Throwing My Retractable Helmet in...**UPDATED 10-20 Map Projector finished-ish

I figure I will post a bit of my progress and see if there's any interest. I've lurked around here for quite some time and rarely contributed much so I guess it's about time. Sorry to all the folks that aren't interested in Guardians stuff though. You must be having a terrible time on the boards lately.

I saw the movie with my girlfriend the Saturday of opening weekend around noon. We're both pretty hardcore about costuming, at least around halloween, and we thought we had our costumes decided upon. As soon as we left the theater my girlfriend suggested we skip our dinner plans and go home and start obsessing about the movie and scheming up some Quill and Gamora costumes. I don't know if I thought it was a novel idea or not but I never really thought the Star Lord costumes would take off like they have. It's awesome watching all these builds and following all the analysis. So I thought maybe I should throw in my contribution.

That afternoon I came home and started on a helmet. I was very surprised to see all the stuff already out there, and I gotta thank Davy and Helegak for the hard work making it a bit easier to get a Star Lord going. I was seeing some things a little differently than any of the existing helmets, so I thought I'd go about making one myself.

I don't have much in the way of 3D skills in the virtual realm. My process is more like keep screwing it up in the real world until I run out of ways to do it wrong. Wanting results immediately I tried to "whip up" Helegak's pep model. It would be my first pepakura experience. Weeks later I would read advice not to start with a helmet. Oops. I am not a patient man, and I wound up with a twisted piece of card stock and super glue, and got about half way through the pieces.

Here's me pulling a cool guy with what I wound up with.



Yeah.

I got about half way through and starting seeing some planes a little differently from the model, and for some reason I thought it'd be a good idea to wrap the thing in papier mache using some rags in a box and get started reshaping. Next step was to just glass the whole mess, spray in some expanding foam, slap a bunch of bondo on and start carving. That's a little more natural to my way of thinking, but it's still taken me WEEKS to get to the point where I even have anything to show. My clay and sculpting stuff is still in storage (or else lost to those little wormholes that seem to pop up when I don't look at something often enough) so bondo was my only hope.

Anyway, enough words, more pics. I'll spare us all the rest of the embarrassing photos of spiky piles of bondo and show you where I am now.

Here is the helmet sort of mocked up with the parts I'm working on.



I had to leave the sweet foam Star Lord 'do in there to keep it looking rad all the time. Even looking at these pics I'm drawing all over it with little changes to make. The chin will be less prominent and tucked underneath more, and the eyes are just placeholders I mocked up. Just built the ear cups and mounted them today.

I'm really hoping to be able to mold it up next week, so I have a bit of work ahead of me. But it's getting there and actually kind of almost sort of looks a little like the images I've been fixated on lately.

Besides the helmet I've got a few other things that have kept me from being otherwise productive. Hidden in my messy space here is a couple of them (there are more, believe me).

Of course, I had to start working on some things for my girlfriend's costume.


The detachable knife warped a bit somewhere in the glass/bondo stages, so that will be cut at the......hilt...thing and repositioned to keep the two handles snug. It'll be cast in resin, but I'm not sure if I should cast the small blade or use an MDF one. Ideas? She's not going to need the longer one as the sheath is for this version, but I'll probably make it for her next anyway, just in case.

Then there's this guy. The map projector. For some reason I've wanted this since the first time I saw the movie. Of all the props, this one stood out to me, even more than the orb. Not sure why. This has probably gone through the most iterations. I started on it after seeing it once. Restarted after seeing the movie again. Then restarted after Marvel released the prop pic. Then when that turned out ugly I restarted again. I'm pretty happy with this one though.



Looking forward to walking into the party with this guy flashing blue all over the place. Aaaargh, why am I telling you all?!? Now someone's gonna beat me to it. Oh well too late now. I'll try to cast this up hollow so I can throw some electronics in there. It'll be a bitch to slush cast though. Also included is my slow, ugly progress on the boosters. I only want to have to sculpt one of these things and cast up the rest. Probably have the redo the spoked section.

And as for the jacket. I'm not super happy with the one that's widely available, although everyone is making it look pretty good. Never thought I'd think there was TOO much leather on a leather jacket. In the meantime Im taking a thrifted jacket I've had for years and painting it red with vinyl paint. Then probably washes etc etc. It's the one above, back before I had painted much. It's a little Rocketeer-meets-Michael Jackson but it'll do and I don't mind destroying it. In the meantime it looks like maybe something Quill would have had before he became the mildly more successful space brigand we met on Morag.

Okay that's a whole lot of words. I'll leave it there. I have other things in various states of ugliness that I can expound on later. I hope this was worth the time reading, let alone writing. Back to the bondo dust cloud with me!

Re: Throwing My Retractable Helmet into the Ring: another GotG

Well I figure I'm a bit overdue for an update. I'm sot sure if anyone has the patience to follow another GotG thread, but I've been eagerly and rather quietly following all of them here. Here's some of the progress I've made on my pieces in the last few weeks.

Here is my progress so far. The shape and feel of the movie helmet is really important to me to capture. There were a number of details I was obsessed with. Those included getting the crown height and arch correct, getting the rather broad, flat face and muzzle shape, and getting the eyes right. I notice people tend to enlarge the eyes a bit--it happens in drawing quite a bit too--and it isn't helped by the CGI version of the helmet changing proportions a bit though out the movie. Of course these are phone pics, so they're a little distorted anyway.


Attached all the various pieces of the helmet and continued shaping and filling some transitions.


Ground out my old fluting area and resculpted with a combination of styrene and apoxie sculpt. Also shaped the neck ridge. Then sanded, sanded, filled, sanded and filled. Then sanded.


Then I routed out the cheek channels. The tubes are sculpted separately and will probably be installed after casting.

I'm pretty happy with the progress so far. It's taken much, much longer than I anticipated but each stage makes it more and more worth it. I'm hoping to mold it up soon. Each step has basically been one that could destroy the whole sculpt, and each has offered some exciting challenges. I've learned a ton so far and I'm still learning.

MAP PROJECTOR

I've made a little bit of progress on this in the past few weeks. Not as much as I'd like but slowly and surely.



I noticed that the device as seen on screen is not the same as the prop shown in released images. The opening Morag scene shows the device with five extra features: four small round black buttons in a square with a large square black shape in the middle of them. These matched my small sketches, but each time when referencing the photos back at home, I though I just misconstrued the large feature at the top of the prop and the four small allen screws. I'm really not sure where to go from here with the prop, whether I should try to add those features and reconcile with the available space on the prop or just make it accurate to the physical prop. There is the possibility that the prop is upside down in the photo, and these buttons are on the broader reverse side. BLAH I don't know. It would be nice to have some buttons though when it comes to rigging up electronics.


Then there's been a pinch of progress on the Gamora dagger. A bit of shaping and just starting to sculpt the handle. Sorry, I'm now realizing how crap this pic is. Doesn't really show any detail and a bad angle, but there will be more to share later anyway.

More to come!

Re: Throwing My Retractable Helmet into the Ring *UPDATED Map Projector Questions

That helmet really came a long way. Could you document the moldmaking process you're going to go through on it? I just bought a few gallons of Rebound 25 for a couple of projects, and it's a brush-on silicone, which is the way I've had this whole process explained to me, but being able to actually see someone go through the steps is quite helpful.

Re: Throwing My Retractable Helmet into the Ring *UPDATED Map Projector Questions

Haha thanks. We've been through a lot and I can't even put it on yet. I've got a ton of pics that I didn't post between the two above because there are a lot of ugly stages and backwards stages and just not smart stages. I hate to post a process that's as backwards and windy as the one I've been on because I'm not sure if it would help or hurt to read it. But I'll definitely be taking pics, and provided it turns out I'll even post them!

Re: Throwing My Retractable Helmet into the Ring *UPDATED Map Projector Questions

Just a quick update. Lots to write about when I get some free time.

Re: Throwing My Retractable Helmet into the Ring *UPDATED Map Projector Questions

Excellent job on everything so far! :thumbsup

Re: Throwing My Retractable Helmet into the Ring *UPDATED Map Projector Questions

I’ve got quite a bit of process to write about as I’ve learned quite a bit in the few weeks. I’ll try to make this as un-verbose as possible. It’s been quite an experience, very long and at times very trying, and although it could be incredibly disheartening at times, the successes have been even more inspiring. I am truly loving prop building so far!

Here is the prototype ready for molding. I decided to add the cheek tubes to the sculpt as they would probably be too difficult to cast without pressure.


I decided to use Mold Max 30, since I was making a number of other prop molds and had it on hand. First detail coat went on great. Very thin and no noticeable bubbles.



I think I did two thin coats, no additive. Then I added a couple coats thickened with thivex. First filling in some undercuts, then smoothing with a bondo spreader. Finally I poured a thin coat to smooth out the surface to help the mother mold seat well. At this stage I figure if my helmet doesn’t work out I have the beginnings of a nice pink Sakaaran costume.



I laid up a fiberglass mother mold, then drilled some holes and added bolts and wing nuts.



Then it was Time to Demold.

The mold max peeled off beautifully. Nothing really tore off the sculpt, save for maybe a little loose clay. It was a bit of a stretch to remove since I didn’t cut a seam. Next: Time to Cast.

I powdered the mold with a bit of baby powder, then slush cast some onyx fast. The first pull came out with a dent in the temple where a key wasn’t seated in the mother mold properly. The next came out looking nice but with a little dent in back above the neck and a slightly bent left respirator tube. I realized that the rubber mold wasn’t seating in the mother well around the opening. For the next cast, I would press the loose portions into the mother mold with my hands as the resin kicked. That worked well on the respirator and reduced the denting in the back, but it was still there. None of the casts had more than a few bubbles.

Man this was tough. I was just ready to be pulling some buckets and this set back was very disheartening. After inspecting the mold, I believe what happened was that, because I didn’t use a cut seam, the mold was overstretched at the opening and wasn’t able to spring back to shape, so the areas of highest tension, the left respirator and the back, were deformed. Mold max 30 has about a 200% stretch, and I’m sure I exceed that for a moment as I pulled off the glove mold.

In the meantime, I thought I’d check out the fit of one of the pulls. I have about a 24” noggin, and I was a little worried about it fitting well, or the placement of the eyes. After all, my papier mache base was not exactly well measured.



And it fits! It’s a bit snug, and won’t have a ton of room for padding, but should be roomy enough to get some lenses and electronics in with some thin padding. Also, field of vision is great! With some transparent lenses it should offer great visibility! Looking good.



Oh, except for that. One of the pulls was a little thin, and a good bit of the back cracked when I pulled it out of the mold. So I thought I’d test out the Onyx, which I’d heard could be brittle. I dropped it from about waste high, and the thin parts shattered pretty readily, but anything that was sufficiently thick (and strengthened with fillite) was fine.

Here’s a few old starts at the cheek greeblies. The finished version is being molded.



So instead of wasting resin trying to make the old mold work, I decided I was back at square two. Time to get some better rubber!



Next up: Squares two, three and four. But just give me an hour or two to write them up!

Re: Throwing My Retractable Helmet into the Ring *UPDATED Map Projector Questions

Definitely one of the best Star Lord buckets out there! Well done.

Re: Throwing My Retractable Helmet into the Ring *UPDATED Map Projector Questions

Do mind if I ask how exactly you made the map projector?

Re: Throwing My Retractable Helmet into the Ring *UPDATED Map Projector Questions

Okay, continuing on! (Sorry, just got back from a little GotG break at the local 2nd run theater.)

After a bunch of research on the boards here and elsewhere around the web, I decided to make another mold out of either Rebound 25 or Dragonskin. I went to a local shop and she suggested dragonskin, hands down, for the glove mold. So following Cereal Killl3r’s excellent example, I came home with a number of trials of the DS and some pigment.

I cleaned up and fixed my mold to get it ready for molding again, being very careful to remove any bits of the tin cure that were still clinging in the nooks and crannies.

Following a bit of knowledge grazed from Thorsolli’s blog, I started with a thickened layer underneath in the undercuts and at the base. Then I poured a layer of straight DS, no additives. I had asked the lady at the distributor about a thinner, and she said I wouldn’t need it; that the DS was the same consistency as the mold max. Well, it wasn’t. And when smooth-on suggests you de-gas, it is with GOOD reason. While you can tap and vibrate the MM to get most of the bubbles out, this has very little effect on the DS. My sculpt looked like it was sitting in a bucket of Sprite or something. Tiny bubbles all over the surface. All over. Again with the freaking out.



So I spent a panicked 15 minutes weighing my options, and I thought it best to go get an RTV thinner, another can of dragon skin, and once again start over.

I tried out the other distributor in town, and they were actually very helpful. The first seemed to be a little annoyed by my multiple visits to drop wads of cash on them, and unfortunately I found their advice to be a little…incomplete if not even misleading at times. But the other was great and was very willing to talk about the problems I had encountered.

So with more DS and some thinner in hand it was time to get started again. I threw on a thickened layer below the chin, then poured a thinned layer over the top, a la Cereal Killl3r.



It worked absolutely great. No bubbles anywhere. The chip brush I was using shed quite a bit, and I picked most of them out (but as I’d find out later, I’d missed a couple). Then a straight up layer, a couple of thivexed layers and a straight up layer to smooth it all out. Now, as I said before, the DS traps air, and a lot of it.



It’s definitely important to mix it without introducing too much air, as with it’s quick kick time it doesn’t easily release it without a vacuum, and that’s definitely the biggest drawback to this rubber. in fact, next time I think I’ll either go with Rebound, or build a vacuum chamber. But in the upper layers, there was plenty of trapped air, and the thickened silicone was incredibly prone to catching bubbles. When air did manage to work it’s way out, it seemed to do so as a large bubble, so coming back to the set rubber it would have large pocks in it that would need filling in the subsequent layers.

I built a fiberglass mother mold, and drilled holes to bolt the shell together.



Once it was all set up, I took it apart and cleaned out the rubber mold. The surface was pretty smooth, without any bubbles to speak of. However, the Dragonskin didn’t quite set up well where it contacted the clay, which is strange since I was using Chavant NSP, parts of which were even sealed. It remained tacky and a little rough. This isn’t much of a problem as these areas were not part of the helmet anyway, just support structures.

I ran a slush cast and it came out great. There were no pimples, and strangely the only bubbles were where resin had dripped from one side to the other while rotating. Seems that the powder dusting doesn't work quite as well with the platinum cure than the tin. But avoidable. Note to self.



There was some soft dimpling where bubbles were trapped under a key on the mold, but that’ll be easily fixable with some sanding and maybe a bit of putty. The tacky silicone didn’t affect the resin at all, aside from maybe being a bit rough. But some sanding and a cut off wheel will fix that easily enough.

As I went, I definitely noticed the dragonskin was much more prone to allowing tiny bubbles to hit the resin, but it wasn't too difficult to avoid most of them with careful rotocasting. This is about as bad as it gets.



Anyway, at this point the greeblies are under rubber, and I’m testing out some paint colors on one of the cast offs.

Forgive me a quick photoshop on a VERY roughly painted test subject until I get the wiring done.



Time to get some more slushing practice with the rest of the resin I’ve got!

Re: Throwing My Retractable Helmet into the Ring **UPDATED 10-1 Casting the Helmet

Thanks for the details on the process - hoping it'll be useful when I get around to mine. I went to the Smooth-On headquarters where they suggested Rebound 25 for the helmet molding, so I have a gallon of that handy along with the Thyvex.

How did you build the dividers for the fiberglass? Is it just the same Chavant clay in a line down the middle? I've seen people use cardboard and tinfoil as well, but I feel like that'd be unreliable... but having never done this process before, I'm not sure.

Re: Throwing My Retractable Helmet into the Ring **UPDATED 10-1 Casting the Helmet

Hopefully. I tried to be pretty exhaustive but it was hard to remember to take pics at some points when I was watching timers. The rebound 25 is definitely the way to go. Haven't used it but if it releases bubbles as easily as the Mold Max but has elasticity more in the vein of the Dragonskin, then it sounds perfect to me. I'm sure that's why everyone here uses it. Just takes me a bit longer to learn sometimes.

The dividers were just card stock pieces taped together, with tin foil tightly folded around it. You can even see some of it through the fiberglass. The first time I was a little looser with it. But after I had some denting out of the first mold, I figured the problem was either deformation or else maybe the mold wasn't seating correctly underneath the mohawk. Like if maybe there was a small amount of space where the two halves meet the rubber. So on the second mold I tried to eliminate any space and keep my angle from shell to flange very sharp. I had tried to hot glue the cardstock but of course it wouldn't stick. If I'd had softer clay instead of the NSP medium I think that would've been the way to go. Next time.

Re: Throwing My Retractable Helmet into the Ring **UPDATED 10-1 Casting the Helmet

As for the map projector, I just built it from scratch. I used a little of everything, I guess. Card stock, card board, styrene, a ton of bondo, apoxie sculpt. Probably some other things. So far I've made about 3 or 4 versions, and I think the current one is working. Thanks for reminding me, I've got to get some progress posted on that too! Still not sure what to do about the discrepancies between the prop and the onscreen version.

Re: Throwing My Retractable Helmet into the Ring **UPDATED 10-1 Casting the Helmet

You getting rid of any of the "practice" versions?

MDuckett said:

As for the map projector, I just built it from scratch. I used a little of everything, I guess. Card stock, card board, styrene, a ton of bondo, apoxie sculpt. Probably some other things. So far I've made about 3 or 4 versions, and I think the current one is working. Thanks for reminding me, I've got to get some progress posted on that too! Still not sure what to do about the discrepancies between the prop and the onscreen version.

Click to expand...

Re: Throwing My Retractable Helmet into the Ring **UPDATED 10-1 Casting the Helmet

The other projectors are in pretty rough shape and not taken very far. If I can get this one wrapped up soon, and if I can figure out how the heck I'd mold/cast it, I could do a small run if there was interest. Plenty of projects that all need wrapping up, but I imagine that's the common symptom on these boards.

starlordquill said:

You getting rid of any of the "practice" versions?

Click to expand...

Re: Throwing My Retractable Helmet into the Ring **UPDATED 10-1 Casting the Helmet

Wow, subscribing here! Love how this is coming along, and thank you for the detailed explanation of your molding experiences. I've got a gallon kit of Rebound 25 waiting for me to finish my Groot mask sculpt. It doesn't have the same elasticity as DragonSkin, (that's kind of the selling point of DragonSkin) but I've heard great things.

Re: Throwing My Retractable Helmet into the Ring **UPDATED 10-1 Casting the Helmet

Quick update. Trying to not go to bed because I blew my shoulder out in a scratch game of hurling and waking up HURTS. In fact just being awake hurts. But I can't sleep. Bad, bad timing for getting my Quill together during this crunch time. I haven't made much progress on my accessories.

But the helmet is coming together. Had a few free minutes today since I was laid up, and I couldn't help but use them to spray on a couple quick coats. Man, cart before the horse and all, there is a lot of clean up I should be doing before this, but I couldn't help myself. Super quick and before any black washes etc. Tiny bit of weathering though, heh. Also stuck some lenses in there for S's and G's.



Got the greeblies out of the rubber finally. They actually worked. I'm pretty excited. Now all that's left is getting my chrome paint on and then it's soldering time!

Re: Throwing My Retractable Helmet into the Ring **UPDATED 10-1 Casting the Helmet

Got some time to put into the helmet today. I really need to get some good photos instead of these cell phone pics, but I thought I'd throw these up in the meantime. I've gotten most of the painting done and a good amount of the weathering. Still a bit more to do—I really want to look like I just bounced around Morag. I cut the helmet into two halves, in a similar fashion to how I believe the prop opened up, and I haven't yet installed magnets, so please excuse the painter tape.

Overall I'm pretty happy with the paint. I thought the grey was looking too dark, but it seems to be pretty shiny, and actually kinda looks like the CG helmet. In the movie, any time his helmet is CG (i.e., about to be retracted, etc.) it seems to get really really shiny. And the gold color sits pretty nicely between the yellow and golds that the prop shifts between in various pics. The grey is a tamiya model paint, their gunmetal. It's a really nice looking metallic for a rattle can. I wasn't really convinced with it at first. I think it's a bit too warm of a grey. The prop seems a little cooler. There are some Honda touch up cans that I thought about using, but went with this cause it was handy. The gold is rustoleum satin metallic aged brass, and the chrome is mirrorchrome. I'm really happy with that last one, as I haven't even buffed it yet and it's pretty dang shiny.



I have no willpower, otherwise I would be responsible and still be sanding, smoothing, and cleaning up my cuts. But after a few months of working on this I didn't have the patience. It feels GREAT to see it so close, and to FINALLY be able to put it on my head.

Now if I can just stop procrastinating on the electronics.

Re: Throwing My Retractable Helmet into the Ring **UPDATED 10-11 Helmet Painted!

Here's a quick pic of recent progress on my map projector. I've added some weathering in and worked on the butt plate butt plate, but here's a representation. There's no weathering in this pic. Just shaping and primer showing through. I'll try to get a newer pic up soon.

Re: Throwing My Retractable Helmet into the Ring **UPDATED 10-11 Helmet Painted!

Current helmet progress. Pretty close to finished with the painting and assembling of the helmet. I have to trim down the ear pipes a tad to keep them more snug to the body of the helmet, and I haven't installed all of my magnets yet so the seam isn't sitting tight in the pics, but it is getting close! I've been wearing this a little too much lately.