AA/SDS recasting issue...

[vaderdarth]

Originally posted by TK765+Jan 24 2006, 04:41 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(TK765 @ Jan 24 2006, 04:41 PM)</div>

Originally posted by vaderdarth@Jan 24 2006, 08:30 PM

Originally posted by Darth Bill@Jan 24 2006, 04:09 PM
<!--QuoteBegin-Starkids1990

@Jan 24 2006, 07:58 PM

In addition not much was documented in the way of the prop making from the original production by LFL.

What do you mean by "documented"...??

If you mean "written about in the various 'Making-of' books", well, that's kinda right....

If you mean "photographed and documented for archival purposes"...??

Wrong.

Really, really wrong.




Russ

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That's a hefty claim........where is the documentation of the production process of the Stormtroopers Russ??? Where are the photographs of the original moulds??? That is the critical documentation in this case.

Dave

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David West Reynolds told me LFL has TONS of photographs of stormtrooper stuff that people haven't seen before.

Not to mention all the original ANH suits and helmets...

Thats a good question though....where are all the photographs of the production process of the stormtroopers??? Since you believe AA did everything then have him post them, since he took lots of pics it seems this shouldn't be too hard. Lets see the pics of him sculpting it :lol

Still waiting......

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Well that's the whole nutshell isn't it? Neither side seems to be blowing us away with their photographic or other forms of proof from that period of time. (Maybe because it's awaiting it's due course in a courtroom???)

Which is exactly what makes all these claims "opinion" rather than fact.

No matter who you believe, the absolute proof continues to avoid this body of members.

Based on what each side has seen to date............we believe different things.............and apparently neither of us have seen even a fraction of the supposed proof. So why the heck are we trying to draw final conclusions at this stage???

 

[TKBIG]

Originally posted by TK765+Jan 24 2006, 03:41 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(TK765 @ Jan 24 2006, 03:41 PM)</div>

Originally posted by vaderdarth@Jan 24 2006, 08:30 PM

Originally posted by Darth Bill@Jan 24 2006, 04:09 PM
<!--QuoteBegin-Starkids1990

@Jan 24 2006, 07:58 PM

In addition not much was documented in the way of the prop making from the original production by LFL.

What do you mean by "documented"...??

If you mean "written about in the various 'Making-of' books", well, that's kinda right....

If you mean "photographed and documented for archival purposes"...??






Russ

[snapback]1166956[/snapback]​

That's a hefty claim........where is the documentation of the production process of the Stormtroopers Russ??? Where are the photographs of the original moulds??? That is the critical documentation in this case.

Dave

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David West Reynolds told me LFL has TONS of photographs of stormtrooper stuff that people haven't seen before.

Not to mention all the original ANH suits and helmets...

Thats a good question though....where are all the photographs of the production process of the stormtroopers??? Since you believe AA did everything then have him post them, since he took lots of pics it seems this shouldn't be too hard. Lets see the pics of him sculpting it :lol

Still waiting......

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"all" the original ANH suits and helmets?
Really....?????
I don't think that is correct....go check your facts again, especially check with what TE himself had to say about that.



Russ..."a hit and run"...you can do better.
Backup those statements with your "secretive" facts and I'll change my mind.

As a matter of fact archival information was not at the top of GL's list of "to do's" when the original 1976 movie was in production.
GL has stated that on more than one interview.
Numerous prop makers for working for Lucas during that time have stated the same (and on the record).
In fact during the making of segements for ROTS the set desingers had to recreate from scratch the Tantive IV sets from limited pictures taken during the original shoots. Because archival data was very scant at best.

(*edited)

Wrong.

Really, really wrong.

Please....don't throw in commentary in like that.
It's no better than trolling.
(*edit*)

No offense TK765 but the stuff DWR shows in the visual dictionaries (items that Wrong.

Really, really wrong.were provided by LFL archives) is far from being accurate to the screen used pieces in many cases............................................Try again.

 

[Emeldahay]

700 posts. Excellent. Can we get to 1000?

So much bandwidth....so little legal knowledge....

 

[CWR]

I was in the archive building once in 96 and again in early 97 while gathering costume reference for a Star Wars project I was working on. I know for a fact they definately have physical proof to show the suits AA is making could not possibly be from original 1976 moulds. That is what I am basing my knowledge from. I know the AA supporters are going to not like me saying this but it is very true. They don't have all of the ANH suits but they don't need to have all of them to prove their point.

That said, Sithlord is correct in saying we just need to wait and see what happens.

 

[SithLord]

Originally posted by CWR@Jan 24 2006, 05:42 PM
I was in the archive building once in 96 and again in early 97 while gathering costume reference for a Star Wars project I was working on.  I know for a fact they definately have physical proof to show the suits AA is making could not possibly be from original 1976 moulds.  That is what I am basing my knowledge from.  I know the AA supporters are going to not like me saying this but it is very true.  They don't have all of the ANH suits but they don't need to have all of them  to prove their point.

That said, Sithlord is correct in saying we just need to wait and see what happens.

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Thanks CWR, although if you know what physical proof they have are you able to share it with us?

As to AA requiring photos of himself making the molds, he doesn't need them. He HAS the molds and can prove he made them. LFL having suits won't negate that.

And he has photos showing himself with the TIE helmets, showing the raw stormtrooper helmets in front of HIS studio, etc....

I'm still curious what the forum's or mod's position is on whether I would be able to make my own lightsabers if I had the original production molds....

:cheers,

Thomas

 

[vaderdarth]

Originally posted by CWR@Jan 24 2006, 05:42 PM
I was in the archive building once in 96 and again in early 97 while gathering costume reference for a Star Wars project I was working on.  I know for a fact they definately have physical proof to show the suits AA is making could not possibly be from original 1976 moulds.  That is what I am basing my knowledge from.  I know the AA supporters are going to not like me saying this but it is very true.  They don't have all of the ANH suits but they don't need to have all of them  to prove their point.

That said, Sithlord is correct in saying we just need to wait and see what happens.

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CWR, I'd truly like to see that indesputable evidence for myself. Until then, I will just assume it's "illusive". No offense intended. Peace,

Dave

 

[SithLord]

Originally posted by Emeldahay@Jan 24 2006, 05:35 PM
700 posts.  Excellent.  Can we get to 1000? 

So much bandwidth....so little legal knowledge....

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Heh....free post

:cheers,

Thomas

 

[CWR]

Originally posted by vaderdarth+Jan 24 2006, 02:06 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(vaderdarth @ Jan 24 2006, 02:06 PM)</div>

<!--QuoteBegin-CWR

@Jan 24 2006, 05:42 PM
I was in the archive building once in 96 and again in early 97 while gathering costume reference for a Star Wars project I was working on.  I know for a fact they definately have physical proof to show the suits AA is making could not possibly be from original 1976 moulds.  That is what I am basing my knowledge from.  I know the AA supporters are going to not like me saying this but it is very true.  They don't have all of the ANH suits but they don't need to have all of them  to prove their point.

That said, Sithlord is correct in saying we just need to wait and see what happens.

[snapback]1167056[/snapback]​

CWR, I'd truly like to see that indesputable evidence for myself. Until then, I will just assume it's "illusive". No offense intended. Peace,

Dave

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No offense taken. I don't expect that anyone would blindly believe what I post. I wish I could post pictures but I am sure LFL has access to these threads and I am under NDA with them so I guess we will just have to wait. I was merely stating that I am going off my own personal knowledge to make my decisions about the provenance of AA's armor.

 

[Lord Abaddon]

Originally posted by CWR+Jan 24 2006, 05:41 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(CWR @ Jan 24 2006, 05:41 PM)</div>

Originally posted by vaderdarth@Jan 24 2006, 02:06 PM
<!--QuoteBegin-CWR

@Jan 24 2006, 05:42 PM
I was in the archive building once in 96 and again in early 97 while gathering costume reference for a Star Wars project I was working on.  I know for a fact they definately have physical proof to show the suits AA is making could not possibly be from original 1976 moulds.  That is what I am basing my knowledge from.  I know the AA supporters are going to not like me saying this but it is very true.  They don't have all of the ANH suits but they don't need to have all of them  to prove their point.

That said, Sithlord is correct in saying we just need to wait and see what happens.

[snapback]1167056[/snapback]​

CWR, I'd truly like to see that indesputable evidence for myself. Until then, I will just assume it's "illusive". No offense intended. Peace,

Dave

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No offense taken. I don't expect that anyone would blindly believe what I post. I wish I could post pictures but I am sure LFL has access to these threads and I am under NDA with them so I guess we will just have to wait. I was merely stating that I am going off my own personal knowledge to make my decisions about the provenance of AA's armor.

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[/b]

CWR, that actually means more than you think. Sure, we have your word, but I don't discount someone on their word outright either. I do know that it is incredibly difficult to get into the archives, several friends at ILM were not able to see them even as technical directors on LFL films. You're very lucky, it must have been a heck of a sight. I know from my visits to the Ranch how amazing the whole place is, just beautiful...and then there is that big, windowless building....

 

[OldKen]

from all that ive heard from those in the know, i believe you CWR, not just cause of the side of the fence your on...

guys, if you saw say... i dont know... MOULDS in the LFL archive building, but were told that if you spoke about it, you were never allowed back... would you talk about it here just to win a pissing contest?

if thats what it was, i wouldnt.

cause the AA loyal would still say it didnt prove anything anyway bla bla...

i am not an AA basher, im somewhere in between.

but i AM a firm believer that he doesnt have a candle in the winds chance against LFLs legal eagles.

sorry i just dont see it

 

[CWR]

Originally posted by Lord Abaddon+Jan 24 2006, 02:49 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Lord Abaddon @ Jan 24 2006, 02:49 PM)</div>

Originally posted by CWR@Jan 24 2006, 05:41 PM

Originally posted by vaderdarth@Jan 24 2006, 02:06 PM
<!--QuoteBegin-CWR

@Jan 24 2006, 05:42 PM
I was in the archive building once in 96 and again in early 97 while gathering costume reference for a Star Wars project I was working on.  I know for a fact they definately have physical proof to show the suits AA is making could not possibly be from original 1976 moulds.  That is what I am basing my knowledge from.  I know the AA supporters are going to not like me saying this but it is very true.  They don't have all of the ANH suits but they don't need to have all of them  to prove their point.

That said, Sithlord is correct in saying we just need to wait and see what happens.

[snapback]1167056[/snapback]​

CWR, I'd truly like to see that indesputable evidence for myself. Until then, I will just assume it's "illusive". No offense intended. Peace,

Dave

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No offense taken. I don't expect that anyone would blindly believe what I post. I wish I could post pictures but I am sure LFL has access to these threads and I am under NDA with them so I guess we will just have to wait. I was merely stating that I am going off my own personal knowledge to make my decisions about the provenance of AA's armor.

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CWR, that actually means more than you think. Sure, we have your word, but I don't discount someone on their word outright either. I do know that it is incredibly difficult to get into the archives, several friends at ILM were not able to see them even as technical directors on LFL films. You're very lucky, it must have been a heck of a sight. I know from my visits to the Ranch how amazing the whole place is, just beautiful...and then there is that big, windowless building....

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[/b]

It is an experience that I still hold dear to this day. I have some very cool pictures that I hope to be able to share one day. I do consider myself very lucky to have had that opportunity. I will never forget sitting in the original Landspeeder doing my obi wan impression (yes, I am a Star Wars geek) or picking up original saber hilts and various other props. I hope to one day be able to share my experience with members of this board. Maybe when things cool down a bit I might just do that. In the meantime I just want to see this whole thing end so we can get back to the fun part of prop building and collecting.

 

[Lord Abaddon]

Originally posted by CWR+Jan 24 2006, 06:09 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(CWR @ Jan 24 2006, 06:09 PM)</div>

Originally posted by Lord Abaddon@Jan 24 2006, 02:49 PM

Originally posted by CWR@Jan 24 2006, 05:41 PM

Originally posted by vaderdarth@Jan 24 2006, 02:06 PM
<!--QuoteBegin-CWR

@Jan 24 2006, 05:42 PM
I was in the archive building once in 96 and again in early 97 while gathering costume reference for a Star Wars project I was working on.  I know for a fact they definately have physical proof to show the suits AA is making could not possibly be from original 1976 moulds.  That is what I am basing my knowledge from.  I know the AA supporters are going to not like me saying this but it is very true.  They don't have all of the ANH suits but they don't need to have all of them  to prove their point.

That said, Sithlord is correct in saying we just need to wait and see what happens.

[snapback]1167056[/snapback]​

CWR, I'd truly like to see that indesputable evidence for myself. Until then, I will just assume it's "illusive". No offense intended. Peace,

Dave

[snapback]1167081[/snapback]​

No offense taken. I don't expect that anyone would blindly believe what I post. I wish I could post pictures but I am sure LFL has access to these threads and I am under NDA with them so I guess we will just have to wait. I was merely stating that I am going off my own personal knowledge to make my decisions about the provenance of AA's armor.

[snapback]1167116[/snapback]​

CWR, that actually means more than you think. Sure, we have your word, but I don't discount someone on their word outright either. I do know that it is incredibly difficult to get into the archives, several friends at ILM were not able to see them even as technical directors on LFL films. You're very lucky, it must have been a heck of a sight. I know from my visits to the Ranch how amazing the whole place is, just beautiful...and then there is that big, windowless building....

[snapback]1167122[/snapback]​

It is an experience that I still hold dear to this day. I have some very cool pictures that I hope to be able to share one day. I do consider myself very lucky to have had that opportunity. I will never forget sitting in the original Landspeeder doing my obi wan impression (yes, I am a Star Wars geek) or picking up original saber hilts and various other props. I hope to one day be able to share my experience with members of this board. Maybe when things cool down a bit I might just do that. In the meantime I just want to see this whole thing end so we can get back to the fun part of prop building and collecting.

[snapback]1167144[/snapback]​

[/b]

Very cool...

I can't imagine how I would feel. Just Magic of Myth or Skywalker Ranch were mind blowing (I could barely be torn away from the Star Destroyer at MoM or the prop displays at the Ranch).

Actually, in all honesty, I consider this a "seperate" issue from the rest of the talk and RPF. It's kind of like when you talk politics, religion, or money with family or friends. It can get heated, it can get intense, it can get sometimes downright nasty (not really in this one though.), but in the end you go back to what brings you together in the first place...and in this case it's the fun of props.

 

[Darth Bill]

Originally posted by Starkids1990@Jan 24 2006, 09:18 PM

Russ..."a hit and run"...you can do better.
Backup those statements with your "secretive" facts and I'll change my mind.

As a matter of fact archival information was not at the top of GL's list of "to do's" when the original 1976 movie was in production.
GL has stated that on more than one interview.
Numerous prop makers for working for Lucas during that time have stated the same (and on the record).
In fact during the making of segements for ROTS the set desingers had to recreate from scratch the Tantive IV sets from limited pictures taken during the original shoots. Because archival data was very scant at best.

Please....don't throw in commentary in like that.
It's no better than trolling.
No offense TK765 but the stuff DWR shows in the visual dictionaries (items that were provided by LFL archives) is far from being accurate to the screen used pieces in many cases............................................Try again.

Don't need to.

I know what I know. S'good enough for me.

I know how this is all going to turn out. Once again, s'good enough for me.

No need to add to the already-36-pages-and-counting of "Oh yeah?. Yeah.." to those who don't want to look under their idol's robe to see the feet of clay.

You want to believe that Lucas didn't prioritize documenting the most important elements of Star Wars during filming (despite the fact that he'd already cut one of the shrewdest licensing deals in history)...??

Knock yourself out.

You're wrong, though. And you will see.

S'good enough for me.




Russ

 

[TKBIG]

Originally posted by Darth Bill+Jan 24 2006, 06:27 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Darth Bill @ Jan 24 2006, 06:27 PM)</div>

<!--QuoteBegin-Starkids1990

@Jan 24 2006, 09:18 PM

Russ..."a hit and run"...you can do better.
Backup those statements with your "secretive" facts and I'll change my mind.

As a matter of fact archival information was not at the top of GL's list of "to do's" when the original 1976 movie was in production.
GL has stated that on more than one interview.
Numerous prop makers for working for Lucas during that time have stated the same (and on the record).
In fact during the making of segements for ROTS the set desingers had to recreate from scratch the Tantive IV sets from limited pictures taken during the original shoots. Because archival data was very scant at best.

Please....don't throw in commentary in like that.
It's no better than trolling.
No offense TK765 but the stuff DWR shows in the visual dictionaries (items that were provided by LFL archives) is far from being accurate to the screen used pieces in
many cases............................................Try again.

Don't need to.

I know what I know. S'good enough for me.

I know how this is all going to turn out. Once again, s'good enough for me.

No need to add to the already-36-pages-and-counting of "Oh yeah?. Yeah.." to those who don't want to look under their idol's robe to see the feet of clay.

You want to believe that Lucas didn't prioritize documenting the most important elements of Star Wars during filming (despite the fact that he'd already cut one of the shrewdest licensing deals in history)...??

Knock yourself out.

You're wrong, though. And you will see.

S'good enough for me.




Russ

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[/b]

Everybody sing
'cause it's good enough for me.........
:lol :lol :lol

If you don't want to join in the fun why spoil ours?

 

[OldKen]

eee yah yah yah yah yayeeeahahaaah. (goonies... goonies...)

 

[exoray]

Ainsworth can simply ignore the US Court proceedings and then the whole issue defaults back to the UK courts. The difference is, if AA wins in the UK and decides to countersue LFL in the UK, LFL does have business properties in the UK and WOULD have to answer to UK courts. Especially if the original agreement between GL and AA took place on UK soil.

There is one huge and misunderstood legal problem with this statement...

There is NO default to UK courts, sorry... There would have to be a new case started by AA, and nothing is stopping him...

If AA ignores the US lawsuit then a judgement against him will be automatic, for pretty much everything LFL has asked for... They then petiition the UK courts for payment of the judgment, there is no new trial only a check on validity of the debt, not it's merits...

 

[exoray]

You want to believe that Lucas didn't prioritize documenting the most important elements of Star Wars during filming (despite the fact that he'd already cut one of the shrewdest licensing deals in history)...??

Well stated...

 

[TKBIG]

Originally posted by CWR@Jan 24 2006, 04:42 PM
I know for a fact they definately have physical proof to show the suits AA is making could not possibly be from original 1976 moulds.  That is what I am basing my knowledge from.  I know the AA supporters are going to not like me saying this but it is very true.  They don't have all of the ANH suits but they don't need to have all of them  to prove their point.

That said, Sithlord is correct in saying we just need to wait and see what happens.

[snapback]1167056[/snapback]​

Your right. LFL only need to produce one original ANH suit and compare it to AA's stuff. But then again all you have to do to prove that AA isn't using original condition molds is pop in a DVD and compare what he is selling to what is there.

I agree with you without having to see any other physcial proof. But, I really wish you could share your info. I understand the NDA but I'm sure you info would be a heck of a lot better than what's been presented so far from both sides of the fence.

I will continue to hold to my belief that AA sculpted the originals until I see the proof otherwise.

BTW that doesn't make me a supporter of AA. But by stating I believe he sculpted the originals it seems I've been counted as one......false assumption.

 

[TKBIG]

Originally posted by oldken@Jan 24 2006, 07:07 PM
eee yah yah yah yah yayeeeahahaaah.  (goonies... goonies...) 

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:lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol

 

[CWR]

Originally posted by Starkids1990+Jan 24 2006, 04:26 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Starkids1990 @ Jan 24 2006, 04:26 PM)</div>

<!--QuoteBegin-CWR

@Jan 24 2006, 04:42 PM
I know for a fact they definately have physical proof to show the suits AA is making could not possibly be from original 1976 moulds.  That is what I am basing my knowledge from.  I know the AA supporters are going to not like me saying this but it is very true.  They don't have all of the ANH suits but they don't need to have all of them  to prove their point.

That said, Sithlord is correct in saying we just need to wait and see what happens.

[snapback]1167056[/snapback]​

Your right. LFL only need to produce one original ANH suit and compare it to AA's stuff. But then again all you have to do to prove that AA isn't using original condition molds is pop in a DVD and compare what he is selling to what is there.

I agree with you without having to see any other physcial proof. But, I really wish you could share your info. I understand the NDA but I'm sure you info would be a heck of a lot better than what's been presented so far from both sides of the fence.

I will continue to hold to my belief that AA sculpted the originals until I see the proof otherwise.

BTW that doesn't make me a supporter of AA. But by stating I believe he sculpted the originals it seems I've been counted as one......false assumption.

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I suppose I should not throw statements like that around freely. I did not mean to sound as though I was lumping everyone that does not agree with my position as an AA supporter. As far as showing proof, I would love to but I think I have opened myself up enough already. I promise I will share as much as I can when all of this blows over. I know that sounds like a cop out but I just don't want any legal issues to bite me just so I can proove a point that in the grand scheme of things does not really matter that much. Even if I showed pics that I feel are proof someone will most likely find a way to discount it anyway.

-CWR