Vader's TRUE ROTJ saber (re-examined)!!

GINO · Dec 29, 2007

Contrary to popular belief, Vader did have a saber hook on his belt in ROTJ.
Only it is attached further on his side which obscures it.
I've scoured my reference and found these two pics clearly showing a lightsaber hanging from it. I have another reference (not digital) that shows the saber hook (without saber attached) and the hook is attached on the outside of the leather belt instead of under like the ANH and ESB belts.

Here is the interesting part.
We all know that what most people refer to as the ROTJ vader saber (the one with the converted graflex top and allen head bolts all over) was not the hero saber, but only a dueling saber used in all three films with the aluminum blade cut off post ROTJ.

I've always believed that the barbican saber was THE hero ROTJ saber. But now I'm having some difficulty with that conclusion.
The following pics taken during ROTJ and on the set show what I believe looks to be a MPP style saber hanging from his belt. Bear with me, the pics are not the clearest, but you can still make out the two distinctive MPP horizontal oval holes in the pic.
Also, in the other pic, it looks like we're seeing the hat pin on the side of the clamp (like the ESB saber). Not for certain, but could this saber be the ESB without the colored wires?

Thoughts? :confused

GINO · Dec 29, 2007

After looking at the first pic more closely, I don't think it is the side of the control box, but rather the front face.

lonepigeon · Dec 29, 2007

Good eye Gino!

I hadn't really been looking for the saber, but I have recently received some reference from LFL for a job I'm working on and can solve this mystery.

The saber on Vader's belt in those pics IS the ESB Hero saber!

I have one of the other pics in that same series with the troopers and the white background. It is definitely the same saber.
No modifications at all!
The wires are still there and everything.

I don't know when those photos were shot (pre, post or during production) but that's pretty surprising that the saber made it through ESB and into ROTJ intact.

GINO · Dec 29, 2007

Thanks for verifying Chris. That is fantastic news!!!

Now I have to source another ESB saber. :cry

GINO · Dec 30, 2007

Bump, because this is big news.

James Kenobi 1138 · Dec 30, 2007

GINO, awesome discovery. I'm happy you were able to share those pics with us, the reflection off of an MPP is very distinctive and I agree with your observation. It's great that Chris can confirm this 100%.

I'd offer to sell you my Parks MPP, but I'm sure you have contact for a real MPP on the side somewhere.......

Big news indeed. Where is Darth Saber when you need him?

BrandtFX · Dec 31, 2007

Just wondering, Is it possible they just used that saber for the photoshoot and not in the movie? Do we know if those photos were taken Pre or Post production?

-Mike

GINO · Dec 31, 2007

One of the photos that shows it is on the set of ROTJ.

SHalamar · Dec 31, 2007

Heh... Then the ESB Saber I wear on my RotJ costume is accurate!

Woo Hoo!

Darth Lars · Dec 31, 2007

Here is detail from a screen grab from a HD broadcast of ROTJ, the original image seen below. If that is not an MPP shroud, then I don't know what it is. Notice the mounting hole for the flash reflector and the curved outline near it - neither the Barbican, the "Severed hand saber" nor the "Vader ROTJ" saber have these features.

Onigiri · Jan 1, 2008

...just when you think you got it all figured out...25 years later...BLAM!.....ESB saber is now the ROTJ saber....lol

glim999 · Jan 1, 2008

So, where does the old ROTJ figure in now?

GINO · Jan 1, 2008

There were other vader sabers used in rotj as stunt or dueling. The only one seen hanging off the belt (so far) has been the ESB.

The one most people think of as the rotj saber was actually used in all 3 ot films as a dueling saber and only had the blade severed post rotj filming.

glim999 · Jan 1, 2008

Ah, I see. Thanks

Ham Solo · Jan 1, 2008

Interesting thread!

Tan Djarka · Jan 1, 2008

Interesting indeed! So it turns out neither of the sabers from ROTJ, Luke or Vader, originally believed to be the heroes, actually were?

jakob2121 · Jan 1, 2008

Pretty much. Though it's possible the "hero" Luke is in fact the hero saber shown, but modified after that scene. The new style black button is visible.

Thread hijack over.

Sporak · Jan 2, 2008

Wow.
Good information. I love it!

Gino, how sure are you that the "Jedi Vader" dueling saber was used in all 3 films?

I think it was Darth Saber that posted screen caps of the one we know as the "Jedi Vader" from Jedi, I think it was just before Vaders hand is cut off...

I remember seeing a dueling saber from 4 that was quite different Prowse had it I seem to remember.

Do you have any shots you've found showing it?
Or references?

A thought I'm having is that perhaps a cool set could be made with Vader and Luke stunt/dueling sabers.There was a shot of the Luke Graflex showing similar bolts to hold the blade in from the Christies auction.

Hmmm.....
The world of sabers becomes interesting again

GINO · Jan 2, 2008

Sporak said:
Gino, how sure are you that the "Jedi Vader" dueling saber was used in all 3 films?

Pretty sure but not 100%. I couldn't find a pic of it from ANH but I could have swore I saw a pic of it being used by either Alec Guiness or Prowse in some behind the scenes photo either standing around or practicing dueling.
Here's a pic of it in esb, courtesy of parts of SW. Chris would be a good guy to ask about this as well.

Sporak said:
I think it was Darth Saber that posted screen caps of the one we know as the "Jedi Vader" from Jedi, I think it was just before Vaders hand is cut off...

It looks similar but is not the one. Here is a small pic of the actual saber/hand from the rotj as well as a screen cap of it.

Sporak said:
I remember seeing a dueling saber from 4 that was quite different Prowse had it I seem to remember.

I think there were several dueling sabers. I have a shot of one in the archives, then there is sansweet's, and then there is the MoM (common) version. It's probable that there's even more.
I think some utilized full length blades while others had stubby short length blades.

CGClone · Jan 2, 2008

Gino, youre just now figuring this out? I thought everyone knew...I kid, I kid!

Nice find and thanks for sharing!

Vader's TRUE ROTJ saber (re-examined)!!

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