Logan's Run WORKING Flame Pistol 3D printed (a UNIQUE, one of a kind internal design).

[propmaster2000]

I've been posting off and on in various threads about things I have 3D printed and the great
luck I have been having with my CR10S and both my ENDER 3's.
One of the subjects I have been reading about here on the RPF and elsewhere on line, is the information posted about the replica prop "Deep Sleep" Sandman pistol and how when it was reproduced (some time ago), no one has taken on the challenge to re-manufacture the pistol based on the known information and drawings of the original internal layout.
As a prop, it really only realistically needed to function properly a the time it is being filmed "to get the shot".
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If there was a failure on set, all they had to do was fix it and re-shoot the scene again.
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On many props (as an example) anything could happen on set and a dead battery was always a possibility.
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One of the issues I've read about with the DS prop is the CC and Water mix to get the highly flammable Acetylene gas to create a "torch" effect in the nozzle as well as the re-designing and manufacture of the gas release valve.
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Not to mention the corrosive properties of Calcium Carbonate and it's left over by product.
I would imagine the pistol would need to be cleaned fairly regularly.
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So, as far as I have read, no one has attempted a remake of the original design of the Sandman pistol (metal) for some time and it is not about to start with me.
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I do however have the tools (mill, drill, lathe) and knowledge to do so, but my challenge is to come up with a different (as well as a), new design to develop a pistol that would work "on Que" and produce a flame for the short time it would be filmed.
If the gun was needed for a single shot or two for a continuous scene, it could easily be reset and used quickly by the actor without the danger of Acetylene gas production.
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Still not sure if it can be done (since there are no accurate drawings or directions to go by), so it has become a unique challenge for my design and electronics skill set.
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My goal was to 3D print my design as a prototype and see what I could come up with.
This is by know means the finished product and may not go much further then it is now, but it was a gallant try for being mostly 3D printed out of PLA.
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This of course will not be be an exact replica, only a close approximation inspired by the Logan's Run Sandman Pistol.
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As shown in the video, I still have to develop a way to ignite the flame electronically in all 5 flame ports (not using glow plugs) and add the small detail piece (triangle) on the left side of the grip and paint.
It of course does not produce as "robust" flame as the original did or even as well as the remake, but it is the first 3D printed version that puts out flame and is a bit safer to use.
It is more for the effect.
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It is not likely I will be posting the .stl or details of its function anytime soon, but I just wanted to share what I found and the possibility it might be done with out the use of the higher pressure of CC and water or having the clean up and maintenance issue.
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It by no means is the perfect prop, it's just another way, among many, to create it without the use of bright LEDs.
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It is what it is, a nice, very unique, one of a kind, working show piece for the collectors shelf
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[shaggy555]

Really nice mate... Just out of interest, what paint did you use?

 

[propmaster2000]

Thanks
I used what paint I had on hand.
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It was either my Krylon semi flat black or the flat black (I have both).
Note:
As far as the nozzle flame output jet on the center portion, I had removed the smaller "pin hole"
jet prior to making the video and forgot to replace it.
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Each of the nozzle flame jets will be about .05" (1.27mm) when complete.
Hopefully the gas will be distributed equally in all 5 outputs.
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I needed to design this so that it would be fairly easy to maintain, have descent functionality,
and be relatively safe as a 3D printed plastic prop flame gun could be.
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This of course is made a bit over engineered.
Here is the current exploded view:
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[propmaster2000]

I am still dabbling with this project off and on (more off then on), but I am making some progress.
Not sure how much more time I will be putting on this, I just wanted to see if I could design a different version of Particle Cannon
Sandman Blaster then others have created (this will have flame output).
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Since this is 3D printed plastic (PLA) it is way more involved (complicated) then the original designed one was to produce.
There are way more factors to consider on this version since the main issue is, it is printed PLA plastic.
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So far, I have flame output from the four nozzle openings but still dialing it in.
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[propmaster2000]

This project was started a while ago as well, but as usual I some times have to put them aside for a time.
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One of the issues I have found with a PLA plastic prop (which needs to output flames) is that it will melt.
Since the actual prop was made of metal it could be designed as a torch of sorts with a single output
gas port which could be ignited using a glow plug towards the tip and then split the flame at the opening into 4 (5) vents.
In my case however, I am having to design mine with at least 4 (5) single gas output ports and ignite each flame individually and
at the same time.
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The means to ignite the flames at the output nozzles will be an ignition spark using a HV power supply.
I have found it will be very difficult to use one HV source to create more then 1 spark, on a continuous basis at the appropriate
intensity from each spark. So I may have to use one HV supply circuit for each spark needed.
At this point in time, that is the issue here.
Getting multiple HV power supplies in the handle and rechargeable batteries is one thing, getting the appropriate "spark gaps" is another.
I feel I have found the answer though, but I've had to order what I need and so far it has been a 2 month wait.
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[propmaster2000]

Finally, I received an HV power supply that will be an excellent candidate for my DS 3D printed Logan's Run flame gun project.
The only problem is, I think it works pretty well and I should have ordered more when I did.
I just didn't know then that it would work this well
Now I will have to wait again to get the remaining ones to start again on this.
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[propmaster2000]

I am set to progress a bit further on my goal to create the only PLA, 3D printed Logans Run Flame Pistol.
I managed to get all four sparks to work at the same time and have sufficient intensity to ignite the gas.
That was one of the hurdles I had to over come before I thought there would be a chance I could get this to work.
Getting the circuit and rechargeable battery supply in the handle looks to be doable, but until I start reducing the size of
the circuit and laying out the HV wire path, I won't know for sure. HV wire insulation is paramount because the voltage
will travel though the wire insulation and cause issues and reduced output strength.
Designing an adequate gas chamber and delivery system is also on my agenda, but I feel I am making progress on this
(fingers crossed).
I'm going to also use the Calcium Carbide and water mixture to get the gas needed to produce the flame.
The powdered form (sand like) Bangsite will be my choice of CC (not the pea size) for my design.
There isn't any design and build plans available for this version, so I am having to wing it on my own.
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[goldcylon]

Following... Nice effort I was going to ask Coyle to make me one of these out of metal

 

[propmaster2000]

So far my efforts designing this prop have been a "hit and miss" adventure.
A lot of trial and error but still there is a glimmer of hope I will be able to come up with something that resembles
a close approximation to the DS Flame Pistol.
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I think when I finally get to the point I have satisfied myself that it is possible that a plastic PLA, 3D printed
prop can produce flame, I will then try designing something else that seemed impossible at one time.
At the end of the day, I guess you could say it will ultimately be more of a "proof of concept" then a fully completed prop pistol.
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Of course this prop can not be made entirely of plastic since by mixing water with CC it will produce a fair amount of heat.
The greater the quantity of the "CC/water" mix the hotter the reaction will be (too hot for any kind of plastic, even ABS)
and will have the tendency to deform/melt plastic. So I will have to keep the overall mixed proportion to a minimum.
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The flame reaction will not be as energetic on this version as it is on the "real deal" and will end up being much harder to create
(many more factors at play).
At least, if the plastic gets messed up in some way, I can simply print another , or two
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So, that being said, I will have to use other materials (metal) to create the mixing gas chamber, delivery valve and ignition set up.
Not a real big deal at this point since I think I have already gotten over that hurdle (fingers crossed) and designed a very unique
means to do just that.
Here is a picture of the 4 spark ignition that I finally got to work last night.
It ignited the acetylene gas as predicted while doing a test run. Whoo Hoo!
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This morning I will be attempting to do another test of the flaming effect and see if I can get a video of the full effect.
As mentioned earlier, the "reaction flame" of this prop is very subdued (compared to actual prop), but I think it will be a nice,
unique effect none the less.
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Ultimately, the amount a gas and pressure available will of course be less dramatic since the quantity of CC being used is minimal.
It should be able to achieve two or three fair shots at best for the effect.
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One thing I have discovered in my experimental phase of this build is that to get the best effect at the correct CC/water mixture
the volume of each must not exceed the "butter zone".
The correct amount of water to the amount of CC will produce the best effect.
Since my gas mixing chamber is much smaller by volume then the original one is, I have had to use the bare minimum amount of
chemicals to achieve the optimum result.
If too much water is added, the by product left over after the reaction takes place will end up being a pasty white goo.
If not enough water is added, there may be the risk of CC being left un-effected.
I have found that because I am using Bangsite granules (sand like appearance), I am limited to using only 3 cap fulls and .8 mil.
of water.
Not sure how the CC pea grade reacts with water or what byproduct is left, so I can only speak for what I know.
When properly mixed, it seems that the byproduct (after the gas is expelled), is a dry, off white powder that simply falls out
before re-setting for the next run.
When I did add too much water, it ended up mixing with the used white powdered CC and creating a kind of wet paste.
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I did read somewhere that 2 cc of water is used in the real deal, so that goes to show just how small my reaction chamber
has to be.
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[EasternBloc]

Enjoyable out-of-the-box concept on this Deep Sleep gun! Watching! Am I correct in understanding that you intend to route acetylene gas from the cc chamber by way of a manifold and four lines to each arc flame?

 

[propmaster2000]

Logans Run DS Sandman Flame Pistol test.
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In this next video, I show that all the factors are in place to create 4 active flames from the four separate output nozzles.
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The entire design of the 4 Flame Producing Output Effect is from scratch and bares no resemblance to the original.
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Each flame is ignited individually to produce an approx. 5" length flame.
NOTE: The last few flame tests are from the same load of CC. I just wanted to see if there would be any more flame
reaction after a few minutes and to my surprise there was!
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Of course due to the nature of video and picture tech. the individual flames are tough to see on camera and very bright in person.
If I could filter down the brightness, it would be possible to see each flame on camera.
There is one still image in the video showing the four flames as I see them but way brighter!
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Since I have satisfied my desire to see if this could be done from scratch using a totally different approach in a 3D printed
PLA prop, I am not sure how much more effort I will put into this build.
At some point however, I will maybe assemble the front nozzle section with the flame manifold in place
and re-shoot the video, but this time outside in brighter light to see if the flame's can be seen better and not
just a bright cluster.
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Of course there is some electronics and a few metal parts (brass, steel and aluminum), but only where needed.

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I used about 4 Bangsite Tube cap fulls of CC and .5 mil of water to produce the output I desired.
It seems that this mixture is the optimum amount of each to end up with a very dry white powder after the total reaction
takes place.
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[Kal Argos]

Wow, this cleverly built! Ill have to go back and watch the movie again to jog my memory on this prop....

Excellently done as usual tho.

EDIT: Typo.. i had a ? Instead of an !. Sorry about that.

 

[propmaster2000]

When I took the earlier video of the flame output from the LR Sandman Flame Pistol, I wasn't happy with the outcome of what
was seen since the exposure needed to be adjusted.
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So I did another take with the exposure adjusted and added a dark filter (sun glasses) over the camera lens.
Here is the result.
Take two :

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[Bengrim09]

Wow very nice

 

[propmaster2000]

As many of you know, this project started some time ago with just a thought in mind - To make a 3D printed, PLA plastic, Logans Run
Flame Pistol Shoot 4 individual flames.
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Since there is no available working plans for this endeavor, I had to design everything from scratch.
Of course I had some idea of what the finished prop should look like, but the over all means to accomplish it would be different.
Since this prop will produce the flame in a totally different manner, the source of gas would be the same by using the CC and Water mix.
The original prop used one big flame output like a "torch" ignited by a single glow plug at the tip and then was split to produce the look
of multiple flames. It was a very efficient and less complicated way to accomplish this effect.
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Many years have gone by since the original was made and technology has advanced in many ways. Without these advances,
this prop could not have been made in the way that it has.
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Through trial and some errors, I have finally settled on the means and I have completely assembled all the individual
components to make this happen. There are no external influences to make this prop function the way it was intended.
It uses a single very small rechargeable 4.7V Lipo battery and a modified miniature high voltage supply to create the
high voltage to make 4 separate sparks for each flame nozzle (not easy, but possible) and all has to fit into the grip.
The high voltage must travel to the 4 spark gaps at the nozzles manifold using only 2 wires without crossing over (touching),
which would cause a bit of a short and high voltage plasma release.
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I still have a few more things to do on this version that I will be implementing when I get the chance.
It has not been completely painted, but that doesn't effect it's performance.
Since this was just a test of the total effect at this point, I will have to finalize a few more details before I move forward with it.
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Below is a video I recently took of the most up to date test:
Thank you for watching.

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[Flagg]

Really impressive so far.

 

[romond]

Awesome project! I dig the flame effect!

 

[propmaster2000]

Well, here it is, a working, "unique, one of a kind internal design" Logan's Run 3D printed Flame pistol.
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Due to more recent technology, this design was made possible.
Single 3.7V rechargeable battery.
HV power supply.
Quick "gas renewal" set up.
Light weight PLA material 3D printed body and unique gas delivery system (leaving room for future internal additions).
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The design of this version has 4 individual flames (one at each nozzle vent port) like you might see on a real flame style pistol
of the future, leaving the center barrel tip for future upgrades.

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[goldcylon]

Looks great so. I imagine the cc is in the rear and an o ring seals the back screw. Are you planning on making any other of these. What was the future room upgrades you were considering. The 4 flame effect is awesome

 

[propmaster2000]

Earlier this evening, I wanted to shoot my Logan's Run Flame pistol, so if anything happens during this round of firing,
I thought I would video it's function for future reference:
Here is the result. (It worked GREAT!)
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