E11 from Sterling Parts kit?

[ConvergencePro]

Hey guys,
I've been wanting to build a replica E11 using original 'found parts' for quite a while now, and atm I'm being offered what seems to be a real nice sterling part kit, its still a torch but the barrel shroud is still completely intact (see photo).

I'm being offered this kit for $400 shipped to my door where as an alternative route for me would be to buy a really chopped up kit from Apex gun parts for about $215 by the time it gets to my door (with mag from Numrich)
Now I know there's a few of you guys in the states that have made deactivated sterling base guns from parts kits so my first question is
1) would I be better off getting this kit or the Apex kit
2) just how much work is involved with putting a torch cut gun back together? What do I need to worry about legally in the process of putting it back together?

 

[jkno]

It always saddens me to see a Sterling cut to pieces like this in US. But still this could become a very cool Stormtrooper blaster. This looks like what IMA USA offers o their site for $350: http://www.ima-usa.com/british-sterling-smg-mk-iv-parts-set-with-barrel-and-magazine.html Anyway you have this Unique Canes option as well, but more expensive (not sure if the bare Sterling is still in stock though): http://yhst-5672966975550.stores.yahoo.net/star-wars.html

 

[Mara Jade's Father]

The thing that always bothered me about the Unique Cane rebuild is that they inserted some sort of rod in the receiver. It does not have the detail of the bolt seen via the ejection port or the spring.

 

[jkno]

I have no idea about Unique Canes build quality, just gave some example for him to choose. One of the few good things about collecting in many parts of EU is the high quality of Sterlings

 

[Mara Jade's Father]

I was not trying to knock their quality. Just point out that their are some accuracy issues that need to be factored to make a decision. With that said, I think the price is reasonable if you want a real sterling as a replica. I see the plain ones are out of stock but the other build ups look promising.

I don't know if the OP has the ability to weld himself or he plans to hire someone. If the latter, I would strongly encourage him to get a price estimate to get a better idea what his total project may cost.

 

[deserthunter]

I have one from unique canes that i am using for my snowtrooper. I am happy with it. The welds look good to me. The only thing I would change is the t -rails

 

[QCWolf]

I used the parts kit from Apex Gun Parts. It came with everything but the barrel. You can see what I did with it here:

http://www.therpf.com/showthread.php?t=210742

 

[mugatu]

This is a good thread. I've been mulling over this same kind of question myself. As one with no welding experience, any parts kit seems incredibly intimidating. There are full receiver tubes available for sale with the cutout schematics already on them, but even after cutting out the holes, some welding would be necessary.

Is welding terribly difficult/expensive?

 

[ConvergencePro]

Well thats kind of why I like this kit this guys offering me. All the holes in the shroud are there so what I could do is mill the end flat, then buy a new tube with template, cut off the new tubes end at the correct length and then mate the two together. Hell it should even enable me to weld the front of the bolt to the inside of the tube even before I weld the shroud back on, which should keep me a-OK with the ATF as Id never have a complete MG tube capable of accepting a FA bolt. Theoretically speaking it'd be impossible to remove the weld without cutting the whole tube apart again so its not "readily convertable" back into a MG

 

[Sluis Van Shipyards]

I would call the ATF to get exact instructions on how to make it safe. I think someone on here did that awhile back. That way you know exactly. I thought you had to have a rod welded into the barrel as well.

 

[JoeG]

I've heard dealing with the ATF on matters like this can be pretty tricky. You can talk to one representative on one day and get an answer, then talk to someone else the next and get a completely different answer. Make sure you get whatever answer they give you in writing.

 

[ConvergencePro]

Yeah I was going to throw a weld in the chamber or mill a few hole in the barrel

 

[DARKSIDE72]

All you have to do is make sure the barrel is unable to seat a round (drilled out at the breach), and make sure the barrel can't be removed/replaced.As in cut receiver with the barrel welded in-between the two receiver half's.You can now have a fully functional "dummy gun". ATF legal.

 

[dday]

Yeah I was going to throw a weld in the chamber or mill a few hole in the barrel

Or find a way to not put in the inner barrel at all.

It's not visible once the E11 is assembled.

 

[ConvergencePro]

All you have to do is make sure the barrel is unable to seat a round (drilled out at the breach), and make sure the barrel can't be removed/replaced.As in cut receiver with the barrel welded in-between the two receiver half's.You can now have a fully functional "dummy gun". ATF legal.

Id agree but only to a point. It's sadly not anywhere as simple as that when it comes to machine guns. I spent the night reading the ATF laws and, according to the way the law is written, It's actually the tube (aka the receiver) that's considered a machine gun. As long as the completed tube is capable of accepting a FA bolt then its very very illegal.In other words the moment that the whole tube is put back together then an illegal machinegun has been made and it's off to jail.
That said.. My thoughts on how to proceed with this are as follows (and even then its still very much in the 'grey'). First and foremost would be to remove the firing pin from the FA bolt and fill the space with a weld/rod. This would more or less turn the FA bolt into a useless solid chunk of steel for all intensive purposes; Purely cosmetic. Then the next step (after I've cut the front off the new steel tube and cut the cocking slot, ejection port, and magazine port) would be to weld the deactivated bolt to the inside of the tube before I attach the shroud like I mentioned in my earlier post. In addition to this weld I would then add another weld through the magazine well, and possibly a 3rd weld at the back of the bolt going through the cocking tube slot. This would/should make the deactivated bolt and the back half of the tube considered as one piece of metal (more or less) all before I have a completed tube. The weld at the front of the bolt is the most important as it cant be accessed once the shroud is welded on and the only way to go about removing this weld would be to destroy the tube all over again. As for the barrel, there seems to be a few ways to go about it. It definitely needs to be destroyed in some fashion, either through a combination of filling with a welded rod or milling holes in it. Hell I might just put a wood dowel in there like some of the bapty blasters had. Though I kind of like the idea of visible lands and grooves on the finished blaster. The biggest key to this method I think is that I'll have never been in possession of a completed tube/receiver capable of taking a FA bolt or firing a round upon final assembly.

I'm still going to try and get in touch with someone from the ATF to be sure though.

 

[mugatu]

You could also purchase the SA bolt and barrel, do all the welding you mentioned, and end up with a legal (I think) SA Sterling.

 

[RogueTrooper]

You have posted a question and then answered it....and then in detail answered it.

Sometimes the internet is all about you and what you are doing......go figure.....:lol

You know what to do and what needs to get done...stop fcuking around and get it done.

Opinions are like a.s.s.holes...everyone's got one.

 

[DL 44 Blaster]

Every once in a while this topic of owning a "real" (Sterling) E11 in the US comes up and always seems to just end up with the same means to an end which is "Gray area". It's unfortunate really, that there isn't a definitive answer to the re-assembly of these parts kits.

 

[mugatu]

What doesn't help too is I have seen these deactivated kits come from different sellers in different configurations (meaning cuts made in one spot from seller A's kit are not even close to where the cuts on seller B's Kit are located).

 

[ConvergencePro]

You have posted a question and then answered it....and then in detail answered it.

Sometimes the internet is all about you and what you are doing......go figure.....:lol

You know what to do and what needs to get done...stop fcuking around and get it done.

Opinions are like a.s.s.holes...everyone's got one.

lol yeah. I was kinda hoping someone had gotten an official answer from the feds or had a counter argument to my idea and why it would not work. I'm a avid gun collector located in probably one of the worst states possible to be a gun owner in and I already have enough laws to worry about and make sure I don't violate on a daily basis, haha.

The part where there arn't any in collections or the part where theres none in the archives?
Hell, checking around the boards at the various similar builds I'd bookmarked for my own reference, I've found at least two people that, according to the way the ATF law is written, are or have been in possession of totally functional new made MG's (BIG no no). That's a headache I don't need. But at the same time, we know for a fact that a few of the original film sterling's have made it into private collections here in the states or are even still in the archives. What I'm interested in is how those have been turned into dummy guns.

(Edit: I just realised my location still says NH, lol... No, I sadly now reside in dreded Massachusetts. )