ecl's Kermit the Frog Puppet Replica (later builds, using my newest patterns)
- Thread starter ecl
- Start date
ChickenHaunt
Sr Member
chencc6
New Member
Hi ecl,
Happy new year
I'm wondering to make my second kermit. But I have few questions. For my first kermit. I only put wires in his arms. this time I want to make a body spine to connect his arms, legs, mouthplate. Did you take a photo of your poser kermit's spine? What it is look like? and I saw there is a hole under kermit's body of your photo, for a poser kermit, is it have a hole under his body too?
Happy new year
I'm wondering to make my second kermit. But I have few questions. For my first kermit. I only put wires in his arms. this time I want to make a body spine to connect his arms, legs, mouthplate. Did you take a photo of your poser kermit's spine? What it is look like? and I saw there is a hole under kermit's body of your photo, for a poser kermit, is it have a hole under his body too?
chencc6
New Member
Hi ecl,
Happy new year
I'm wondering to make my second kermit. But I have few questions. For my first kermit. I only put wires in his arms. this time I want to make a body spine to connect his arms, legs, mouthplate. Did you take a photo of your poser kermit's spine? What it is look like? and I saw there is a hole under kermit's body of your photo, for a poser kermit, is it have a hole under his body too?
ecl
Sr Member
The way I made my ‘photo puppet’ version was actually super simple. I drew a quick and messy sketch below that kind of shows what I did. Basically, like a human body, the spine acts a support and the arms and legs on Kermit are just connected to the spine. I made the spine out of about three bendable wires which I used some duct tape to keep together (holds surprisingly well and flexible also). The wires are attached to the bottom of the mouthplate. Unfortunately I didn’t really take photos of the process when I made him; I only made one photo puppet version as I prefer to make the functional performance puppet versions.
You really only have to make the arms and legs bendable, as his body doesn’t bend, being so round and large. So the spine in this case only acts a place for the arms, legs, and mouthplate to connect to. The mouthplate also has additional wires on the back edge so that it can also be posed opened and closed.
You really only have to make the arms and legs bendable, as his body doesn’t bend, being so round and large. So the spine in this case only acts a place for the arms, legs, and mouthplate to connect to. The mouthplate also has additional wires on the back edge so that it can also be posed opened and closed.
ecl
Sr Member
I recall the very first original Kermit used ping pong balls for the eyes, but an original Kermit puppet I saw (from the 80s) definitely did not have 40mm eyes, noticeably smaller at around 35mm. I used 40mm ping pongs for my early builds, and scale-wise makes for a bigger puppet—the original Kermit puppet I observed was noticeably smaller (surprisingly small actually). I’ve been using 35mm plastic domes for my new builds but would like to start using vacuform ones as they’re more accurate and a touch lighter—i’m in the process of getting those done with some help from another RPF member. Just need to cast a few masters for vacuforming.
But having said that, I actually found 35mm ping pong balls from an international seller on ebay, which is interesting. It seems the Kermit that features the ping pong eyes tends to be also mentioned as being the one made from Jim Henson’s mom’s green coat as well, so perhaps that was the very earliest known Kermit? This early Kermit is also larger looking than his later counterparts, which kind of makes me think his eyes are 40mm ping pongs.
It probably references this classic very early rendition of Kermit:
An interesting article: An old coat and a ping pong ball = Kermit?
Here are some interesting photos i found online from a Henson exhibit:
But having said that, I actually found 35mm ping pong balls from an international seller on ebay, which is interesting. It seems the Kermit that features the ping pong eyes tends to be also mentioned as being the one made from Jim Henson’s mom’s green coat as well, so perhaps that was the very earliest known Kermit? This early Kermit is also larger looking than his later counterparts, which kind of makes me think his eyes are 40mm ping pongs.
It probably references this classic very early rendition of Kermit:
An interesting article: An old coat and a ping pong ball = Kermit?
Here are some interesting photos i found online from a Henson exhibit:
Last edited:
directorwho
New Member
Jim Henson said that the myth of the ping pong balls was some what correct but not entirely. It’s more likely that they molded some spheres and cast them to be thin.
In contrast, I have been trying some other ways to attach the eyes, I glued some extra fleece to the inside of the eye. I left one row of the fleece exposed and sewed that to the fleece on the top of the head. It worked until my dad used him too roughly and the seam popped out. I still haven’t figured out a good way to glue on the fleece. My objective is to make it so that there is nothing inside the head to affect the performance.
In contrast, I have been trying some other ways to attach the eyes, I glued some extra fleece to the inside of the eye. I left one row of the fleece exposed and sewed that to the fleece on the top of the head. It worked until my dad used him too roughly and the seam popped out. I still haven’t figured out a good way to glue on the fleece. My objective is to make it so that there is nothing inside the head to affect the performance.
ecl
Sr Member
I haven’t posted my latest build here in this thread; started this one over the winter holiday! I made a few small changes to the pattern but generally he’s similar to the other builds I’ve made in this thread. I’ve been making his ‘cheeks’ more pronounced to better replicate the Henson era Kermit, mostly using the Muppet Movie Kermit as an inspiration. I always feel like the later Kermits tend to look more smooth looking and not as ruffled. I like the less refined look.
Last edited:
ecl
Sr Member
That’s what i’m guessing most of the Kermit eyes are; just vacuformed domes. Although ping pongs work quite well in a pinch haha! Unfortunately there are just a couple of sizes to choose from, mostly just the 40mm.
Yes it’s hard to find a suitable glue to keep the eyes firmly in place on the fleece...the fleece is just so fuzzy. I personally don’t mind being able to feel the plastic attachment from the inside as it lets me know exactly how the eyes are positioned (angle, etc.) by the feel of it. Although i understand that many would prefer not to have anything in there at all. In my early attempts I’ve tried contact cement, hot glue, even super glue (which seems to work the best), but haven’t been satisfied.
directorwho
New Member
The only thing I could think of is to trim the fleece in a circle on the head where the eyes should be and then glue to the liner. But I don’t think that will turn out well. Also with the post and other methods the eyes sometimes have a gap between the fleece and the eye. I am going to try to lift some fleece around the eyes to try to make that go away. But I am unsure how well that would work.
I don’t like the post in the head because when I move my hand to give like an uneasy expression I bump them and move the eyes slightly. There aren’t many other characters out there where the eye need to be on the fleece and there isn’t something behind it to attach to. In fact I don’t know of any others at all that need to attach eyes like Kermit does.
I don’t like the post in the head because when I move my hand to give like an uneasy expression I bump them and move the eyes slightly. There aren’t many other characters out there where the eye need to be on the fleece and there isn’t something behind it to attach to. In fact I don’t know of any others at all that need to attach eyes like Kermit does.
ecl
Sr Member
When using the posts with the eyes, adding a thin styrene washer that is close to the diameter of the base of the eye on the inside of the head can eliminate any gap that might appear.
For a post-less attachment method I’ve experimented with simply using super glue around the bottom edge of the eye dome and the hold is quite strong, but it’s not the cleanest technique to use as the glue can slightly harden the fleece area around the eyes if it seeps out before drying, although you could touch up stuff like that by plucking fleece from a spare piece and actually glueing it to places that need touch up—that’s actually a useful thing to do if you ever find small imperfections around seams, etc. that need to be hidden more. If you do try superglue, I recommend using the gel type that is easier to control.
Last edited:
chencc6
New Member
Sorry, I still dont quite understand how to deal with the wires around mouthplate. Is there no wire on the upper jaw? I drew a picture, are the wires in the right position?
I found the seam of the bottom of my photo puppet's body is quite wired. What it is look like of your photo puppet?
Thanks.
Attachments
ecl
Sr Member
I’ll try my best to explain how I did mine! I no longer own the photo puppet, so unfortunately I can’t take any new photos of it, but I did take some progress photos during the build.
Basically for the mouthplate I have wires on the back edge, outside of the mouthplate that act as bendable ‘hinges’ so that the mouth can open and close. I had made the spine from three wires that were basically combined together, and then split and attached to the bottom of the mouthplate. Basically that helps to keep the spine attached and acts as a kind of neck for Kermit’s head to move around by.
Here’s a quick drawing I made. In the first graphic, just imagine that you are seeing through the rubber mouthplate to see the wires on the other side.
As for how to actually attach the wires to the rubber mouthplates, I used a combination of duct tape and then super gluing pieces of ultrasuedea around the area to reinforce it. Mostly because not much actually sticks to the rubber mouthplate! For some reason a lot of adhesives dont work with it. Super glue works well though, but you can really just glue the wires directly to the mouthplate that way as the wires are thin.
As for the seam on the body, that’s difficult, but I just sort of wrap the fabric around the foam and trim. My seam basically looks like this:
When using the puppet version of your Kermit do you have anything inside of the head to make it more triangular in shape? I ask this because I recently viewed some photos of Kermits head and it kind of looks like there's more in there than just the puppeteers hand. Like perhaps a small triangular styrofoam topping of some sort
ecl
Sr Member
When used as a puppet, I dont have anything in the head; it’s basically all fabric and rubber mouthplate. Based on my research, it seems that pretty much the entire shape of Kermit’s head is the performer’s hand. However, that varies dramatically from person to person. If someone with smaller hands were to try and perform Henson’s Kermit, it would appear very different. Jim Henson’s hands were large and was probably capable of a greater range of control over the shape of Kermit’s head than the average person. For example a person with hands with stubbier fingers would probably not be able to form the same range of expressions and shapes as someone with bigger hands with longer fingers (unless of course the particular puppet was modified specifically for that person). That’s kind of what makes Kermit unique, because he looks different depending on the various performers who have performed Kermit! He’s essentially a sock puppet. I think it would indeed be just fine though if you wanted to add some sort of foam structure inside to help fill in the shape a bit, but that could also potentially prohibit the range of expressions the puppet might be able to make.
Did you use the black velvet for his pupils? I'm having a heck of a time using the velvet as pupils. Every time I get close to the correct shape little pieces of the velvet will flake off thus altering the shape and then I have to start from scratch. The velvet I'm using doesn't have the adhesive backing on it so I believe that might be making it more challenging. I'm thinking about going with regular old black felt but am afraid it would compromise the end result. Any suggestions ECL?
directorwho
New Member
I use black adhesive vinyl. But still use the velvet for the mouth. You can get a roll from Joann’s in the paper cutter section. Cricut brand makes a matte black, its 7.99 for 12"x48" regularly, there was a sale today that made it $5.99. A website like 651vinyl.com sells some sheets for cheaper and better quality (they put candy in the box and they are very reliable), I found a sheet that is 12"x12" that would work for only 0.72 cents. (Oracal 651 - 070 Black (Matte) - 12"x12" Sheet) The only issue is they have a flat rate for shipping, which is like $7 so its up to you which is worth it.
Last edited:
ecl
Sr Member
That’s true that some types of black velvet, or ‘flocked’, sheets can shed a bit. I haven’t had that issue with the stuff I found for my builds; the edges stay sharp. Unfortunately, I can’t remember exactly who i got it from?! It was either ebay or amazon. I’ve been using the same sheet on all my builds as it arrived in pretty big sheets. All I know is that they just called it Black velvet adhesive....i’m assuming the quality of the stuff can vary.
Black vinyl would work just fine as well; perhaps something that isn’t glossy in finish.
Black vinyl would work just fine as well; perhaps something that isn’t glossy in finish.
