ANH-era shared stunt/v2 discussion: What is known?

Discussion in 'Star Wars Costumes and Props' started by MCM, Jun 29, 2015.

  1. MCM

    MCM Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    I'm interested in constructing a replica of an ANH-era shared stunt/v2 saber as wielded by Obi-Wan. There is plenty of information/visual reference for the ROTJ-era iterations of these props, but the ANH-era reference seems to be lacking. I guess, firstly, I should be asking if anyone knows of good reference pics for such a project.

    Secondly, has anyone else attempted a replica of this particular saber(s)? My searching didn't turn up any results, but my search-fu may be lacking. I'd be curious to see how others have interpreted this saber.

    Thirdly, I have these blueprints saved on my hard drive: LUKE_STUNT_EP6.jpg
    Are these dimensionally accurate? Would these be a good place to start or are there more accurate plans available?

    Fourthly, what differences separated the v2 and shared stunt at this point in time? It seems as though the shared stunt retained a Graflex clamp with the original lever while the v2 has a longer replacement lever, but check these pics out:
    Luke-ObiSharedStunt04.jpg There is quite obviously a replacement clamp on this lever. Is it the same lever that wound up on the v2? It almost looks as if someone rammed a nail through the clamp and then bent it downwards. The idea of having a bent nail on a display piece isn't too attractive, to be honest, so part of me really wants to believe that this is the v2 clamp lever :$. Also, this guy seems to have an exactra display in the clamp.
    Alec saber.jpg The saber in this picture appears to have no clamp, although I suppose it's possible that a Graflex clamp could have been taped over (like how the shared stunt has the chrome tape over it). Is this the same saber as the last picture or a different one?

    obi_wan_saber-vi v2.jpg This one has no bubbles in the clamp but it seems to have transistor (or replica) greeblies. Also notice the grip which brings me to my next point.

    Fifthly, I believe the grip to be solid black. The parts of Star Wars page shows these screen shots skke1.jpg skke2.jpg and claims that the grip rings are silver and the neck copper just as they were in ROTJ. To my eyes, it looks as if the grip is solid black with the edges of the rings simply reflecting the light. It also looks as if the copper wind vain part is a darker, more weathered look more like the hero prop than the brighter ROTJ-era shared stunt with which we're all familiar.

    Thoughts? I think this could be a cool project!
     
    Last edited: Jun 29, 2015
  2. newmagrathea

    newmagrathea Sr Member

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  3. Halliwax

    Halliwax Legendary Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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  4. MCM

    MCM Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Oh yeah, I've been sort of lurking in that thread for a while. That's why I'm hoping that the lever in this picture and the lever on the V2 are the same. If anyone could confirm this, that would be rad!

    Why, yes they are :) That's what I meant by exactra display. As I understand it, the bubbles magnified the numbers on the old exactra calculators.
     
  5. MCM

    MCM Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    I started putting the plans into Sketchup and I think they're looking pretty alright :cool. This is my take on the color scheme; I don't think it's hard to see how the paint could wear off of the "booster" and "grenade" sections to more resemble what ended up being the ROTJ V2, but there are many people here who are much more familiar with the prop, so I ultimately defer to them.
    Hi Res Shared Stunt.png
    Also, from what I understand, the sabers were cast in aluminum in separate pieces: the main body, the pommel, and the very last ring of the emitter. If this picture is of the real deal, that would make sense ebay-wood-metal-rotj-lightsaber.jpg

    Apparently the emitter portion was then cut off then reattached so that it could spin with the prop blade when the motor was activated. My question is at what point on the saber did they sever the emitter? If I attempt to do a replica, I think I'd try to shoot for that level of accuracy.
     
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  6. roygilsing

    roygilsing Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Hi! In a few weeks I'll be offering this clamp lever AND a high quality bubble strip at www.wannawanga.com

    Roy
     
  7. Sym-Cha

    Sym-Cha Master Member

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    I received this saber a few years ago ... mind you this replica is nowhere near accurate when it comes to the grenade rings ... they are way to fat ... but I don't have the means to alter them properly, nor do I care :

    [​IMG]

    So I decided to make a Luke ROTJ out of it and I removed the paint from the rings and booster section ... but then I thought hardly anyone makes the OB1 Shared Stunt ...

    [​IMG]

    . . . so now I'm back to square one, and I need to repaint those sections black again, add a red switch greeblie in the screw hole before the pommel.

    :wacko

    Chaim
     
  8. Sym-Cha

    Sym-Cha Master Member

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    @ MCM ... your schematics look a lot closer to the real Shared Stunt ... so keep it up :)

    Chaim
     
  9. MCM

    MCM Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    I've been watching the progress on the V2 thread. I definitely plan on picking up one of these sexy levers (or 2) when they're available :cool. I really do like the look of the longer lever for some reason.

    That saber is looking rad! I actually don't find the wider grips to be that annoying. Sure, it's not 100% screen accurate, but it's nice in an idealized way. Plus the width doesn't seem to be as noticeable when the rings are painted black (as in the first pic). Is the red switch greeblie you speak of the same as the blanking cap? Or is it some other piece entirely? The only pic I can find of it would be this one: v2 red switch greeblie.png

    It almost looks like some sort of push-push button or maybe a toggle switch. I'm not really sure.

    Matt
     
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  10. Sym-Cha

    Sym-Cha Master Member

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    Thanks ... painted black again those rings will look just fine ... not pictured are 2 vintage transistors on the opposite side of the G R A F L E X clamp . . . and indeed I gather it's a red push-button switch to activate the motor inside ... though I haven't found any just like it, yet :)

    Chaim
     
  11. thd9791

    thd9791 Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Ok - it's hard to sift through all the info on this website, but I delved into this prop a while back and got some good answers.

    1) As far as we know, the only difference between them back in the day was the lever (V2 was also missing a sidebar). I'm 90% sure it's the same lever as ANH, parts like that in the Archives seem to be in the same shape they were during filming (clamp ESB card, Kobold clips, grips, etc). They either had bubbles or nothing in the clamp and one prop had transistors and some ring around them on one side. I don't think this was either the Shared Stunt or V2 as neither of them show glue residue or holes in that area. There may have been more.

    2) The paint job is tough. The whole thing I believe was black, knowing how the floor effects attitude was, they wouldn't have bothered with a different shade of black. The neck appears to be some dark brass or copper, and we still have no good reference photos of that.

    3) The Shared Stunt we're pretty sure was a static prop. The V2 was lathed, cut and cleaned after casting for conversion into a spinning prop. The Shared Stunt still has seam lines and bubbles from the casting, so it might as well have been just a fencing prop. Before the end of ROTJ the nipple was cut off and removed for some reason, and there is proof of this in a filming shot from California with Vader and Luke (A practice shot of "that name no longer has any meaning for me"). Before this, it was used in the throne room I think, the V2 was the "belt hanger" that Luke tosses away.

    4) I had a friend machine those plans from Aluminum stock and this is how it turned out. (He did not have a mill, so they tried to do those pommel cubes on a lathe..turned out weird, you need a mill.
     

    Attached Files:

  12. Sym-Cha

    Sym-Cha Master Member

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    Okay ... if the shared stunt is supposed to be static why does it have a red switch button ... to what purpose?

    [​IMG]

    The shared stunt between OB1 in ANH and Luke in ROTJ is seen in the middle as it is now and went into space :

    [​IMG]

    This is not to be mistaken for the V2 whatsoever :wacko

    Chaim
     
    Last edited: Jul 2, 2015
  13. teecrooz

    teecrooz Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    The one in the top picture isn't the same as the one in the middle on the bottom picture. The top picture is the saber that became the Luke V2. This is the one with a motor in it and the emitter head spun the blade.
     
    Last edited: Jul 2, 2015
  14. Sym-Cha

    Sym-Cha Master Member

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    So are you suggesting that these holes, which are now covered up and closed with a set screw are not the remnants of OB1 ANH red switch and a possible electric wire going up Alec Guinness sleeve?

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    And if you're correct ... where does this saber seen above fit inbetween ANH and ROTJ shared or not ... this is becoming ever so more confusing ... :wacko

    Chaim
     
    Last edited: Jul 2, 2015
  15. teecrooz

    teecrooz Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    No, that is not the same saber. That is not the one in Alec's hand in the picture.
     
  16. PoopaPapaPalps

    PoopaPapaPalps Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    @Sym-Cha - My thinking was that it was also intended to be used as a spinning-bladed one as well but was decided to be used as a static one instead later on down the line. So the neck got fixed to not rotate anymore (it looks ugly to me) and was altered to have blades to just sit in the emitter and fastened into it.

    Either that or one of the stunt sabers (this and what we call the V2 at the time of filming ANH were both used for "stunt" work) was picked up to be modified for exhibition and it so happened to be that one.
     
  17. thd9791

    thd9791 Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Remember these pommels are separate beings too, it needs a set screw to stay in place.
     
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  18. redbutton

    redbutton Active Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    just a bit confusing I'd say. Do you think they did this to fool prop makers? I think it was a matter of 'we need this now we're filming today' type of thing.
    Anyway great fun this shall be!
     
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  19. MCM

    MCM Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Oh, that's totally the case. There seems to be little forethought involved with the props, especially during the first movie. How many times did the Luke/Vader shared stunt get changed around?
    "Uhhhh, guys, we need a Vader saber"
    *grabs Luke saber and some gaffer tape*
    "Tada! Vader saber!"

    That seems to be what happened with Luke and his ROTJ saber. I can totally picture them being like
    "uhh, guys, Luke lost his hand last flick, filming starts today, and we need a new saber."
    "Here, we haven't been using this one for a while" *grabs old Obi saber*
    "That looks like butts. Can ya give it a paint job real quick?"
    "Can do!"
    Wasn't the hero prop made later in production, anyway? That's the impression I was under, but I could be wrong. If it was made later in production, that seems to indicate that they chose the leftover ANH sabers more for convenience than anything and then later made a prettier hero version for closeups and whatnot.

    Also, regarding the set screw/switch business and the pommel being separate:
    I suppose it's totally possible that the original switch could have played a role in affixing the pommel to the main shaft. The electronics could have been discarded and a set screw then needed in place of the switch to keep the assembly together. Does that make sense? It's just a theory, but that red switch seems to be in the same spot that the set screw ended up being on the shared stunt and where the knurled cone thing ended up being on with the V2.
     
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  20. redbutton

    redbutton Active Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Too Funny!!
     
  21. Halliwax

    Halliwax Legendary Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    i really do try to follow these V2 vs shared threads, but i get so confused! lol
     
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  22. MCM

    MCM Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Yes, now that I look at that one picture more closely I can see the missing sidebar, which would lead me to believe that it's the same lever as the ROTJ-era V2. Quite cool! As far as the transistors go, the shared stunt had chrome tape put around the Graflex clamp which would cover and glue residue on the clamp. There wouldn't be additional holes to because the transistors cover 2 rectangular holes already on the clamp, so I think it's possible (to what degree, who knows) that the transistor clamp is the same as the shared stunt.

    To me, it looks like the emitter portion is a darker gray, pewtery color, as opposed to the same black as the grenade or booster section. You can see in this pic (which I am 99% sure is the V2) how the emitter reflects the light differently than the booster part. pic2.jpg .
    Also, this pic seems to suggest a more pewter-like color as well Alec saber.jpg
    Here's the transistorized prop and the emitter almost looks like raw aluminum in this pic. obi_wan_saber-vi v2.jpg . If this is the same as the Shared Stunt, that portion would have been covered with the chrome tape. The grips also look to be solid black.

    The emitter in this picture, too, has a different texture than the booster and grenade sections, leading me to believe that it's a different color. obicantina_scottjua.jpg

    I wonder if the Shared Stunt was ever "active" with a spinning blade. If it was always static, would that mean that all of the bladed shots from ANH would be the V2? Or did they use static blades in ANH? I know that by ESB they had ditched the spinning blades, and by ROTJ they had completely abandoned the reflective tape.

    That saber is nice! I didn't even know that it was possible to approximate the cubes on a lathe. How in the world does one do that? Even if they're not super accurate, I admire the achievement.
     
    Last edited: Jul 3, 2015
  23. thd9791

    thd9791 Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Very good points. I personally think there were at least 3 ANH stunts. V2, Shared Stunt, and a third. There are stills of Obi wan with a saber that has a bare metal emitter plate. This might be the same prop hanging there with the transistors.
    Obi Sword Silver.jpg

    The Shared Stunt has black paint underneath that Chrome tape on the emitter and the neck, and so does the V2 - without the metal tape of course.
    Luke-ObiSharedStunt01.jpg credit...Chaim?
     
  24. MCM

    MCM Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    I wouldn't be surprised at all if there are more than 2 Obi stunts. I don't think it's implausible that there could be 4 or more muahahahaha!

    The more I think about this, the more I think I want to make a functioning replica, spinning blade and all. I've been watching all kinds of youtube videos on aluminum casting, and it doesn't look that difficult, just dangerous :devil. I figure that I could simply 3D print the different pieces based on the Sketchup model, cast that, hollow it out, and perhaps gut a Dremel or some other rotary tool to make the blade spin. It's ambitious but totally doable.

    Now I just need to get the power supply replaced on my printer so I can start prototyping
     
  25. MCM

    MCM Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    @ the9791:

    The more I look through my pics, the more I'm inclined to agree; I think that there was a third distinct Obi stunt. I think the saber in these 2 pics may be that very one. In the pic on the left, the emitter and booster are definitely different colors, plus the top of the emitter is unfinished, probably a fender washer glued on after the fact. The pic on the right also shows the difference in color between the grenade part and the emitter. The saber on the right has a clamp (no bubbles) while the one on the left appears to have none, but the clamp could have been removed and replaced easily enough.


    3rd obi stunt.png

    The more I look at this pic Luke-ObiSharedStunt04.jpg , which I am fairly certain is the V2 (longer lever, sidebar seems to be missing), the more I think that the emitter is straight up black, and the pics of the shared stunt from the ESB rehearsals seem to indicate a black emitter. I definitely don't believe that to be the case in the above pics.

    I believe that the pics of saber with the unpainted emitter and greeblies is taken from the scene where Vader slices Ben in half. Perhaps they needed a slightly prettier saber for the close up as Obi-Wan closes his eyes right before Vader delivers the death blow. Maybe they didn't care and I'm looking too much into it :wacko

    Man! Now I feel like I must acquire a copy of the movie on blu ray in order to analyze this stuff in hi def. Now if someone wants to get a head start on me, by all means! :lol
     

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