BSG Triad Cards

[8 perf]

Ok. I posted a query over on the BSG currency thread re: the Triad cards seen in the screen caps we used to make the paper cubits. One of the grabs shows the backside of one of the Triad cards.

You can clearly see 2 dots over a bar, on a 6 sided card with a thin red border. Perhaps there is a green border card underneath. Anyway, while doing research on another project dealing with Egyptian and Mayan lore, I came across this site. http://www.hanksville.org/yucatan/mayamath.html.

Look familiar? Anyone think this is enough speculation to figure out what an entire deck might be. Wiki's and fan sites claim 55 cards to a deck, but give descriptions of the old "Pyramid" cards from the original series. Any paper propers out there want to give this a whack?

 

[moffeaton]

As I said in the other thread, I'll post the scans of the real card prop I have tomorrow, as long as someone hooks me up with a set. Any takers?

 

[Goodwolf]

As I said in the other thread, I'll post the scans of the real card prop I have tomorrow, as long as someone hooks me up with a set. Any takers?

I'll give it a go on Illustrator. It'll be a learning experience.

 

[137th Gebirg]

IIRC, the symbols for these cards originated from the Original Series' "Pyramid" cards. Larson had a fondness for the whole Van Daniken theory of human origins, so it stanjds to reason he included Mayan symbolism in certain aspects of the show. I have a couple of old Pyramid decks and they had, I think, four or six suits, with the bars & circles on the outer edges of the card, with a triangle at the center.

 

[8 perf]

I have read reports that say the mayan symbols AS WELL AS the standard triangle symbols were used in the original series. I do not have any caps to support this, but there are plenty that show only the triangles versions.

This type: http://www.neweyestudio.com/ebayL/ebl132.jpg are not the ones I am thinking of.

There is a seller on ebay with a store that has a set of "52 cards" that have both types of symbols on them. She claims they were copied from screen used originals. I have my doubts.

We will have to do some extensive research on these to figure out what the "55 card deck" actually has on it. Logically speaking, how would one play the game? The battlestar wiki has a description of what the cards are, but not what they look like.

 

[137th Gebirg]

Here's a pic of the TOS cards with only the bars and dots:

http://en.battlestarwiki.org/wiki/Image:Pyramid.jpg

I guess the triangles are considered non-canon.

Found the rules - but based on the "triangle" style found at http://www.battlestargalactica.com/outside_docs/bg_outdoc0040.htm

2-4 Players

The deck consists of 55 hexagonal cards, which is divided into 3 suits: purple, green and orange. Purple ranks highest and orange ranks lowers. The deck also contains a Capstone (*).

Each suit contains:
- 3 First level cards
- 6 Second level cards
- 9 Third level cards

How To Play

Each player is dealt 6 cards. If a player feels a better hand is possible, he may discard up to 4 cards and receive replacements from the dealer. This may only be done once per hand, much the same as "Draw Poker". Players then construct their best possible pyramid and compare to the other player hands to determine the winner.

Ranks of Hands

A pyramid is made up of at least three cards.

1. First level pyramid consist of 2 third level, and 1 second level card.

2. Second level pyramid consist of 3 third level, and 2 second level card.

3. Third level pyramid consist of 3 third level, 2 second level cards, and 1 first level card.

4. Any of the above may be considered "perfect" when all of the cards used are of the same color. ("Perfect" pyramids rank higher than non-perfect pyramids.)

5. If two or more perfect pyramids are the same level, then the highest suit would win. (NOTE: Only perfect pyramids can be ranked by suit; non-perfect pyramids are considered to have no suit.)

6. If two or more pyramids are still equal, then the persons play another hand to decide the winner.

*) The Capstone can be used in place of the first level card in a Perfect third level pyramid. This is the highest of ALL PYRAMIDS!

**) The Capstone may also be used as a wild card to replace any card in any pyramid.

 

[moffeaton]

Here's a scan from a real card:

http://www.roboterkampf.com/triad.jpg

Just hook me up with a set, someone

 

[Goodwolf]

Here's a scan from a real card:

http://www.roboterkampf.com/triad.jpg

Just hook me up with a set, someone

The back should clean up ok when printed at size. What are the dimensions of the cards? From edge to edge say...

I'll get to researching them.

 

[JKolton]

I don't have the typeface here, but the curly symbol on the back of that triad card scan is upper or lowercase B from Adobe Woodtype Ornaments 2. I use it for a decorative placeholder at work all the time. I'll make an eps out of the symbol tomorrow when I go in, and post it here.
Jon

 

[8 perf]

Moff - Nice scan of the real card!! JKOLTON - good find on the font!!
Size wise, I was thinking 4 inches from point to point. Started at 3.5 and it looked too small. thoughts? Things to consider in the research are: what numbers go on the cards, what sort of number/ design would the oddball "Capstan' card be or look like? Supposedly, 3 suits, red, green purple? red green blue? red green orange? Saying red and green for sure as they are visible in the screen cap.
Design of these may be a lot more straightforward than we think. Its gonna be the printing thats a killer. Any idea on how to have a "real" set of cards done, die cut and everything?

 

[monolith21]

I hate that they screwed up the name of the game and didn't fix it. The new cards look cool. It would be awesome to have a poker set with cubits as the chips. That would be one heavy case!

 

[JediClone]

Quick rundown of what I've gleened from screengrabs:

The third suit color is Green.

The highest ranked card shown thus far is a Ten. (The screengrab below is from "Torn", but it also apears in "Water" when Kara plays the 'Full Colors' hand.) All occurences of the Ten have three lines of color bordering the card. All onscreen occurences of the three-border ('high-rank' if you're going by the Captstone rules) cards have been either Tens or their centers blocked from view by other cards. There are at least two copies of each type of Ten card per deck.

The border around five-card (it loks like a four in another grab I have) is either affected by glare or a fourth suit (Brown yellow gold like the backs). If the RDM prop people were working off the original Pyramid deck rather than the Capstone deck online, there are four suits.

But this is the only shot I've found of a potential forth suit. All other 'hazy' borders turn out to be a black or green when you scan the scenes frame by frame.

 

[motivealloy]

Great research. Can't wait to see more...

 

[JediClone]

Then here's more

At least one of the cards below is a six. This seems to be the highest card with only one border. Sevens have two, as seen in Moffeaton's card.

This is from the 'strip poker' scene before Lee's retirement ceremony, and one of the few times more than one whole card in a hand is shown. When a winning hand is played, it's usually lumped together with all borders visible but only one number shown as in the first screengrab I posted. The card game appears to be based around making combinations of high/middle/low cards like Capstone. But with numbered cards, possibly to break ties (In the 'strip poker' scene the woman appears to re-count her hand before accepting defeat). In the miniseries and early episodes, they are playing with six-card hands, but later on the hands regularly have 5.

 

[JediClone]

... and finally, here is my version of the back, based on moffeaton's scan.

 

[8 perf]

Nice job Jediclone. Is it a Photoshop or illustrator file that you can distribute?

So, are we deciding on the 4 colors? So far i have 3 suits, red, green, yellow(ish), and a single capstone card that is black. yes?
It was also mentioned above that all of the 7's were on 3 bordered cards, but if you look close in one of the grabs, one of the 7's is on a 2 bordered red card. it also looks like the 3 borders next to it might be black or even blue, so does this mean that there are 4 FULL suits (colors) with perhaps a capstone (ace) for each suit?

 

[JediClone]

Nice job Jediclone. Is it a Photoshop or illustrator file that you can distribute?

Thanks. Did it in Illustrator. I could turn into a PDF.

So, are we deciding on the 4 colors? So far i have 3 suits, red, green, yellow(ish), and a single capstone card that is black. yes?

Black is definitely a full suit, not just a Captstone/trump card.
In addition to the screengrabs up top, here's another one from the miniseries.

It was also mentioned above that all of the 7's were on 3 bordered cards, but if you look close in one of the grabs, one of the 7's is on a 2 bordered red card. it also looks like the 3 borders next to it might be black or even blue, so does this mean that there are 4 FULL suits (colors) with perhaps a capstone (ace) for each suit?

I said the 7s were on 2-borders, the 10s were on 3-borders.

I thought I had a grab of a "1" card that did not look 'different' like the triangular Ace in the Classic Pyramid deck. Just one dot, starting where the thick "5"-mark does on the lower cards. But I couldnt find it.

Unless a 4th suit can be definitly determined, and/or completely unseen cards (ie: 11-12) are invented to match one of the other decks, I think we're looking at the following:

Three suits, Red/Green/Black, consisting of a pair of cards numbered 1-10 each (60 cards total).
36 'Low Rank' cards (one border, numbered 1-6)
18 'Mid Rank' cards (two borders, numbered 7-9)
6 'High Rank' cards (three borders, all numbered 10)

This layout is considerably different from the Capstone deck, and would require different rules, but the main concept of combining Low/Mid/High cards would still apply. (If this is the RDM 'poker' deck, a themed Capstone deck could be made as a seperate 'pinocle' game maybe.)

Assuming a six-card hand as seen in the early episodes, "Full Colors", the highest winning hand according to the BSG Wiki, would literally be the most colorful hand possible- all six three-border cards.

(And maybe throw in a blue or brown "Capstone" 10 as a combination Trump Card/Joker)

 

[8 perf]

[I said the 7s were on 2-borders, the 10s were on 3-borders.]


I meant the 10's, sorry. There is a green and black/ blue 10 right next to each other in a cap above. Red looks to be a level 2 while black is level 3.


[Unless a 4th suit can be definitly determined, and/or completely unseen cards (ie: 11-12) are invented to match one of the other decks, I think we're looking at the following:

Three suits, Red/Green/Black, consisting of a pair of card numbered 1-10 each (60 cards total).
36 'Low Rank' cards (one border, numbered 1-6)
18 'Mid Rank' cards (two borders, numbered 7-9)
6 'High Rank' cards (three borders, all numbered 10) ]



I'm going to have to respectfully disagree with you. Most info out there seems to deal with the Capstone deck, and it has been stated to have only 55 cards. 9 first level cards in each of three colors, 6 second level in each color, and 3 third level in each color, with a lone Capstone being in Black. ...............................well, hell, just had a brain fart there didn't I? That would not explain the 10 card we have already seen, would it?
What if it was as simple as 4 suits, with the numbers 1-13 just like we have now? The four Aces ( 13 or Capstone) would not have borders at all, while the remaining 12 cards might be 1-4 (level 1), 5-8 (level 2), and 9-12 ( level 3). Just guessing now really. I can't seem to justify a 55 card count with these numbers though. Hmmmm.:confused

 

[JediClone]

I'm going to have to respectfully disagree with you.

No prob. The reason I stopped lurking and started posting to this thread was to see how my theory worked under criticism. And I cant disagree that the red 10 does look to have a thinner border than the two blacks.

... but the game in question (RDM Triad) is not just Capstone printed on new cards. The Capstone deck has no numbered cards in it. Just different color versions of the same three card designs.

What if it was as simple as 4 suits, with the numbers 1-13 just like we have now?

Then you'd have the game they were playing on the original series. (I Should have written "11-13" when I mentioned inventing cards not seen in the newer show.) And the actors/characters would have to show their whole cards to confirm a win, not just the color and number of lines surrounding the edges.

I think there are three distinct games circling around each other here - Pyramid, Capstone, and Triad - with Triad being a semi-combination of the first two.

I Definitly havnt seen a Triad card with no border... But that doesnt automatically mean there isnt one.

 

[JediClone]

And the front