Ghostbusters movie by Paul Feig

Solo4114 I fully agree. What makes a comedy a comedy? Gags and their timing. Surprises. Stories about losers that you not only laugh at but with,and who you can root for. I love all the classics, Jerry Lewis and Dean Martin, Steve Martin, Martin Short, Blake Edwards, Louis De Funes, Fernandel, Eddie Murphy's stuff even the newer ones. The SNL gang is something special, but i think not every stand up comedian has the qualities to be a decent actor.
 
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I just realized what it is about the pack that bugs me. It looks like a Michael Bay Ninja Turtle Donatello junk tech thing.

Donatello junk tech is only in the new series where he cobbles stuff from what he can find. in the original series, just like ghostbusters, it has a more finished, scientific look to it, like it can exist in the real world, and actually work. take the old Turtle Van, versus the new one for example. It just looks more detailed and like some thought was put into it's design. this new one was kind of cobbled together so fans could say 'oh look,that's the turtle van...'

speaking of which, that's kind of what bugs me about this new turtles series. there doesn't seem to be any THOUGHT put together in any of it. plot lines get dropped, stupid humor (particularly with mikey) runs rampant.....their gear looks toy driven more than ever. things are just far too random, or done for the 'cool factor' or come and go and never get mentioned again (Krang bringing up that he mutated the humans into what they are now a million years ago...why even bring that interesting plot point up if you're never going to use it again?)... sigh. with the new turtles, it's so much potential that never gets realized to it's fullest. it's like three different people are running this series and no one knows what they want it to be. Playmates, Nickelodian and the producers. The former want to stick as many toys and variants in as possible (turtles wearing clothes,for instance). The middle just want to keep it running as long as possible to make the buy worth it. and the latter seem determined to turn it into a horror show at times. and keep it dark and moody.

that's the same feel I get from this new ghostbusters. no one but dan, harold and ivan really had a clear vision for it...and now it'll just be one big mess...
 
We confirmed the plot outline's authenticity before running it. It's legit!

For some reason, I find this part outright insulting (and I don't subscribe myself to being a cosplayer):

"The team’s next call brings them to a comic convention where they arrive dressed in old underground maintenance uniforms provided by Patty carrying Proton Packs, blending in with all the other cosplayers. A battle breaks out when they locate the demon-looking ghost. The crowd cheers, thinking it’s all part of the convention."

Galaxy Quest did something similar and was celebrated, but that film was a lovingly crafted satirical homage to to fandom that allowed scifi fans to laugh at themselves, whereas Feig's film definitely is not. Knowing what he does about the conflicted feelings of fans surrounding this movie, the last thing he should be doing is making fun of what should be a large part of his audience.
 
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For some reason, I find this part outright insulting (and I don't subscribe myself to being a cosplayer):

"The team’s next call brings them to a comic convention where they arrive dressed in old underground maintenance uniforms provided by Patty carrying Proton Packs, blending in with all the other cosplayers. A battle breaks out when they locate the demon-looking ghost. The crowd cheers, thinking it’s all part of the convention."

Galaxy Quest did something similar and was celebrated, but that film was a lovingly crafted satirical homage to to fandom that allowed scifi fans to laugh at themselves, whereas Feig's film definitely is not. Knowing what he does about the conflicted feelings of fans surrounding this movie, the last thing he should be doing is making fun of what should be a large part of his audience.

pretty much. I expect it's either going to be filled with fan insults from across the internet loosely directed at the feig busters... or it's just there to show them accepting modern pulp culture, as if 'look we arn't stuck in the 80s anymore...we have cell phones, and go to comic cons, and...' bleh either way. hope they don't film it at NYCC.
 
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It's not, though. That's where you're wrong. Nobody in the production of this film is all that concerned about the old-school fans. They're incidental. A nice bonus if they show up, but not a group to be catered to or really concerned with at all.

Why, you ask? Simple. The whole point in the reboot is to expand the brand to people who aren't already fans. The fans will show up, or they won't. Numerically, there just aren't enough to warrant allowing fan sentiment to dictate the course of the film. If there were enough fans to do that, we'd be watching Ghosbusters 8 by now. Ghostbusters is a niche property as far as hardcore fans go. However, it's an extremely well known film and well known brand. But most people aren't really "loyal" to the original stuff, so they don't demand anywhere near the fidelity to or respect of either the original films or the fan community itself. They're a niche market, basically.

This film, though, is meant to relaunch a brand and build interest in a whole new direction for the franchise. It's meant to be familiar to casual fans of the original, but something new that they can enjoy, and from which further films and merchandising can be launched. Seriously, the studio sees huge potential in the brand itself. Video games, cartoons, toys, TV shows, etc. The sky's the limit, really. That's because the brand itself is really familiar and carries with it a lot of goodwill. I'll bet there's a market analysis in some file somewhere at Sony showing the market potential for the brand based on projections from the goodwill alone, and assuming a decent enough product can be produced to get the ball rolling. Those dollars aren't based on hardcore fans; they're based on potential new fans and old casual fans who've seen the original film maybe 3-4 times at most. Probably fewer than that, since it doesn't tend to get a lot of TV airplay.

That's where this film comes in. It gives people a modern product, a new story so they don't have to follow the old stuff or wonder if they missed something somewhere, and it allows the creators total freedom to springboard from this film in any direction they please. So, yeah, they don't really give a rip about "the fans." Not the ones you're talking about, anyway.
 
I'll agree with you on the whole good will thing. I know loads of people who would support anything turtles, or ghostbusters based on the good will of the brand from the past and their youth. I'm not one of those people. I prefer something a bit more... if you're going to do it, make it something special...and worth doing. I'm not going to support bay turtles just because it kind of resembles the franchise I loved. i'm not going to support a filmation ghostbusters movie because it has the same name. i'm not going to support thundercats 2011, because it's just too different from what made the original thundercats fun and entertaining. i'm not going to support team knight rider because..well, have you watched team knight rider?

but the reason we havn't seen Ghostbusters 8 is because there are too many rights holders. and the main one wouldn't greenlight anything ghostbusters at this point. If he did, you are right, we'd have probably gotten to at least ghostbusters 5 by now. maybe another cartoon series.

as for original story, we all know that's not the case with this new one so far ;o). it's pretty cut and paste. right down to the sumerian god mention. they wouldn't be doing that if they either didn't have a clear vision, or where trying to win back some of the old fans to at least TRY and get them interested in this new take on the franchise.
this thing is purely profit driven. if it works, fine. if it doesn't expect a reboot with another all new continuity in about 5 years. I just don't think it'll survive if this crashes.. if no director wanted to touch it before, after seeing the mess this thing caused, they'll never want to go near it now.
 
Actually, my prediction is as follows:

- If the film succeeds (by that I mean anywhere from smash hit to meets-expectations), expect 2-3 sequels, after which expect a possible reboot. (See also, Spider-Man.) Meanwhile, expect several offshoots (e.g. cartoon, video games, mobile game, merchandise, etc.).

- If the film tanks, expect the brand to finally be laid to rest. The studio will assume the brand wasn't as strong as they thought (because everything else couldn't have failed...), and that'll be that for Ghostbusters. Which, much as I love the original stuff, I'm really fine with.

- If the film falls just below expectations, I think it could go either way. Mostly because Sony doesn't really have any brands in-house that it can leverage into franchises. It's got Bond, Ghostbusters, and Spider-Man (sort of). That's it, as far as I know. So, if this film does "eh" at the box office, they might still hang on to it, if only to give a sequel/franchise a shot.

On a related note, I find that the older I get and the more remakes/reboots/reimaginings/rehashings I see, the more I find myself perfectly happy to leave the past in the past, or to revisit it through existing, older films rather than trying to recapture lightning in a bottle.
 
On a related note, I find that the older I get and the more remakes/reboots/reimaginings/rehashings I see, the more I find myself perfectly happy to leave the past in the past, or to revisit it through existing, older films rather than trying to recapture lightning in a bottle.

I'd like to see a sequel of an older property done with the same creative team and pick up right where the old one left off. get as many originals back as possible. no changes, no updates (except maybe putting in things like cell phones and laptops) and see if it can still work and be a hit. imagine if they revived the 80s turtles series JUST as it was. same animation style, same voices where applicable....same music, etc. it'd be a hit with the old fans if it's still capturing the same spirit....with the same writers. but it'll be interesting to see if someone like that can attract new people as well.
 
The thing is, it doesn't have to do well to get a sequel, at least not in the US it doesn't. It can tank or just do below expectations in the US but if it does well overseas that would likely be good enough for the studios to greenlight a sequel or sequels. This has happened before, where movies we thought sucked and seemed to have done poorly in the box office unexpectedly get a sequel because it did well overseas, namely China. So if this new Ghostbusters movie does well overseas, esp. in China, it won't matter how poorly it does in the US it will get a sequel.
 
The thing is, it doesn't have to do well to get a sequel, at least not in the US it doesn't. It can tank or just do below expectations in the US but if it does well overseas that would likely be good enough for the studios to greenlight a sequel or sequels. This has happened before, where movies we thought sucked and seemed to have done poorly in the box office unexpectedly get a sequel because it did well overseas, namely China. So if this new Ghostbusters movie does well overseas, esp. in China, it won't matter how poorly it does in the US it will get a sequel.

it's amazing how much us movie makers will do just to make sure a movie does well in china. supposedly, that's the reason why all ninja and japanese elements where removed from Bay Turtles...so as not to insult the chinese audience. From what I read a year ago, apparently they don't like seeing Japanese people on screen for some reason. so, Shredder was going to be white, the turtles hardly use their weapons....foot clan with guns... etc.

when I read that, I couldn't help but wonder why any studio who liked the property would let that happen. but, as we all know that, respecting properties doesn't seem to be a focus anymore..
 
it's amazing how much us movie makers will do just to make sure a movie does well in china. supposedly, that's the reason why all ninja and japanese elements where removed from Bay Turtles...so as not to insult the chinese audience. From what I read a year ago, apparently they don't like seeing Japanese people on screen for some reason. so, Shredder was going to be white, the turtles hardly use their weapons....foot clan with guns... etc.

when I read that, I couldn't help but wonder why any studio who liked the property would let that happen. but, as we all know that, respecting properties doesn't seem to be a focus anymore..

With few exceptions, respecting properties has never been a concern of the studios, you have to remember, that with the exception of some smaller and/or independent studios their interest is not in producing movies or art, they're in the business of making money and movies is merely the means they use to do so. When it comes to respecting IPs and their fans, the studios are like Lincoln at the outset of the Civil War, if they can make their money by being respectful to the IP and its fans they will, if they can make the movie (and their money) without having to give 2 licks about the IP and its fans they will. That's why there's so much catering to China these days, it's a huge market with a population hungry for the sort of big budget spectacles that Hollywood specializes in and the money to see them, but that's not the main reason why the studios are sensitive about treading on the toes of the Chinese, the main reason is that the Chinese government only allows a certain number of US movies into China every year (part of an effort to protect and grow their indigenous movie industry) and any movie that has material they find objectionable (for any reason) is going to be rejected and the studio is not going to get a piece of the Chinese movie goer pie. If it was more of an open system in where the studios could export as many movies as they liked you'd most likely find a bit less catering to the Chinese markets but since the government closely controls what gets in and what doesn't, wouldn't you be doing everything you can to make your movie not objectionable to them in order show their and (potentially) make more money there than even domestically or at the least, heavily supplement domestic earnings?
 
With few exceptions, respecting properties has never been a concern of the studios, you have to remember, that with the exception of some smaller and/or independent studios their interest is not in producing movies or art, they're in the business of making money and movies is merely the means they use to do so.

huh... interesting point. the first time I ever even heard of this happening was tmnt last year... and the movie suffered so badly because of it. and, yet, was still a huge hit anyway. it'd be in teresting to see a list of movies and the concessions they made to enter the chinese market....but that would be getting way off topic.
 
The Red Dawn remake was a major case of changing things to get into the Chinese market, it was one of the best known because it got a lot media attention because the changes were made in post after it was already in the can, so to speak.
 
it's amazing how much us movie makers will do just to make sure a movie does well in china.

It is and isn't China. It's the global market at large. But as far as China is concerned, it's pretty simple arithmetic. There are more internet users in China than the population of the United States. The market is big, and it's growing.

supposedly, that's the reason why all ninja and japanese elements where removed from Bay Turtles...so as not to insult the chinese audience. From what I read a year ago, apparently they don't like seeing Japanese people on screen for some reason

Well, you know, there was that whole WWII thing.
 
The Red Dawn remake was a major case of changing things to get into the Chinese market, it was one of the best known because it got a lot media attention because the changes were made in post after it was already in the can, so to speak.

Yeah, and it ended up delaying release for, like, a year or two, if I remember correctly. It also really hurt the narrative of the film, I thought, since it's patently absurd that North Korea could and/or would launch an invasion of the continental U.S.

But I digress.


The Chinese angle also helps explain the heavy focus on brands. Markets other than the U.S. know certain brands, but not necessarily the long history built into those brands. So, the Chinese audience might know of Star Trek, and generally know Captain Kirk, Mr. Spock, and the Enterprise, but they don't know the byzantine history of the Star Trek universe. Same deal with younger U.S. audiences, really. So, faced with a choice of "appease the fans" or "tell an accessible story with a passing resemblance to the original material," studios go with the latter because it makes them more money.

Now, I don't necessarily like this trend, especially when it comes at the expense of good storytelling, but it does explain why things happen this way.
 
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