ANOVOS picks up the high-end Star Wars Costuming License!

Inquisitor Peregrinus

Master Member
I wasn't addressing his credibility, the accuracy of his offerings or his level of film involvement. I am only asserting that due to his film involvement, it isn't as clearly black and white as in the case of RS and countless others. For all we know, Ainsworth could have had an agreement similar to Roddenberry where he was permitted to sell pieces. CBS sure tried to shut down Roddenberry but failed and this could be a similar matter.
"Could have had" but didn't. That's what the whole lawsuit was about. And that's exactly the point I was making. During the case, it was laid out for the British judge that he had had temporary subcontractor status decades earlier, had no IP rights then, and certainly none now. He did not create the designs, the initial sculpts, or the three-dimensional realizations of those pieces, but was just one individual fabricating them under contract. And the judge found in Ainsworth's favor. While it does set precedent for the rights of IP holders in the UK vis-à-vis the people making the pjysical objects for them, there is nothing unique to Ainsworth in the matter, legally speaking. He had had a business relationship with the production decades before, but it had ended decades before. At the time of the lawsuit, he was just a private citizen making nonlicensed items without permission. Everyone's still amazed at the way the decision fell. It's also helped protect RS, though, as a result of the decision.

Roddenberry and CBS is far messier, but far simpler. Gene and Majel retained licensing rights, as a family, in perpetuity. First as Lincoln Enterprises, and later as Roddenberry.com. As long as there's a family member alive to retain those rights, they can't be taken away. Though CBS has tried. I expect that's a thing of the past, though, now that Les Moonves is out. I really hope Shari Redstone succeeds in re-integrating the whole CBS/Comcast/Paramount mess so the Trek stuff can maybe get a little better sorted out...

I suspect if Disney went after anyone else, they'd have a much easier time having it stopped.
Maybe. Maybe not. With the Lucas v Ainsworth case as precedent, there's a strong chance any attempt to stop someone making IP-depicting items without permission would fall in the makers' favor, and for the same reasons.
 

mikidymac

New Member
No, he's fighting like you're dismissing his first-hand accounts in favor of your second-hand accounts and using them to make sweeping generalizations that are not, in fact, universal or objectively accurate. A single contrary experience to a universal claim refutes the universality of that claim. I know it refutes your narrative that 110% of what ANOVOS puts out is crap and they're horrible people to the last individual, and you can't have that, but a single exception to a universal claim negates the universality of that claim.
I couldn't have said it better.

This is a public forum and I am sharing my first hand experience, not what I have read about.

I am defending what I own and know first hand instead of something you have read and make an as fact statement about.

No, I don't care for how Anovos has treated me or their other customers and am completely against how they have evolved and are doing business. I also either want a refund or the product I have ordered just like everyone else here.

I have no first hand experience of any of their products other than the first release ANH TK kits and the first release Shadow Trooper kits. They are not "cheap, crap kits" as you have said by your second hand knowledge.

I think it would be much more accurate to say that you have read that some people say their's have cracked, some people say they are not accurate and do your research before you buy anything. I have no issues with anyone's opinion as we all have our own. I only have an issue with the blanket statement that the Anovos ANH TK kits are cheap crap.
 
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USS Endeav

Well-Known Member
"Could have had" but didn't. At the time of the lawsuit, he was just a private citizen making nonlicensed items without permission. Everyone's still amazed at the way the decision fell. It's also helped protect RS, though, as a result of the decision.

With the Lucas v Ainsworth case as precedent, there's a strong chance any attempt to stop someone making IP-depicting items without permission would fall in the makers' favor, and for the same reasons.
That is both good and bad I suppose. The UK court decision would disturb me as an IP, I'd almost view the UK as I would view china.
A hotbed for unlicensed knock off product.

I wonder if Lucas or Disney legal explored the angle of going after Ainsworth about shipments sent to the US...
 

JOATRASH FX

Master Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
Yeah, well, the loss of preorders far from absolves them. The cancelled preorders are exclusively their fault.
Well, not entirely. Their (formerly) generous refund policy is their fault- and selling early pre-orders at a discount, while also a nice way to reward loyal customers, also came back to bite them. We can be pretty certain that, regardless of the delays of products, a LOT of people pre-ordered before the discount deadlines while not being 100% decided on whether they actually wanted the item in the first place. They figured 'hey, so what if they have my money for a few weeks while I think this over a little more- it's risk free'. Then maybe they decided later that they didn't, in fact, want it. Or, maybe something else popped up that was shinier and they canceled because of that. (I never did it, but the possibility of being able to has crossed my mind.) All before there were any delays to the item in question. You get a few people doing that on high-ticket items, it's going to go bad fast. (I would guess that it's one reason for the 8-12 weeks refund time they had before April- trying to discourage impulse pre-orders.)


So, yeah, there are various reasons, but ultimately it still comes back to them. Whether it's naivete', bad management, lack of info, etc.
Indeed.
 

GF

Sr Member
If you go onto the FISD there are years worth of posts asking about how to fix cracks. Crack are nothing new, and nothing specific to Anovos. In fact I know two guys both with RS suits that have had some very nasty cracks that have both stated they will not buy RS again because of them.

When Anovos first hit the scene with their TK everyone was up in arms because their kit was an all-in-one solution to an almost complete costume WITH an already assembled helmet. Even at the full price of $650 it was a steal. Add to that they can easily be built right up to Centurion standards, I’m not seeing where this kit is “crap” other then the same snobbish attitudes that have always been out there
Its not only about quality its not accurate at all, if you can't see that you didn't do the proper research.
 

USS Endeav

Well-Known Member
Its not only about quality its not accurate at all, if you can't see that you didn't do the proper research.
Then how is it 501st approved? I am NOT a sw fan but if there is one thing I've read a billion times, if it get's their approval, it's golden.,
 

USS Endeav

Well-Known Member
At the end of the day, it comes down to what those that are eligible to be in the CA want out of it.
Some want Anovos to burn, in hell is my guess.
Others want their money back and could care less what Anovos does afterwards.
Others still want to wait for what was ordered.

I would like to have what I ordered and for Anovos to turn this around. No one else has shown a willingness to do Star Trek costumes anywhere near as nice as theirs, as accurate and to cover so many from the franchise.

Is this CA going to facilitate this or cause a catastrophic reaction where everyone is burned? Time will tell.
 

MacBeath

Well-Known Member
That is both good and bad I suppose. The UK court decision would disturb me as an IP, I'd almost view the UK as I would view china.
A hotbed for unlicensed knock off product.

I wonder if Lucas or Disney legal explored the angle of going after Ainsworth about shipments sent to the US...
I've not read the judgement for a while, but if I remember correctly, it was down to a technicality as to how the original design had been copyrighted, and as a result, copyright expired after 25 years in the UK. That's probably an oversimplification, but on the right tracks. Shepperton, and others, can therefore only sell within the UK, possibly Europe, but not elsewhere so Disney could go after them.
 

bookface

Sr Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
That is both good and bad I suppose. The UK court decision would disturb me as an IP, I'd almost view the UK as I would view china.
A hotbed for unlicensed knock off product.

I wonder if Lucas or Disney legal explored the angle of going after Ainsworth about shipments sent to the US...
I looked into this quite closely, for obvious reasons. The official court ruling was that props came under the heading of industrial designs (or something similar, I'd have to look it up again for exact wording) rather than art or sculpture, which limited the term of copyright to 15 years instead of the much more normal 75 or more for an artistic design. As far as I remember, there WAS a restriction on him selling items to the US but I have no idea how that might have been enforced.

So yeah, UK based prop makers are probably more trouble than they're worth for any studio to pursue given the established precedent.
 

USS Endeav

Well-Known Member
So yeah, UK based prop makers are probably more trouble than they're worth for any studio to pursue given the established precedent.
Does the ruling apply to RS naturally and by default or would they hope to seek shelter under it through legal argument?

If it is the aforementioned, then the wider issue is anyone can reproduce any prop so long as its 15 years old. I wonder, does that clock
start when it first airs or in the case of an episodic TV show, after it concludes the final episode.
 

ABE

Well-Known Member
Then how is it 501st approved? I am NOT a sw fan but if there is one thing I've read a billion times, if it get's their approval, it's golden.,
it is a process, first you need to have the interest of belonging to the 501st, then you approach the garrison corresponding to your area or through the website, you make your registration on the site and send your approval photos to the GML of your garrison, then to examine them and compare them with the CRL approve your armor.

lately many vendors put their armor are approved by the 501st but that is not official.
When buying an armor, even if they mention that, it is not a guarantee that it does not have some detail to repair.
by the way, the CRLs are available on the 501st website so you can see what requirement you need the suit or armor you want to register.
 

intwenothor

Active Member
I've not read the judgement for a while, but if I remember correctly, it was down to a technicality as to how the original design had been copyrighted, and as a result, copyright expired after 25 years in the UK. That's probably an oversimplification, but on the right tracks. Shepperton, and others, can therefore only sell within the UK, possibly Europe, but not elsewhere so Disney could go after them.

Basically:
1 Stormtrooper helmets are not sculptures.
2 Ainsworth has infringed US copyright but, for practicable purposes, if he isn't selling stuff there good luck getting him.
 

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bookface

Sr Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
Does the ruling apply to RS naturally and by default or would they hope to seek shelter under it through legal argument?

If it is the aforementioned, then the wider issue is anyone can reproduce any prop so long as its 15 years old. I wonder, does that clock
start when it first airs or in the case of an episodic TV show, after it concludes the final episode.
Not being a lawyer myself, I wouldn’t like to say for sure. My interpretation is that the court ruled on props as being designs rather than art; this ruling should apply naturally to any UK based prop maker. Any studio wishing to take action against a UK maker would need to challenge that original ruling rather than the maker, as they would naturally say they were within the law as ruled by the courts.

As to when the clock starts ticking, who knows. Arguments could probably be made either way depending on when you feel the “design” has fufilled it’s brief.
 

Apollo

Legendary Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
Just came in from a Bike ride and after lunch hitting the lake on my Kayak!

Hopefully others here will kick back and relax for the rest of the weekend!!!
 

Jamesfett

Active Member
it is a process, first you need to have the interest of belonging to the 501st, then you approach the garrison corresponding to your area or through the website, you make your registration on the site and send your approval photos to the GML of your garrison, then to examine them and compare them with the CRL approve your armor.
Then you sit yourself down and really think about how you are spending your free time :)


I am sorry, I could not resist. It was just too perfect of a set up. Love the 501st and obviously love props. Been posting a lot lately due to the heat. Just trying to lighten the mood here.
 
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