Avengers: Doomsday

[dascoyne]

Apparently, there was a What If...? comic that featured a Tony Stark variant of Dr. Doom. In the story, Victor swapped bodies with Tony in college. Would not be surprised if this is what they're basing Dr. Doom on.

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There was another What If when they both got transported to Camelot and had to call a truce to join forces and build a one-time single use device to help them return to present day. In the process they each developed a mutual admiration of each other's technical prowess.

 

[publiusr]

An accent from the continent of Europe, of course. Specifically, something Germanic/Romani/Gypsy-sounding, given the location of Doom’s fictional homeland of Latveria.

Duh.

I wanted Frank Langella for Doom.

 

[renaissance_man]

A new update.

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[Kylash]

More Fox X-Men?!

 

[renaissance_man]

More Fox X-Men?!

Having Channing Tatum in the cast bothers me as I'm not a fan of his and it then ties to Deadpool which is a red flag for me as I can't stand the character or Ryan Reynolds and I feel that might spoil this film for me.

 

[dascoyne]

Marvel Announces ‘Avengers: Doomsday’ Cast: Chris Hemsworth, Florence Pugh, Vanessa Kirby, Kelsey Grammer As Beast & Dozens More

Marvel Announces ‘Avengers: Doomsday’ Cast: Chris Hemsworth, Florence Pugh, Vanessa Kirby, Kelsey Grammer As Beast & Dozens More [Updating Live]

Marvel Studios has announced that Chris Hemsworth, Vanessa Kirby, Anthony Mackie, and more have joined "Avengers: Doomsday."

theplaylist.net

It looks like they're just going to throw a Hail Mary with as many characters and cash as they can at the screen.



I hate this 3000.

 

[batguy]

 

[cboath]

I get you are trying to build hype, but clearly it isnt everyone. I havent read the list, but you cant say scarlett johansen is in it, for example without ruining the surprise you know?

As for too many people? We will see. The same was said about the first avengers and it was a homerun. Same was said about endgame, and it was a grand slam...doesnt mean this succeeds, but they do have the history that says it was doable.

 

[Bloop]

I get you are trying to build hype, but clearly it isnt everyone. I havent read the list, but you cant say scarlett johansen is in it, for example without ruining the surprise you know?

As for too many people? We will see. The same was said about the first avengers and it was a homerun. Same was said about endgame, and it was a grand slam...doesnt mean this succeeds, but they do have the history that says it was doable.

Yeah, it really depends on how much screentime all these characters get. Even if the movie is 3 hours, I don't think a lot of the characters will have in-depth story arcs. I'd bet a lot of them are cameos or little more than that. Hey, maybe they'll kill off a bunch of them.

I hope the CG Beast, as seen above, isn't how he'll look. I don't necessarily want it to look exactly like the Kelsey Grammer makeup feom X-Men 3, but I don't want it to look cartoonish.

 

[Laspector]

I still don't know how I feel about RDJ as Doom. I just don't get it and I'm so sick of timeline variants and multiverse crap.

 

[Bloop]

I still don't know how I feel about RDJ as Doom. I just don't get it and I'm so sick of timeline variants and multiverse crap.

Yeah, I've been thinking about how many "multiverse" movies & shows there have been in the relative recent past, plus the ones coming out:

Loki
Spider-Man: Into the Spider-verse
Spider-Man: Across the Spider-verse
Spider-Man: No Way Home
Avengers: Endgame
Doctor Strange in the Multiverse of Madness
Deadpool & Wolverine
Fantastic Four: First Steps
Avengers: Doomsday
Avengers: Secret Wars

And that's just in the MCU:

Everything Everywhere All At Once
The Flash (film)
And going back a bit further in superhero shows:
DC's "Arrow-verse"
The Flash (TV)
Arrow
DC's Legends of Tomorrow

I'm probably forgetting some (which goes to show how many there have been). There's a lot of other "multiverse" movies and tv series going even further back, but there's been a greater concentration of them within the last decade or so. Plus you can connect pretty much all of the of Marvel stuff together via "multiverse" now - all the Spider-Man films, the X-Men franchise, Avengers, Wanda/Vision, etc.

There's a point of critical mass that may be reached with all this, "fan fatigue," if you will, with anything "multiverse" related. Personally, I liked a lot of it, but it starts feeling less earned, lower stakes. Like, in Doctor Strange ITMVOM, I really felt nothing when seeing the multiverse variants of characters like Professor X and Reed Richards, especially after they got killed off almost immediately. There was no real reason for them to be involved in the story other than the cameo value, which, for me, was low.

 

[renaissance_man]

Personally, I liked a lot of it, but it starts feeling less earned, lower stakes. Like, in Doctor Strange ITMVOM, I really felt nothing when seeing the multiverse variants of characters like Professor X and Reed Richards, especially after they got killed off almost immediately. There was no real reason for them to be involved in the story other than the cameo value, which, for me, was low.

You just described the entirety of Deadpool and Wolverine, which is another reason I really hope they keep Deadpool out of the MCU.

 

[batguy]

You just described the entirety of Deadpool and Wolverine, which is another reason I really hope they keep Deadpool out of the MCU.

Me too, but I'm not optimistic.

The fact that they are firehosing this movie with old MCU stars is a bad sign IMO. It smells like a total cash grab. Corporate, market-research filmmaking. "These components worked before so let's combine them all."

It's like assembling a sports team out of top-level veterans. It's a high-cost, short-term strategy that might get you 1 or 2 good seasons. It's no way to build a team with a future.

 

[renaissance_man]

Don't get me wrong I trust the Russos and Stephen Marcus to write and direct a great film, it's just Deadpool I don't want in the MCU, tonally he doesn't fit and I think it will ruin any dramatic tension if he's just undermining the story constantly with profanity, meta references and fourth wall breaks.
It's the reason I couldn't watch any of those films after giving the first one a go.
The same goes for She Hulk, nothing against Tatiana Maslany or the VFX or any of the other things people railed against, I just hated the fourth wall breaks in that show, not to mention Madison and how they undermined and almost mocked Wong's character.

I think there is a lot of potential with Doomsday and Secret Wars to have another pair of great films on a par with Infinity War and Endgame.

 

[batguy]

Don't get me wrong I trust the Russos and Stephen Marcus to write and direct a great film, it's just Deadpool I don't want in the MCU, tonally he doesn't fit and I think it will ruin any dramatic tension if he's just undermining the story constantly with profanity, meta references and fourth wall breaks.
It's the reason I couldn't watch any of those films after giving the first one a go.
The same goes for She Hulk, nothing against Tatiana Maslany or the VFX or any of the other things people railed against, I just hated the fourth wall breaks in that show, not to mention Madison and how they undermined and almost mocked Wong's character.

I think there is a lot of potential with Doomsday and Secret Wars to have another pair of great films on a par with Infinity War and Endgame.

I mean, yeah, Deadpool's whole schtick is to destroy dramatic tension (and attention spans). Adding him to any other movie is basically shooting it up with a dose of Robot Chicken/Family Guy. If he appeared in another big MCU movie then it would need to be managed, well . . . more carefully than I trust them to do.

I haven't seen enough She-Hulk to have an opinion about that one.

 

[TimDRX]

I still don't know how I feel about RDJ as Doom. I just don't get it and I'm so sick of timeline variants and multiverse crap.

I can't recall the source but I saw it strongly rumoured he's just playing an evil variant Tony Stark in Doomsday, not Victor Von Doom. Think it's a safe bet he's gonna be in a green Iron Man suit with a scarier helmet, and "Doctor Doom" will be a derisive nickname, not his chosen title.

Think they're trying to leave the door open for a real Doctor Doom after they do a hard reboot with Secret Wars but I dunno, it all feels so messy. They sorta pulled this off before with Wenwu in Shang-Chi following the fake Trevor and Aldrich Killian versions of the Mandarin in Iron Man 3, but this feels like a much bigger character to be messing with.

 

[drusselmeyer]

Don't get me wrong I trust the Russos and Stephen Marcus to write and direct a great film, it's just Deadpool I don't want in the MCU, tonally he doesn't fit and I think it will ruin any dramatic tension if he's just undermining the story constantly with profanity, meta references and fourth wall breaks.
It's the reason I couldn't watch any of those films after giving the first one a go.
The same goes for She Hulk, nothing against Tatiana Maslany or the VFX or any of the other things people railed against, I just hated the fourth wall breaks in that show, not to mention Madison and how they undermined and almost mocked Wong's character.

I think there is a lot of potential with Doomsday and Secret Wars to have another pair of great films on a par with Infinity War and Endgame.

Wait, what?

She Hulk was built on 4th wall breaks. If you are familiar with that title you know the core of it is the constant gags -without the profanity of Deadpool of course.

 

[renaissance_man]

Wait, what?

She Hulk was built on 4th wall breaks. If you are familiar with that title you know the core of it is the constant gags -without the profanity of Deadpool of course.

I knew that but given it was a new Marvel show I was willing to give it the benefit of the doubt in the hopes they might not go overboard with it, but gave up after 4 episodes, Madison was the final straw.

 

[Halliwax]

Having Channing Tatum in the cast bothers me as I'm not a fan of his and it then ties to Deadpool which is a red flag for me as I can't stand the character or Ryan Reynolds and I feel that might spoil this film for me.

Amen brother

 

[Bloop]

Wait, what?

She Hulk was built on 4th wall breaks. If you are familiar with that title you know the core of it is the constant gags -without the profanity of Deadpool of course.

Personally, the problem I felt with She-Hulk (the tv show) was that the 4th wall breaking was pretty much just in one episode, and was much more of an extreme break than anything in the Deadpool movies. Deadpool mostly just makes references to our "real world," looks at the camera, which you could just explain in-universe that he's just kind of crazy, and makes weird references that no one in his world would really understand, and mugs for a non-existent camera.

The "suspension of disbelief" that we have to have when watching movies and tv was much harder to have for the She-Hulk stuff than for Deadpool. She-Hulk's 4th wall breaking also breaks the rest of the connected MCU, with the onscreen content blatantly acknowledging that none of this is real, which ruins our suspension of disbelief.

Comic books are a bit different, but even so, I never read She-Hulk or Deadpool, and I would have the same criticisms when things are taken too far. It would be better to have the She-Hulk show exist in a different universe. It's also the problem of trying to connect everything in a shared universe, so that you inevitably run into problems when films and shows don't match in tone, or when characters and the world shown in each separate film/show present things that wouldn't make sense if all were truly interconnected.

Take Daredevil. The tone of the show tends to be more of a crime-drama, a little more grounded than other fantastical MCU properties. When you try to connect the NYC in Daredevil  and DD: Born Again, it doesn't really fit with the MCU as shown in The Avengers connected movies and GOTG. The gritty organized crime element and doesn't really fit the tone of the MCU. Daredevil's powers are more grounded - even though he's blind and has radar senses, his physical strength isn't really unbelievable. Putting him in The Avengers would present problems of the scale of power. I'm not saying they couldn't do it and make it look someewhat believable within the context of a big action movie, but it's harder to separate him from how he appears in his own series.

The world of Daredevil works better when it largely ignores the rest of the MCU. I mean, if there's gang members running around (or flying) in NYC that have alien-based weapons, like the Vulture was peddling in Spider-Man: Homecoming, it kind of breaks the Kingpin's crime world.

I guess it really comes down on how much you are willing to believe all these properties are connected. For me, it's a bit easier to enjoy Daredevil as being more grounded than it was to have She-Hulk literally break the 4th wall and climb into "the real world." I still enjoyed She-Hulk as a series, but the 4th wall stuff just was too far for me.