McMurphy

Well-Known Member
The truly great directors and writers do the opposite: leave it open but with enough information and subtext that the creative minds of those willing to decide for themselves, can do so.
Totally agree. I stand by my long post at the top of page two in this thread. The weight of evidence provided clearly points to Tony's death.
 

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NeoRutty

Master Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
I'm going from completely an editor's standpoint that everyone hinging their belief that Tony was killed due to the cut to black, needs a better argument.

IF Meadow walked in, there was a *ding* from the door, Tony looked up, and we cut to his POV of Meadow walking in, smiling, and then it cut abruptly to black, then yes, I would buy that cut to black was his death. But that wasn't what happened.

Think of "LEON" when Gary Oldman is behind Leon in the last scene... we cut to Leon's POV, leaving the parking garage, walking out into the open air...then see everything go fuzzy and we see the ground come closer. You get that you're watching his death from his POV.

Not the case for what is basically Anthony Jr.'s POV when it cuts to black.

I took the whole ending and the tension leading up to it as a way of showing us how paranoid and on guard Tony will have to be from now until he DOES take a bullet...

"It goes on and on and on and on..."

"Don't stop"
 

R.P. McMurphy

Well-Known Member
I'm going from completely an editor's standpoint that everyone hinging their belief that Tony was killed due to the cut to black, needs a better argument.

IF Meadow walked in, there was a *ding* from the door, Tony looked up, and we cut to his POV of Meadow walking in, smiling, and then it cut abruptly to black, then yes, I would buy that cut to black was his death. But that wasn't what happened.
That's EXACTLY what happened:

The strongest evidence of Tony’s death is the Point of View (POV) camerawork employed brilliantly by Chase. If you take the time to watch the scene again, you can’t help but notice the bell that goes off periodically throughout the scene as Tony notices someone coming into the diner. When we clearly hear the bell, the same sequence takes place EVERY time. We hear the bell ring, are shown Tony’s face, and then see through Tony’s eyes what he is seeing. This exact sequence happens again and again and again and again. The final time we hear the bell, we are shown Tony’s face, and, when we have been shown by Chase to expect the next shot to be what Tony sees, the screen CUTS to black. Tony sees black, nothing, he has been shot in the back of the head by man in Members Only jacket in Godfather style.

The song does not go on and on and on, it is ended abruptly.
 

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