Sean
Sr Member
Been so wrapped up In life stuff forgot about this.. that looks amazing. still a declared print noob. but that fascinates me just being a printed object. was that cleaned up In any way? think It looks great!
Logan's Run ---- Life Clock
- Thread starter Jintosh
- Start date
Been so wrapped up In life stuff forgot about this.. that looks amazing. still a declared print noob. but that fascinates me just being a printed object. was that cleaned up In any way? think It looks great!
Steadicam Op
New Member
You guys have WAAAAYYYYYY overthunk this. I had one of the original Lifeclocks, courtesy of a friend who appeared in the film, and I was in an Industrial Plastics program at school at the time, where we discussed the challenges of making a bunch of them for the film.
The movie props were polyester resin low-pressure castings. That is, they were resin dropped into a single-sided mold and allowed to set. Once hard, they were taken from the molds, which were reused.
The sample from which all of the replicas I've seen was one of many cast in a short time frame. The resin was mixed in big batches, then poured with syringes, eyedroppers, or something similar. The later in the pour that any particular casting was poured, the thicker it had become (from the chemical reaction), and thus the greater the surface tension on the low-pressure side (that is, the open-air side) of the pour. The sample was obviously late enough in the pour to give a nice, rounded bulge in the mold, and if they used more hardener (to speed things up), that would account for the more pronounced convex face than was on the one that I had. I also remember seeing some of the originals which had backs flat enough that the costumers had used crocus cloth to wear the edges down for the comfort of the extras.
The "imperfections" in the face of the crystal were partly from a buildup of the casting release agent in the mold, possibly from both the master from which the molds were made, and/or from the mold in which the sample was made.
BTW, in the book, the "Flowers" were microscopic crystals embedded in the hand, which were so flat that tattoo artists attempted to modify or duplicate them. Author George Clayton Johnson said that the inspiration was the microscopic glass beads from which Scotchlite chalk is made. For the film, the original idea of doing the extras' lifeclocks as ink-ons was discarded due to the way that dyes would run once people's hands got sweaty -- the poly resin just needed to be stuck on with spirit gum, which was easily maintained by the make-up department.
The movie props were polyester resin low-pressure castings. That is, they were resin dropped into a single-sided mold and allowed to set. Once hard, they were taken from the molds, which were reused.
The sample from which all of the replicas I've seen was one of many cast in a short time frame. The resin was mixed in big batches, then poured with syringes, eyedroppers, or something similar. The later in the pour that any particular casting was poured, the thicker it had become (from the chemical reaction), and thus the greater the surface tension on the low-pressure side (that is, the open-air side) of the pour. The sample was obviously late enough in the pour to give a nice, rounded bulge in the mold, and if they used more hardener (to speed things up), that would account for the more pronounced convex face than was on the one that I had. I also remember seeing some of the originals which had backs flat enough that the costumers had used crocus cloth to wear the edges down for the comfort of the extras.
The "imperfections" in the face of the crystal were partly from a buildup of the casting release agent in the mold, possibly from both the master from which the molds were made, and/or from the mold in which the sample was made.
BTW, in the book, the "Flowers" were microscopic crystals embedded in the hand, which were so flat that tattoo artists attempted to modify or duplicate them. Author George Clayton Johnson said that the inspiration was the microscopic glass beads from which Scotchlite chalk is made. For the film, the original idea of doing the extras' lifeclocks as ink-ons was discarded due to the way that dyes would run once people's hands got sweaty -- the poly resin just needed to be stuck on with spirit gum, which was easily maintained by the make-up department.
19narvik40
Sr Member
Steadycam Op,
Many thanks for the insight. I had long thought the method you mentioned was how it was done but I never considered using a large batch and pouring semicured resin. It makes sense once you explained it and helps to explain the differences in the versions I have seen. I also thought that because of the way a perrsons hand is shaped, especially in the palm, that you'd need a rounded surface so you could effectively glue it to your hand.
Best regards,
Don
Steadicam Op
New Member
That was a happy coincidence. As I said, I've seen some that were so flat that the edges had to be smoothed so they wouldn't be sharp enough to irritate or even injure the actors. These would obviously be early pours in the batch.
I've always thought that putting Scotchlite behind them would be better than foil -- any light (such as a flash or a fill light) would reflect back, as least a little, from whatever direction it came.
Two things to keep in mind:
1) to a producer, Job One is to keep it CHEAP
2) few productions have anything resembling accuracy, if that interferes with Job One. They really don't care, unless it's something that will get comments.
The nice thing about science fiction is that, often, there is no template to compare, say, the DS Gun. They don't even explain it -- but it's obviously an energy beam projector of some kind (the flames are of variable timespan), so you can retcon the flame to be caused by hyperheating of the air at the business end of where the beam comes out. The slotted front end would therefore prevent the possibility of an explosion caused by firing it while in contact with flesh (such as in a struggle with a Runner).
Contrast that to the Rambo-style movies, where a hand grenade explosion is a sheet of flame 20 feet across. In SF, accepting this is part of the "willing suspension of disbelief" -- in Rambo, everyone who has ever seen a grenade detonate laughs.
Getting back to the Lifeclock, they weren't worried about inconsistencies between them, because only 3 or 4 were ever shown close enough to matter. Thus, there is no "perfect" master from which to pattern a replica -- make what looks good, and Identify to your heart's content.
I've always thought that putting Scotchlite behind them would be better than foil -- any light (such as a flash or a fill light) would reflect back, as least a little, from whatever direction it came.
Two things to keep in mind:
1) to a producer, Job One is to keep it CHEAP
2) few productions have anything resembling accuracy, if that interferes with Job One. They really don't care, unless it's something that will get comments.
The nice thing about science fiction is that, often, there is no template to compare, say, the DS Gun. They don't even explain it -- but it's obviously an energy beam projector of some kind (the flames are of variable timespan), so you can retcon the flame to be caused by hyperheating of the air at the business end of where the beam comes out. The slotted front end would therefore prevent the possibility of an explosion caused by firing it while in contact with flesh (such as in a struggle with a Runner).
Contrast that to the Rambo-style movies, where a hand grenade explosion is a sheet of flame 20 feet across. In SF, accepting this is part of the "willing suspension of disbelief" -- in Rambo, everyone who has ever seen a grenade detonate laughs.
Getting back to the Lifeclock, they weren't worried about inconsistencies between them, because only 3 or 4 were ever shown close enough to matter. Thus, there is no "perfect" master from which to pattern a replica -- make what looks good, and Identify to your heart's content.
calico1997
Active Member
I just recently purchased some actual Logan's Run Life Clocks from an actress who appeared in a non speaking motion picture role on screen with Michael York and Jenny Agutter. I was able to verify this person is legitimate. There are not too many good photos of these close up, so I'm posting them along with the actual dimensions in mm. See photos. A few observations:
- they are quite small and light weight, but strong
- they have retained their color very well over about 40 years.
- the thickness of these is very inconsistent. Probably these were produced very quickly and without a huge concern about consistency.
- some are warped (concave) more than others. I think this is an unintentional effect of the unusual shape, thin structure, and quick production
- the silver disks on the back are extremely effective in making these "glow"
- they are hard to photograph because of the unusual pattern and transparency
- the green looks really nice, much brighter than other photos I've seen and that makes me question if those photos are originals. These here are absolutely legit.
So here's the pictures!
- they are quite small and light weight, but strong
- they have retained their color very well over about 40 years.
- the thickness of these is very inconsistent. Probably these were produced very quickly and without a huge concern about consistency.
- some are warped (concave) more than others. I think this is an unintentional effect of the unusual shape, thin structure, and quick production
- the silver disks on the back are extremely effective in making these "glow"
- they are hard to photograph because of the unusual pattern and transparency
- the green looks really nice, much brighter than other photos I've seen and that makes me question if those photos are originals. These here are absolutely legit.
So here's the pictures!
Attachments
-
Photo Mar 08, 8 51 42 AM.jpg -
Photo Mar 08, 8 51 51 AM.jpg -
Photo Mar 08, 8 52 46 AM.jpg -
Photo Mar 08, 8 52 59 AM.jpg -
Photo Mar 08, 8 53 08 AM.jpg -
Photo Mar 08, 8 53 17 AM.jpg -
Photo Mar 08, 8 53 23 AM.jpg -
Photo Mar 08, 8 53 26 AM.jpg -
Photo Mar 08, 8 53 45 AM.jpg -
Photo Mar 08, 8 54 34 AM.jpg -
Photo Mar 08, 8 55 40 AM.jpg -
Photo Mar 08, 8 56 07 AM.jpg -
Photo Mar 08, 8 57 09 AM.jpg -
Photo Mar 08, 8 57 29 AM.jpg -
Photo Mar 08, 8 57 41 AM.jpg
calico1997
Active Member
If you folks need any other details, please let me know.
You've been great ! I had made mine more of a curved bottom. But these crystals are way more flat. I'll still do my own thing and make a version that I like, but these really help flesh it out. And the pictures showing the 3 true (ish) colors are excellent. Better pictures of the color than anything I had previously.
calico1997
Active Member
The actress who sold me the yellow, green, and red had one more to sell me - another red. I went ahead and bought it so I could remove the silver backing foil and rig it up in a display frame with a flashing light. In case you wondered what the silver backing is like, it is a fragile metalized mylar and delaminated off very quickly once I tried to get a blade under it. I took a very telling picture of the red life clock from the back side against a window so you can see through it from the back. This really shows the structure better than from the front.
Attachments
calico1997
Active Member
calico1997
Active Member
On a somewhat related topic, I've always been fascinated with the gigantic red carousel life clock that everyone floats over and gets "zapped" at the start of the movie. What a scene! I wanted to generate a desktop version of it. Using a generic lotus flower image on Thingiverse, I 3D printed one using clear red PLA plastic. Scaled it to a diameter of 6-7 inches and flattened the thickness to look more like the film prop. Interestingly, the film prop was apparently made from some sort of textured fabric that looks remarkably similar to the typical 3D printing lines we usually get. So in this case the 3D printing process actually helps the piece look the way it should. I then put it on a remote controlled LED lighting plate (battery operated) and put that on a rotating base - both from Amazon. Cue the creepy music... don't know why I made this thing.
Attachments
calico1997
Active Member
As I have the yellow, green, and reds, the one missing piece is the clear. I promised the actress I bought these from that I'm not going to start making reproductions. But for my own collection, I went ahead and tried my hand (pun?) at mold making. Using Oomoo 30 silicone from Amazon I made a mold of one of my reds. Turned out really well aside from the anxiety of having to wait for the stuff to fully cure up.
Next I used Art N Glow clear epoxy casing resin from Amazon. Again, easy enough - just a long wait for it to cure up. I was careful not to get any air bubbles in there. This made a really nice, clear, sharp colorless life clock copy.
Finally, I got a roll of "chrome" 3M tape from the craft store and a 5/8" circle punch for a few dollars. This made the exactly right silver backing. It is just tricky to punch the sticky tape, so I had to first apply the tape to release paper before punching it cleanly.
The final result is a pretty darn close to screen accurate clear life clock. It has that shiny silvery look - so either I'm an infant or I left the dome and found sanctuary : )
Now I've got the full set. Going to wire an LED to one of the original reds to make it blink. I've seen others make black life clocks and I know it was referenced in the movie, but I don't think black ones were actually made for the film.
Next I used Art N Glow clear epoxy casing resin from Amazon. Again, easy enough - just a long wait for it to cure up. I was careful not to get any air bubbles in there. This made a really nice, clear, sharp colorless life clock copy.
Finally, I got a roll of "chrome" 3M tape from the craft store and a 5/8" circle punch for a few dollars. This made the exactly right silver backing. It is just tricky to punch the sticky tape, so I had to first apply the tape to release paper before punching it cleanly.
The final result is a pretty darn close to screen accurate clear life clock. It has that shiny silvery look - so either I'm an infant or I left the dome and found sanctuary : )
Now I've got the full set. Going to wire an LED to one of the original reds to make it blink. I've seen others make black life clocks and I know it was referenced in the movie, but I don't think black ones were actually made for the film.
Attachments
Last edited by a moderator:
