Defining the OWK tunisia saber. Is it even possible?

Discussion in 'Star Wars Costumes and Props' started by Anakin Starkiller, Sep 10, 2015.

  1. Anakin Starkiller

    Anakin Starkiller Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Hey everyone.

    So for some time now. I've been one of those who contend that the OWK ANH lightsaber prop used in the Tunisia shoot was an entirely different prop then the one that was used in the Death Star scenes (often refereed to as the Chronicles Saber).

    Here's a side by side comparison.

    Chronicles/Death Star

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    Tunisia

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
    Now first off we have the different assembly:
    Chronicles v Tunisia Cubes flipped differently
    Chronicles has cotter pin, Tunisia no cotter pin
    Chronicles has screws in clamp, Tunisia has no screws in clamp
    Chronicles has one transistor washer, Tunisia has no transistor washer
    Chronicles windvaine sits high, close the the emitter; Tunisia windvaine sits low, close to the frag body
    Chronicles brass stem is bright and gold near the emitter, Tunisia brass stem is dark consistently

    So if they were the same prop, this would mean that the saber was completely disassembled and then reassembled at some point during filming.

    But when I look look at the individual parts. I also see some major differences.
    The most noticeable to me is the frag body. To me the frag bodies look completely different.
    On the Chronicles saber, the top most ring on the frag body (towards the emitter) is entirely unseraded and has a very steep slope (so much so that when Serafino replicated this design for Russ's grenades the slope he came up with was more steep then any real grenade that has ever surfaced.

    On the Tunisia saber. This top ring, to my eye almost has no slope. and it also looks like the bisecting groove of at lease one of the frag body grooves continues to the edge of the frag body.

    Now almost all frag bodies that I have seen (and I've seen a lot and owned 5) have a steeper slope then what I see in the Tunisia pic.

    But a while back, at the Imperial War Museum, I came across this weird version of the Hales Grenade. Which had me wondering if the Tunisia saber had a grenade that was something like this.
    [​IMG]

    So, I'm throwing this out for discussion.

    What do you guys see here. Two sabers or one. Normal grenade or weirdo slopeless frag body grenade
     
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2015
  2. PoopaPapaPalps

    PoopaPapaPalps Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    From a production standpoint, I feel like there could have been two "heroes"; it definitely would make sense. At that same time, this being a relatively small budget movie for something of Star Wars' size (6 million), I could also see why if they just stuck with one and it ended up being disassembled and reassembled later on. The Chronicle saber sports stuff never seen on Ben's saber at any point, IE: the screws and the cotter pins. To me, that all the more reaffirms the idea that the Chronicles was taken apart and put back together at a later date.

    But regarding the "Tunisia", I see both serration and slope on the upper grenade ring.
     
  3. NeoRutty

    NeoRutty Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    The tunisia saber grenade always looked WAY more pitted and worn down to me...
     
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  4. Kylash

    Kylash Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Two sabers makes sense, but at the same time, were those oddly jumbled together parts that readily available to be able to make 2? We know they had lots of clamps and balance pipes, but the other stuff?
     
  5. thd9791

    thd9791 Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    I see exactly what you've said. There must have been an all dark one too - the V2 was sprayed continuously black along its length. This is the first I've heard of the Hales grenade variation and I think it fits!

    - - - Updated - - -

    There is also a mark on the Tunisia saber that is NOT in the chronicles, to the left of the bubbles, on the clamp, before the transistors.
     
  6. teecrooz

    teecrooz Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Dan, I have some more pictures I'll send you tomorrow. I've done the same analysis using the museum grenade and another that I came across. Extremely rare item. Only two have come to market in the past seven years.
     
  7. Curmudgeon

    Curmudgeon Well-Known Member

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    d0056023_508fe9275d3dc.jpg

    I see serration on the upper grenade ring on the Tunisia saber as well.

    To me, it looks kind of similar to the 3rd and 4th grenades from the left in this photo. Could they have used a different grenade "body" but the same windvane?

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Sep 10, 2015
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  8. Edraven99

    Edraven99 Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Could be a No.3 MkII frag body with the windvane and stem swapped out...​
     
  9. teecrooz

    teecrooz Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Look at the diameter of the brass at the bottom versus the top.
     
  10. mugatu

    mugatu Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    I had read that there were at least two variations of the nonsloped top ring of the frag on the Mark I at the very end of its production cycle, before moving to the MkII. The brass neck plate on the nonsloped frag also had a small lip that does not sit flush with the top ring, unlike the more typical No3 MkI's we are all used to seeing. You can see this lip on the grenade in Anakin Starkiller's IWM photo. Are there any higher res Tunisia saber photos showing the top of the frag?
     
  11. halliwax

    halliwax Legendary Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    this is going to be a great thread, I love reading stuff like this!


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
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  12. Anakin Starkiller

    Anakin Starkiller Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    This is interesting info. Do you have a source for this material we couple pick through?

    I wish we had more. But, I don't have any more Tunisia shots on hand.

    Back in the day (sever hard drive crashes ago) I has a great shot of the bottom of the saber, from the clamp to the handwheel. It was pulled from Alec Guiness's obituary actually.

    But I no longer have that pic, it got lost on a couple of old dead computers.

    Does anyone know what I'm talking about or have this pic on file?

    Thanks

    Dan

    - - - Updated - - -

    This picture is not working for me
     
  13. Curmudgeon

    Curmudgeon Well-Known Member

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    I tried posting the picture again
     
  14. Anakin Starkiller

    Anakin Starkiller Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    These parts are not interchangeable. Although it's possible to put the brass stem of a MKI on the lathe and turn it down until you can cram it into a MKII frag body (I've done this before.

    But the MKII frag body is a little thinner in diameter on that top ring, which I'm not seeing in the Tunisia pic
     
  15. scottjua

    scottjua Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    It's certainly possible there were two. I thought I had heard the story that the death star drop pretty much jacked it up though and it needed fixing... hence the chronicles version.

    Either way, here's the best I have

    obiTunisiaScottjua.jpg
     
  16. mugatu

    mugatu Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    I haven't been able to find the source of info I got. I had read it when one of the flat top ring grenades went up for auction. I'll try to track that webpage down though. Here are the pics I coopted from the auction. They aren't great photos:

    image.jpg
    image.jpg
    image.jpg
    image.jpg
     
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  17. scottjua

    scottjua Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    whoa... cool. I'm buying into this theory. Great... another super rare thing to look for.
     
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  18. Edraven99

    Edraven99 Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Not necessarily... as with everything it seems, there are variants...

    Here's the stem from my relic grenade along with the stem from my mail grenade in my Obi build:

    [TABLE="width: 500, align: center"]
    [TR]
    [TD] IMG_1863.JPG
    [/TD]
    [TD] IMG_1864.JPG
    [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [/TABLE]

    Notice that the diameter of my main stem is slightly larger than my relic stem...

    I discovered this difference when I was going to swap stems with Neorutty... it was too small for his frag body....
     
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  19. mugatu

    mugatu Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    I am thinking the rarity of this variant of the No3 Mk1 makes it unlikely that it was used on the Tunisia. If what I read was correct about that grenade variant's quantities, and about these grenades being individually milled/fragmentized (is this correct?), then very few of these variants were made, probably fewer made it into combat, and these were already halfway to relic status by the time Star Wars got around to using them. Without better photos, I just don't think it's likely.

    However, the top ring on the Tunisia saber has what appears to be a very long error cut in it. You can see it in both photos of the Tunisia in this thread. Neither the IWM pic or the ones from the auction show any error cuts (perhaps one small one towards the top of the first pic I posted), which if this was a prototype for trials, would probably have had the worker's added attention when cutting.

    I don't know, maybe I'm just hoping too hard because that top ring doesn't look slanted in either photo. If we could only check the lip or have a crisp outline of the Tunisia frag.

    Dammit, Dan!


    Anyone have good HD screen caps of the Tunisia?
     
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  20. scottjua

    scottjua Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    did you look at my pic?
     
  21. mugatu

    mugatu Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Yes. It looks nonslanted to me, but it gets less crisp from the background at the top edge. There does look to be a very dark lip (possibly) right in the middle at the end of the frag too. I'd just like to authenticate with more evidence.

    ...also, it just came to me, the error cut being long might also require the nonslanted ring. Other frags I've seen with cuts into the top ring are typically short, unless deep. The Tunisia saber error cut is long and appears to not change in depth drastically.
     
  22. parfaitelumiere

    parfaitelumiere Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    I think it's a different prop, probably the saber with the cone is the tunisia.
    However it may be possible it the same prop, because nobody actually saw the pommel cap on archive saber, so it's possible there is no cap, as on the tunisia prop.
    If so, this can be possible they made the tunisia and wanted to try a motorized version, that failed and rebuilded a new saber from the existing parts and replacing damaged parts (grenade?!), the tunisia has a cone, the archive has not.

    About the grenade-windvane I share you opinion, the tunisia has different grenade variation, with "short" ring with no groove, and the frag body is different but I would more think about the parks version, small slope with cylindrical area.
    The machines used for grenades have made many variation depending on settings, with no slope to a very strong slope, single grooves or double grooves (asymetric design), position of cubes can differ, making a less or more long sloped section, different brass trunks, with slope, diameter variation, different bases, with large or narrow rounded section, 4 or 5 different windvanes, from straight 1àmm short to grooved 13mm long, with or without engraving, there was at least two different engravings.
    Only one thing looks constant, the brass base diameter is always 34mm in diameter or correct grenades variations, there is a smaller diameter but on a later version that is really different.
    Wo seems there were also shorter diameters, edraven, would you have pics of entire grenades, are the threads identicl, I mean can a windvane from first go on second? and what is the diamter measurment on both?
    If the variation is very small, I think it's just do to the very rough settings on machines, as they do for the groove or slopes, and not a different design.
    About the pommels, there are at least 3 different caps for same cube and other parts, but I think there were no cap on obi sabers, reason why I machined a special core for the saber I sold.
    Would be interesting to compare the emitter, clamp, booster and pommel on both sabers to check if these are the same pieces (especially emitter and clamp, easier)
    I think one saber on death star is probably the tunisia, because of the cone.
     
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2015
  23. teecrooz

    teecrooz Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Might as well add these to go along with the one Dan posted.
     

    Attached Files:

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  24. parfaitelumiere

    parfaitelumiere Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Thinking about these grenades:

    If one is 33,5mm diameter and other 34,5mm diameter, it would just be the machining tolerances, probably one machined in a shop and other in another shop, but based on similar plans.
     
  25. Anakin Starkiller

    Anakin Starkiller Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    There's a picture of the saber on the ground in Tunisia which some have taken of evidence that the saber was dropped. But I think it's actually more likely that AG just took it off his belt between shoots. These things do weigh a bit

    Great version of the Tunisia pic. I think this one really shows the weird frag body. Also, since the groove in the top most ring doesn't flare or shrink towards the end of the frag body, this in my eyes lends credence to the idea that that last ring has no slope.

    Dan
     
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2015
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  26. Sym-Cha

    Sym-Cha Master Member

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    Made this comparison so we have all OB1 sabers Tunesia vs Chronicles in one frame :

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    When I 'boxed' in the Tunesia saber from above picture with some blue transparent line ... I see this :

    [​IMG]

    Shadows and lights play tricks when judging props from pictures alone ... however I do notice the more rounded light 'blobs' on some of the fragment parts of the rings of the Tunesia grenade and to me, this does seem to suggest it is a much heavier damaged WW1 relic than the one from Chronicles with it's sharp edges, otherwise the light would reflect more evenly and not like 'blobs' as seen in the top comparison picture.
    Here's another real grenade to emphasize these uneven light 'blobs' when the surface is more damaged :

    [​IMG]

    Now another matter that's always bugged me ... is the shape of the
    windvanes . . . most grenades I've seen for sale are 'smooth' :

    [​IMG]

    Whereas the Chronicles saber windvane has clearly a 'ridge', for lack
    of a better word, as seen perfectly on this grenade :

    [​IMG]

    Question is ... could the windvane for OB1 Chronicles have come from
    a No.3MkII grenade with this neck instead? :

    [​IMG]

    And what is on the Tunesia lightsaber ... a windvane with or without a 'ridge'?

    Chaim
     
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  27. Anakin Starkiller

    Anakin Starkiller Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Great comparison photo.
     
  28. Sym-Cha

    Sym-Cha Master Member

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    Thanks . . . now if the grenade is as you suggest Dan, which is all straight on top, . . . then it's a lot
    more damaged than seen on this one :

    [​IMG]

    and this previousy posted picture could suggest it does have a 'smooth' windvane :

    [​IMG]

    Chaim
     
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2015
  29. subaru

    subaru Member

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    Hi Dan, I am sure that you are planning to make a OWK tunisia saber acurrate replica kit:angel.
     
  30. Serenity

    Serenity Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    I have this:
    [​IMG]
     
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  31. Anakin Starkiller

    Anakin Starkiller Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Who me??? :)

    Well I'd like to use this thread to discuss if such a project is really even possible

    - - - Updated - - -

    Awesome! That's the one. I haven't had that pic for about 5 years. Thanks
     
  32. Anakin Starkiller

    Anakin Starkiller Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    My other question for you guys is, do you see a different booster here?

    To my eye, the fins look a little bit wider on the booster and the back of the booster (by the handwheel) looks to have a much more rounded edge to it then the chronicles version.

    Dan
     
  33. Edraven99

    Edraven99 Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    If you can forgive the crappiness of big yellow here, it appears that the diameter of my relic stem is about 31-32 mm... if you're saying that the normal diameter is about 34 mm... that's a pretty big difference...

    IMG_1865.JPG

    I also found this site last night trying to see if I could fine the picture that Dan was looking for:

    http://flickrhivemind.net/Tags/alecguinness/Recent

    It has some nice pictures in it but are low res, like this one:

    [​IMG]
     
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  34. parfaitelumiere

    parfaitelumiere Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    The 34 mm diameter is the one I calculated on original chronicle saber photo, based from a 38mm outer diameter on frag body, and ID on the clamp.
    I also calculated grooves depth, cubes lenght and slope from this picture, and then I compared with the real grenade I get ( 3 or 4, don't remmeber exactly) and found the exact 34mm diameter, also visible on parks grenades (rods can be switched, not easily, the replicas need to be forced to go in old ones, or vice versa, don't remember exactly)
    These measurments are the one I gave to romans for his own grenade.
    I have seen some variations, slopes groove shape and depth, cube lenght etc, but always found a 34mm average brass rod section, and always less or more switchable with romans parks stuff, sometimes would need some work, but nothing under or over half a millimeter.
    If I remember correctly it's a 6mm long slope then a 5mm groove a 2,5mm cube etc etc
    But adding these new informations, it would mean there are much more variations than I expected.
    From 31 to 35 mm diameter, very large variations, can you confirm the threads are identical, or different?
    If different threads exist, it would explain why russrep grenade si so different, even I never saw a different thread INSIDE the brass rod, on the windvane and on the rod base, If I remember correctly he used a 1/18" 60° tool (UNF or UNC, don't remember)and original are 1/14" 55° tool (withworth)(I may confuse with other threads values, it's quite a long time ago now)
    I don't remember exactly the threads on the original stuff I get, but all were compatible with romans parks stuff for now, except a strange brass part like the one of bottom from chaim post, smaller thread diameter (about 30mm if my memory is correct)on mine.
    Even the windvane grooves shape shown by sym cha can confirm there are many variations without any groove, with a very light groove shaped by deformation, or larger groove machined, U shaped like the russrep romans replicas, or half u shaped as the parks replicas.
    I personnaly get the straight, very slight groove both about 10 or 11 mm long, and large U groove (longer windvane ring, about 13mm, all 3 were bent sheet, no machining, unlike actual replicas, but it's easy to see one from chaims photo has partially machined groove)
    For me the tunisia has no groove and looks closer and closer to the weird grenade without slope.
    Another photo from symcha also show a very soft slope even some grenades have quite stronger slope (archive saber), makes me think the tolerency variations were very larger than I expected, war time products, as the civil war era guns lol.
     
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2015
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  35. thd9791

    thd9791 Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    I see a different "connection" between the balance pipe and the grenade in Chaim,s amazing comparison shot. The Tunisia seems to have the gap filled in, smooth, maybe even with a ridge. The chronicles shot has the sticky glue and we can see the rim/inside the BP.

    i also see smoother corners on the Tunisia booster, as well as damage that is not on the chronicles shot.
     

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  36. James Kenobi 1138

    James Kenobi 1138 Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Here's a theory I've had for a while. We know the balance pipe and grenade from the Chronicles were in England due to the production stills from the Art Dept as seen in the Making of SW book.

    I think the saber was designed and built in England, but a second was build in Africa due to the strict laws about inporting weapons into the country. Remember how the Sterlings the Sandtroopers used on location were those cut/welded/boltless ones also used in Zardoz? I think LFL only brought along the balance pipe, clamp set-up and hand wheel and they sourced the grenade and booster in country.

    With the presence the British had in North Africa for so long leading up to 1976 it's not impossible to think that getting those parts locally and not having to import them through customs would have been easier. Although it probably means either the entire prop was left, or pieces were left, so it didn't have to go through British customs either (grenades/gun parts).
     
  37. Anakin Starkiller

    Anakin Starkiller Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    I don't think this makes sense because if this happened it would mean that they would have to set up a prop shop abroad and also they'd be travelin on a hope and a prayer that production doesn't get slowed down if they can't find the part they needed.
    Remember the stunt blasters were used in Tunisia, but they were constructed at bapty.

    Before that I think they would have just made the prop out of some non restricted materials. Like a resin or cast aluminum grenade.


    I have considered that a replica grenade could have been used in the past. For the reason you're saying. But traveling to anot her country and hoping you'll find a 60 year old piece of ordinance when you get there doesn't sound likely to me
     
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2015
  38. James Kenobi 1138

    James Kenobi 1138 Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Well I didn't mean they bought a grenade from some street peddler, I meant supplied by a gun dealer, military, or film production company.

    Importing deactivated Sterlings is one thing, this is a grenade. Based on the info from the Making of SW book the grenade was in the Art Dept prior to filming and it looks like the Chronicles saber. Why they didn't take that one to Tunsia and took a different complete saber would be a mystery.

    While some photos do look like a different grenade and booster I still don't think there were 2 separate props unless one was constructed in Tunsia and the 'Hero' prop never left England for whatever the reason.
     
  39. halliwax

    halliwax Legendary Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    i love the comparison pictures chaim, thanks for doing that side by side photo
     
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  40. Sym-Cha

    Sym-Cha Master Member

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    We know that between Tunesia and Mechanismo/Chronicles books the OB1 lightsaber has been altered ... we also know that originally most of the military parts belonged to and were rented from Bapty. So what if after production all those parts were returned, except for the G R A F L E X Clamp, Derwent Balance Pipe, TI Exactra bubblestrip and AS Handwheel (that was also kept in loose pieces with the D-ring still attached) which were nicely archived and kept in a box marked Lucasfilm Ltd./ILM lightsaber parts, perhaps even together with Luke's many G R A F L E X flashguns and Vader's MPP's, who knows.

    So when it turned out that STAR WARS became a huge success ... and Harry Harrison was making his Mechanismo SF book ©1978 ... Lucasfilm needed new shots from OB1's iconic lightsaber as well as the Stormtrooper blaster made, as to supply Harry with his request to publish them in his new book along with a cut out illustration made by Brian Lewis :

    [​IMG]

    . . . so they took the lightsaber parts from the Lucasfilm Archive and went back to Bapty with the request to having put back together OB1's lightsaber for a photoshoot.

    Now you have to understand that Bapty's has a huge arsenal of weapons and parts ... among them probably many different WW1 grenades ... and let's for argument's sake pretend you just stepped into Bapty's workshop with your OB1 parts in your precious box ... and then found some of the grenades presented in this next picture :

    [​IMG]

    . . . yet nicely displayed on the table together with some boosters, which were taken off the ANM2 machine guns once more. Given some tools, screws, bolts and nuts . . . which grenade would you pick, without having examined and scrutinized the movie-prop as much as we have, and perhaps with just a sloppy continuity picture, or even the one with Alec Guiness in the desert celebrating his birthday, lying next to you?

    [​IMG]

    Of course ... most of us would pick the dark one from the top shelf ... which is possibly what the person from Bapty or Lucasfilm did having seen above picture . . . but what if the actual grenade used for production . . . was the third from the bottom row . . . yes, that ugly beige coloured grenade with the awkward bottom, which by then had been probably restored back to it's original colour by removing the black lightsaber props paintjob, immaculately done by the guys from Bapty . . . now have a look at the top ring . . . it's slightly different and . . . the cuts on the body run further up into the first ring. It has less of a slope and a smooth windvane as opposed to the No.3MkI on the top shelf.

    Here's a wonderful close-up of that same beige grenade ... now in black and white and the same position as in my comparison picture :

    [​IMG]

    Did these events actually happen as described? . . . Or is my imagination getting the better of me? It's very plausible if you'd ask me :wacko

    Chaim
     
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2015
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  41. teecrooz

    teecrooz Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Well the top one is David's (Edraven99) and the bottom one is John's (Marv). And I used the windvane from the leftmost bottom shelf one for my build. ;)

    Very plausible series of events.
     
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  42. James Kenobi 1138

    James Kenobi 1138 Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    That beige grenade does look like the Tunsia grenade, especially the top ring.

    However screen caps from the Deathstar scenes show a grenade like the Chronicles/Art Dept grenade, making me think the saber was rebuilt after Tunsia.
     
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  43. Sym-Cha

    Sym-Cha Master Member

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    Yeah, the thought had crossed my mind ... though I sometimes find it very hard to determine if I'm seeing the shared stunt or an actual grenade saber in the Deathstar scenes ... got any clear pictures to substantiate your point of view James Kenobi 1138?

    Chaim
     
  44. James Kenobi 1138

    James Kenobi 1138 Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    I meant more when he's pulling it out in the hallways or in the cantina, all the studio shots in England.
     
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2015
  45. Anakin Starkiller

    Anakin Starkiller Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    I'm against the notion that there was one prop and it was rebuilt. First off. We know that they had two Vader sabers, and all of Prowes's scenes were filmed in one place. Guiness's scenes took place over two continents and in fairly remote locations. With only one built prop they run the risk of shutting down a location shoot and loosing money on time missed if anything happened to the prop. This is just not how movie finances work. There's always duplicates made. Even if they only use one prop throughout the course of shooting. There are always backups made. And when we see that every single part has a noticeable difference, to me, it can only indicate 2 distinct props.
     
  46. James Kenobi 1138

    James Kenobi 1138 Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    I don't think anything can be ruled out.

    We've been told there was only 1 Vader helmet made, and also told there were 2 helmets, yet only 1 ever appears in ANH and there are no photos of the 2nd one or the 2 together, yet all of Vaders scenes were shot in the same location.

    And his helmet came off during the duel. Can you imagine what would have happened if it broke and it was the only one?
     
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2015
    mugatu likes this.
  47. teecrooz

    teecrooz Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Can someone do a measurement comparison on the outer flange on the balance pipe?
     
  48. halliwax

    halliwax Legendary Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    it has been confirmed the parts were rented and not bought? so is that the reason why we dont know where the obiwan saber is today? probably because it was disassembled and returned?!
     
  49. Sym-Cha

    Sym-Cha Master Member

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  50. halliwax

    halliwax Legendary Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    [​IMG]

    Never noticed the ill gangster lean R2 is doing in this picture
     

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