Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Post-release)

So I keep popping back in to see if there's anything interesting, like Did you know one of the reference books says Rey built her own speeder and pimped it to do barrel rolls? or Do you think we'll see her building a new lightsabre? or even Oh man, have you seen Daisy Ridley's training video where she flips and hangs upside-down on a climbing wall?

Instead I have to wade through the cry-baby crap. I don't care if Adam Driver could hit Daisy Ridley, I do care that a psyched-up, pissed-off Rey can knock the **** out of a guy who's already been in a fight and been shot with a bowcaster that we've seen knocking Stormtroopers on their asses. I care that she's doing it because she's desperate, and a little scared, not sure if her friend is dead, and just seen a guy she admired killed.

But sure, tell me again why she's a bad character because a little girl can't do those things... then tell me why you'll accept that a 2-foot tall, green muppet can.
[/rant]

Sorry. But now I seriously hope that the next part has Poe/Finn be a thing or Rey getting with that female X-wing pilot, 'cos that'll hopefully make the bigots' heads explode and then we can get some peace.
 
Kristen's definition of a troll: Anyone who disagrees with her and has the audacity to express their dissent.

The Wook

Well I--as an ignorant, clueless and helpless Female--do not know what I would do had I not The Wook to speak for me, but I'll give it a go anyway...

My Learned Friend asserts that my definition of a Troll is anyone who disagrees with me. Let's put that to an empirical test, and see if it stands:

Since:

A. I think you sound like a condescending sexist jerk when you say things like this:

Of course, I'd never want to see them fight. Men should never engage the weaker sex in physical violence. One punch from a man Adam's size and with his hand-to-hand combat training, could very easily do more than turn Daisy's lights out, it could end her life.

So let's stop this foolish talk. If you want to believe the Force was an equalizing factor in the movie, that's one thing. But don't bring it into the real world, cause it just doesn't pass the giggle test.

The Wook

and since:

B. The only person in this thread who seems to disagree with me about that is YOU.

Therefore, yes.. I suppose you are correct.


PS.... how's Renelle? Did you ever decide to move to Oz.... cuz that'd be awesome.
 
Last edited:
No. Pros can't reliably do it because they're fighting someone else heavily trained in that discipline. In that comment gender is irrelevant, I got about 60lbs on Holly Holm, I doubt I could catch her to land one, and her extra speed would lead to me getting caught with vicious counter attacks.

Plus, Adam was a marine for 2 yrs, about 10 years ago. From what I've read of hand to hand combat in the marines, its not that extensive. They have the Marine Martial Arts Program, but promotion in that is based on training hours rather than proficiency. So I would question his fight game until seen.

That's not to also mention that we don't know what MOS Adam had in the Corps, just because you're a Marine does not mean that you're automatically some kind of bad ass. Just like all branches of the military there are tons of job fields in the Corps and most of them don't even involve combat, most are support roles that don't involve shooting at anybody, much less learning much MCMAP. Trust me, I know what I'm talking about because I spent 7 years in the Marine Corps Reserves as an air winger and we hardly touched our and we never practiced any of the hand to hand LINE (pre-MCMAP hand to hand) training that we got in boot camp.

Lastly, The Wook, Adam would probably a bit insulted at you calling him an ex-Marine, we don't like the term ex-Marine, we prefer either former Marine or just plain Marine. Ex-Marined implies that we are longer a Marine, that we got kicked out or something, because we have a saying in the Corps, "Once a Marine, always a Marine".
 
Last edited by a moderator:
View attachment 578721
the bottom left story tag line seems so germane to how this all started.and hey its Adam Driver

Hmmm... do you think "the un named hairy one who thinks girls are weak" could get some pointers there that would help him with his social graces?

Oh, right... he'd have to READ it. I'm not certain that Cave Trolls have the capacity for reading, frankly. What a pity.

- - - Updated - - -


You can't post this!!! That's just... that's just... GIRL POWER RUN AMOK!!! Gasp! Run Screaming! Ahhhhh!

:p

- - - Updated - - -

ps~FTR, I'm not being critical of Daisy Ridley. I adore her, and think she did a fantastic job in the role they gave to her in TFA. I just hate the role, as I've articulated in detail earlier in this thread.

Then perhaps in future you will confine your comments to the above, instead of continuously inserting negative and demeaning statements about how women are the WEAKER SEX and how that is a fact, and blah blah blah. If you stuck to your opinion of the character only, none of this would ever have happened.

- - - Updated - - -

She's pretty spot on if you use wikipedia's definition...

"a person who sows discord on the Internet by starting arguments or upsetting people, by posting inflammatory, extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community (such as a newsgroup, forum, chat room, or blog) with the deliberate intent of provoking readers into an emotional response or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion, often for their own amusement."

Of course, the word misogynist certainly fits, too.

Ba-BOOM!!!!

JD, I am really beginning to like you... and not just because you defended me. :)
 
Can Adam Driver beat up Daisy Ridley?

I honestly don't know.

Could he knock her out in a single punch if she bothered to stand still and let him?

Again, I honestly don't know.


More to the point, though, none of that matters for purposes of the film.


We're dealing with a film world where the following have literally been shown on screen:


  • Yoda used the Force to lift a ship probably 30x his own size and weight out of a swamp.
  • Yoda flipped and spun around like a spider monkey on crack to fight Dooku.
  • Luke shot straight into the air about 40 feet to grab on to overhanging gear in the Bespin carbonite chamber.
  • Numerous characters have pulled and thrown all manner of objects big and small through the air using the Force.
  • Darth Vader crushed the windpipes of numerous people, including those he was literally just watching on TV who were in an entirely different part of the ship.
  • Several characters have visions of the future as a result of the Force.
  • At least one character has had abstract visions of a malevolent presence through the use of the Force (Luke in the cave at Dagobah).
  • The Dark Side of the Force made at least two characters' eyes turn all red and evil-lookin'.
  • Force-using characters have repeatedly used laser swords to block incoming blaster shots, and even reflect them back at the shooters.
  • Even untrained individuals "sensed" things through the Force (e.g. Leia finding Luke on Bespin).

In The Force Awakens, we also see:

  • Rey displaying hitherto unknown powers and abilities that astound even her, and whose origin she cannot explain.
  • Chewie's bowcaster literally blow a Stormtrooper around 10 feet through the air and into a wall, as well as cause minor explosions near other troopers.
  • Rey displaying her melee combat abilities using her staff.
  • Kylo Ren harboring doubts of his own abilities.
  • Kylo Ren apparently being reluctant to kill his own father.
  • Kylo Ren taking a bowcaster shot to the gut and then having to fight Finn.

So, when Rey suddenly becomes imbued with the power of the Force, I find it entirely believable that she could thereafter defeat an already-critically-wounded Kylo Ren.

Why? Simple.

The Force is, for all intents and purposes, space magic. It doesn't obey the "rules" of the real world. Star Wars is not and never has been grounded in a reality that mirrors our own. To the contrary, it is grand space fantasy. Now, admittedly, it is grand space fantasy that has remained familiar to us through a combination of storytelling tropes, expertly built props, and -- in some of the films, at least -- a kind of "weathered" or "lived-in" sense for the universe, but it has never, ever been "real" or striven for "realism."

Moreover, as I note above, TFA did try to show its audience that Rey is (A) extremely powerful, (B) has an unknown limit to her power, (C) is uncertain of the source of her powers, (D) was hidden away for reasons that remain unknown to us, and (D) was fighting an already heavily wounded opponent.


So, in summation, there is zero reason why Rey couldn't defeat Kylo Ren, regardless of the fact that she's smaller, she's a woman, she's untrained in the use of the Force, etc.

It's space magic. Her abilities obeyed the rules created within the universe. The film may not have effectively conveyed all of that to every audience member, but it is there to be seen. If folks want to complain that the film didn't do enough to explain Rey's abilities or contextualize why she could win in the fight against Kylo Ren, fine. But let's move on from the notion of "But he's bigger and stronger than her!" because, again -- space magic.
 
So this is the dumbest article I've seen yet relating to the film. Apparently the film is racist. I encourage everyone to flood the comment section with just how wrong she is.

http://www.thestreet.com/story/1340...awakens-is-racist.html?puc=yahoo&cm_ven=YAHOO

yep.. I officially concur: that is THE single DUMBEST thing I have ever heard.

First, John Boyega is NOT an African American... he's a British Subject. So fail#1 there.

Second, he isn't given the name Finn, Poe suggests it, and Finn says "Yeah.. I LIKE that". Doesn't sound compulsory at all. Someone made a suggestion of an alternate name than the designation he was given by the First Order, and he DECIDED (on his own---of his own free will) to go with it. It was his CHOICE.

Third, Rey is not a better fighter than Finn... she is a different sort of fighter, who is the product of different upbringing. Let's not forget that Finn took on Kylo before Rey did, and despite having no experience against a Force User and no training previously with a Lightsaber, he did pretty well.

fourth.. it's race baiting...like so much we see in the media these days. One scarcely wants to bother responding to it any longer, because the baiters don't listen... they just keep on perpetuating their twisted ideas.
 
Last edited:
So this is the dumbest article I've seen yet relating to the film. Apparently the film is racist. I encourage everyone to flood the comment section with just how wrong she is.

http://www.thestreet.com/story/1340...awakens-is-racist.html?puc=yahoo&cm_ven=YAHOO

That was a very insightful article, which echoes some observations I've made earlier in this thread.

I seriously hope that the next part has Poe/Finn be a thing or Rey getting with that female X-wing pilot.

Oh that's coming. It's the next item on the agenda. It won't be any of the characters you mentioned, but you can bet your bottom dollar that there will be Star Wars' first openly gay (3PO and Jar Jar don't count) in these next episodes. And yes, possibly a gay couple. They will be good, virtuous to the core.

Then all three boxes of the agenda will be checked:

* female protagonist better, stronger, smarter, more virtuous than any male ever
* black hero, virtuous to the core, who gets the white woman
* openly gay character, virtuous to the core (and if disney's feeling really audacious, an openly gay couple)

The liberal trifecta!

Once again, I have no problem with Rey being powerful. My problems is that she was instantly all-powerful, to the exclusion of showing her learn, struggle, sacrifice and grow (like we saw with Luke). It makes her unrelatable and unbelievable. Finn and the inter-racial relationship doesn't bother my either, except that it's insulting to blacks to have given Boyega (a terrific actor) a token part in the film--Finn's character is completely extraneous to the plot--instead of a valuable role who actually does something meaningful (like Poe). It's so transparent and insulting to the black community, I find it disgusting. As for the third box, it is yet to be checked, so I cannot comment on it specifically. But I hope when it happens--which is a fait accompli--Disney is not as insulting to the gay community as they have been to the black community.

The Wook
 
Whew, I was wondering when homophobia would finally show up and it has! @The Wook, you are peppering all your comments with your own political and social bias and it's really problematic and totally not appropriate to discussing this film.

I didn't bring up gays in Star Wars, the poster above me did. What, I'm not allowed to respond to topics people bring up?! lol

And I'm definitely not a homophobe. If you even read my post, you'd see that my wish is that the filmmakers don't make the inevitable gay character a token the way they did Finn.

The Wook
 
That was a very insightful article, which echoes some observations I've made earlier in this thread.




Once again, I have no problem with Rey being powerful. My problems is that she was instantly all-powerful, to the exclusion of showing her learn, struggle, sacrifice and grow (like we saw with Luke). It makes her unrelatable and unbelievable.


Finn and the inter-racial relationship doesn't bother my either, except that it's insulting to blacks to have given Boyega (a terrific actor) a token part in the film--Finn's character is completely extraneous to the plot--instead of a valuable role who actually does something meaningful (like Poe). It's so transparent and insulting to the black community, I find it disgusting. As for the third box, it is yet to be checked, so I cannot comment on it specifically. But I hope when it happens--which is a fait accompli--Disney is not as insulting to the gay community as they have been to the black community.

The Wook


1. Of COURSE you would think so. No surprise there.

2. Technically we never saw Yoda learn, struggle, sacrifice... but we accepted instantly that he was very powerful and strong with the Force. Why was that? Because he was old? Not a female (as far as we know)?

3. Finn is not a token... and he did many important things in the story, including managing to complete Poe's mission for him (albeit with a side motive of wanting to run from the First Order's tyranny, and also wanting to protect the first person who ever looked at him in a way other than as a servant or minion) even Poe got that... it's why he called Finn a "good man".
 
Since some folks like to remind folks of the Community Guidelines regarding ad hominem attacks, hopefully they'll adhere to all the guidelines for the RPF - and not just pick and choose.

D. Hate Speech. While we believe everyone has a right to express their point of view, even if it is unpopular, we don’t permit hate speech (speech which attacks or demeans a group based on race or ethnic origin, religion, disability, gender, age, veteran status, and sexual preference).


E. Controversial Topics (Religion and Politics). Because they are so detrimental to the cohesion of any community, we do not allow the discussion of political/religious views, religious/political figures, or social issues that will inevitably draw members into a heated debate (e.g Evolution/Creationism or the politics behind gun control, abortion, etc). It is unrealistic to believe that a religious or political viewpoint won’t work its way into the Community in some fashion (e.g mentioning you will pray for a sick member). It is important to remember that the purpose of this policy is not to limit your ability to express your beliefs but to limit the division often caused by discussing/debating differing points of view regarding these subjects.

There have been many obvious sexist, misogynistic posts; now, we have had a few political posts that are clear violations. Keep that kinda stuff on the conspiracy-nutjob sites that they come from.

If you're going to hide behind the Community Guidelines, make sure you stick to them as well.
 
Last edited:
But now I seriously hope that the next part has Poe/Finn be a thing or Rey getting with that female X-wing pilot, 'cos that'll hopefully make the bigots' heads explode and then we can get some peace.


Rey getting with that female X-wing pilot,

tumblr_inline_nzb6a3hkJG1rp5ay0_500.gif
 
Last edited:
Since some folks like to remind folks of the Community Guidelines regarding ad hominem attacks, hopefully they'll adhere to all the guidelines for the RPF - and not just pick and choose.

D. Hate Speech. While we believe everyone has a right to express their point of view, even if it is unpopular, we don’t permit hate speech (speech which attacks or demeans a group based on race or ethnic origin, religion, disability, gender, age, veteran status, and sexual preference).


E. Controversial Topics (Religion and Politics). Because they are so detrimental to the cohesion of any community, we do not allow the discussion of political/religious views, religious/political figures, or social issues that will inevitably draw members into a heated debate (e.g Evolution/Creationism or the politics behind gun control, abortion, etc). It is unrealistic to believe that a religious or political viewpoint won’t work its way into the Community in some fashion (e.g mentioning you will pray for a sick member). It is important to remember that the purpose of this policy is not to limit your ability to express your beliefs but to limit the division often caused by discussing/debating differing points of view regarding these subjects.

There have been many obvious sexist, misogynistic posts; now, we have had a few political posts that a clear violations. Keep that kinda stuff on the conspiracy-nutjob sites that they come from.

If you're going to hide behind the Community Guidelines, make sure you stick to them as well.

The thing is, I never said I was opposed to the liberal agenda. I merely pointed out my displeasure with the filmmakers for so transparently checking off boxes, at the expense of creating believable characters and non-token characters. Rey was not believable, and Finn was a contrived token--both written that way for the sole purpose of checking off boxes on the agenda.

You guys are hilarious!

The Wook
 
The thing is, I never said I was opposed to the liberal agenda. I merely pointed out my displeasure with the filmmakers for so transparently checking off boxes, at the expense of creating believable characters and non-token characters. Rey was not believable, and Finn was a contrived token--both written that way for the sole purpose of checking off boxes on the agenda.

Did we actually watch the same movie?

Explain how Rey was not believable and how Finn was a token character.
 
Finn's character is completely extraneous to the plot--instead of a valuable role who actually does something meaningful (like Poe).

Finn defecting is huge - being ABLE to defect after being indoctrinated is MEGA huge - it sets him levels of autonomy above the clones who turned on the Jedi after being given a single order. The fact that he wanted to run away at first makes him relateable, and the fact that he wanted to go after Rey when everyone else in her life is ready to abandon her makes him pretty important to the plot, if you think Rey is important. If you want to say anyone could have wanted to go after her and help, fine, but it's because Finn defected that he was able to lead Han in and they were able to blow up the planet death star thingy bopper.

Who Finn is brings the meaning and what he is able to do that nobody else could do makes him important to the plot. Do you know anyone who feels insulted? Just curious where you got that or if you're just projecting how you would feel.

As for Rey - she was a bit over powered and I could have used some more growth time, but I did like what little they did give us - her learning from Kylo to use the mind reaching thing he did and then when they are fighting she has a moment when she remembers 'The Force!' and tries to tap into it. THAT was super cool to see she is becoming aware of her connection. I'm hoping they explain more of where she gets her abilities in the next movies - like maybe she was exposed to some teachings when she was younger or maybe she's got Anakin level midiclorians... we'll see if they bother to explain it. She did fight pretty well with her pole and I've heard people describe her light saber tactics as being in line with how she used her fighting pole... so she had some skill she was able to apply... and Kylo Ren was pretty wounded when trying to fight her...

But let's compare her to Anakin, who was much younger. He was talented mechanically and an ace pilot at a very, very young age. They never showed us how he learned - we just see he is the only human who can fly a pod racer. Did he get in and it came naturally, or did he have to be taught? We don't know, but I think we can assume Watto wouldn't put a valuable slave in a pod racer and risk his life - just like Anakin was building his own pod racer behind Watto's back, he probably had to sneak into his first pod racer. If he crashed it the first time, that would have been it - so the chances are he picked it up very quickly. What we do see is him hiding in a Nubian fighter and then in the midst of a battle he takes off the auto pilot and figures out how to blow up the command station and get out alive.

In the Jedi Temple we see him being able to identify items on a screen that he can't see when he was presumably never taught to do that... he just can naturally. We also never saw Anakin's first use of a lightsaber. We see Obi-wan take him as his padawan and then the movie ends and next movie is years later. Maybe he picked it up as fast as Rey did? We just don't know. And again, he was years younger.

Bottom line - I think Finn's contribution is way cooler, more meaningful and deeper than Poe - who was just a rebel pilot who we are told is the best... And I'm holding out for Rey to have more explanation on her powers in the future movies... but I don't think she was anything more than Anakin might have been if he had been found at her age living her life.
 
The thing is, I never said I was opposed to the liberal agenda. I merely pointed out my displeasure with the filmmakers for so transparently checking off boxes, at the expense of creating believable characters and non-token characters. Rey was not believable, and Finn was a contrived token--both written that way for the sole purpose of checking off boxes on the agenda.

You guys are hilarious!
Doesn't matter. The Community Guidelines are clear - just as they are for ad hominem attacks.

The last part also fits under the trolling definition - ya know... the real trolling definition, not the one you made up to fit your agenda.

What I find sad and tragic, is that you really seem to believe this stuff - but, you're entitled to your opinion. Just doesn't follow the guidelines of this forum - which you love to use to your advantage.
 
...except that it's insulting to blacks .... It's so transparent and insulting to the black community, I find it disgusting.
The Wook

Look, I'm going out on a limb and assuming you're not black. If I'm right then I really don't think you get to decide what is, or isn't, insulting. Neither do I, but what I've read suggests that the vast majority see the inclusion of Finn (and Poe and Rey) as positive in, what has been a largely white (and cis, hetero, male) universe.
 
Look, I'm going out on a limb and assuming you're not black. If I'm right then I really don't think you get to decide what is, or isn't, insulting. Neither do I, but what I've read suggests that the vast majority see the inclusion of Finn (and Poe and Rey) as positive in, what has been a largely white (and cis, hetero, male) universe.
He says he once dated a black woman - so it's pretty clear that he has a clean grasp what is insulting to black people.
 
This thread is more than 5 years old.

Your message may be considered spam for the following reasons:

  1. This thread hasn't been active in some time. A new post in this thread might not contribute constructively to this discussion after so long.
If you wish to reply despite these issues, check the box below before replying.
Be aware that malicious compliance may result in more severe penalties.
Back
Top