Suicide Squad (Post-release)
- Thread starter Vivek
- Start date
Snikt
Sr Member
Oh man I didnt see that. If someone could find some proof and post it, that would be rad.
http://movieweb.com/suicide-squad-movie-harley-quinn-killed-robin/
Dude, good eye. Nice catch!
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It said she was an accomplice to the murder of Robin indeed. Confirming Joker killed Robin, while she helped. And putting that god awful rumor to bed : the Joker is not a twisted Jason Todd.
Something that hit me last night though : did I miss something or was the Squad's original mission not to go deal with the Enchtress mess, but just secure and extract Waller from her building ? Or was that just the first part of the mission, before they had to go be canon fodder downtown ? Kinda seemed like their mission was over when Waller embarked her chopper, at least up until it blew up....
Something that hit me last night though : did I miss something or was the Squad's original mission not to go deal with the Enchtress mess, but just secure and extract Waller from her building ? Or was that just the first part of the mission, before they had to go be canon fodder downtown ? Kinda seemed like their mission was over when Waller embarked her chopper, at least up until it blew up....
Snikt
Sr Member
Yeah, that seem convoluted to me. Their first mission was to stop enchantress maybe, then call an audible and save waller cause she was in the middle of it? And what was enchantresses brothers name? Brother? Man. That movie was pretty bad. "Im doing this for my friends". Groan.
Monkey67
Sr Member
The squad had no real mission at 1st other then sitting around in jail. Once flag failed his mission because enchantress went rogue and started helping brother out. Those two were to stop "brother" or what ever the government thought the attacker was. When the city started going down and she was trapped. That's when the squad was called in and tested. Better they try to fight and possible lose than batman and friends.
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"film is a dictatorship (laughs), not a democracy, and just because something’s cool and charismatic doesn’t mean it gets to survive in the final cut. The flow of the movie is the highest master."
That quote definitely fits in with the tone and direction the DC movies have taken, doesn't it? Cool and Charismatic moments? Screw that! We've got multiple drawn out shots of a mopey Superman symbolically looking like ***** to attend to!
I agree when they were heading to the city the mission was a terrorist was attacking and they were to deal with it. Then all of a sudden they were securing the building and then they are at Waller's location.
The point could have been it was a switch BUT it seems at some point the team knew they were securing someone but not Waller. Confusing!
The point could have been it was a switch BUT it seems at some point the team knew they were securing someone but not Waller. Confusing!
SmilingOtter
Master Member
Just saw it, enjoyed it. The villain(s) could have been more interesting, but I certainly got my money's worth of fun out of it. Will read the thread tomorrow...
Argonaut
Well-Known Member
Finally saw it today and I loved it. I had a lot of fun, and had quite a few big laughs. I won't say it's great, and I'm definitely not dismissing any negative reviews about it but that rotten tomatoes score is ridiculous. 27 freaking percent? Come on. There is no way this is worse than BvS. It seems like everyones on the hate train and not giving this film a chance. IMO, this is the best DCEU film thus far (which isn't saying much, but still)
On another note, is anybody else bothered by how the film handled Joker and Harley's relationship? It seemed like they were genuinely in love with each other, instead of this being a ****ed up, abusive relationship. I remember a set video where Harley points a gun at Joker and he hits her. Didn't make it into the final cut apparently, but that seems much more in character. Also, when Joker's helicopter is shot down? And he pushes Harley out to save her? Apparently that scene was meant to play so that Joker and Harley got into an argument and Joker shoved her out out of anger. And AFTER that the copter got shot down. I wish the film had explored that a little better.
Overall though, despite some choppy editing, too little screentime for Mr. J, and a lack of development for characters to form a cohesive team/friendship, I still highly enjoyed the film. Very watchable. :thumbsup
On another note, is anybody else bothered by how the film handled Joker and Harley's relationship? It seemed like they were genuinely in love with each other, instead of this being a ****ed up, abusive relationship. I remember a set video where Harley points a gun at Joker and he hits her. Didn't make it into the final cut apparently, but that seems much more in character. Also, when Joker's helicopter is shot down? And he pushes Harley out to save her? Apparently that scene was meant to play so that Joker and Harley got into an argument and Joker shoved her out out of anger. And AFTER that the copter got shot down. I wish the film had explored that a little better.
Overall though, despite some choppy editing, too little screentime for Mr. J, and a lack of development for characters to form a cohesive team/friendship, I still highly enjoyed the film. Very watchable. :thumbsup
The first mission was to rescue Waller but it wasn't made obvious to the team, basically because it would be highly doubtful they would have gone for it, seeing as it was Waller that pushed them together with threats. She planned to use them to basically cover up the fact she'd screwed up first with the Enchantress (which was why she shot the remaining people in the command centre with her, a rather 'evil' and self serving thing to do).
At that point nobody else on the Squad ( apart from Flagg) knows that the Enchantress is respouncible for all the chaos , at least until Deadshot finds the 'Top Secret' file in Wallers bag after the helicopter crash ( I love it when they have 'TOP SECRET HIGHLY CLASSIFIED' emblazed upon the folder when a simple plain cover would be slightly more appropriate, but it certainly makes it easier to find though)
Waller ( your classic boss high achieving psychopath) would then use the team to cover up her murdering all her assistants and her complete and cataclysmic failure with the Enchantress. She just would not take the blame for any of it and was willing to burn everyone else to the ground to save herself and her career.
Thats ultimtely why the team then decide to tackle the Enchantress based on the fact Waller was in many ,many ways worse than them for what she had done and for once they could look like 'heroes' and not the bad guys. But shes in government soo.....not a bad guy then. I liked the way this morality was played with but it seemed to confuse a fair few of people.
Personally I was VERY disappointed that they did not use the Joker as the behind the scenes manipulator of the Enchantress chaos in order to get Harley free, ie setting up Waller to take the fall, trapping her, obtaining the heart off her so that at the very end that he was the ultimate 'hero'. Then escaping with Harley would have made more sense, rather than the ending we finally got. That was always the beauty of Nolans Joker, his apparent madness was anything but, he was a brilliantly manipulative master planner of chaos, by forcing people to make choices . Thats what I was expecting anyway and was a little annoyed that instead we had this rather crude madman.
PS
Apparently the 'Original Score' to the movie will be released later after the sound track album
PPS
Also ALOT of the Joker/Harley scenes were cut because of some EXTREMELY negative responses. You can guess why and from where. I know, I know, that's how its is in their comics history but these are modern times and whilst its alright to be an empowered, deranged and sexily dressed killer, its not OK that they are the victim of domestic abuse.
PPPS Interesting article here on Hollywood here https://www.theguardian.com/film/20...sters-directors-star-wars-dc#comment-80595652
At that point nobody else on the Squad ( apart from Flagg) knows that the Enchantress is respouncible for all the chaos , at least until Deadshot finds the 'Top Secret' file in Wallers bag after the helicopter crash ( I love it when they have 'TOP SECRET HIGHLY CLASSIFIED' emblazed upon the folder when a simple plain cover would be slightly more appropriate, but it certainly makes it easier to find though)
Waller ( your classic boss high achieving psychopath) would then use the team to cover up her murdering all her assistants and her complete and cataclysmic failure with the Enchantress. She just would not take the blame for any of it and was willing to burn everyone else to the ground to save herself and her career.
Thats ultimtely why the team then decide to tackle the Enchantress based on the fact Waller was in many ,many ways worse than them for what she had done and for once they could look like 'heroes' and not the bad guys. But shes in government soo.....not a bad guy then. I liked the way this morality was played with but it seemed to confuse a fair few of people.
Personally I was VERY disappointed that they did not use the Joker as the behind the scenes manipulator of the Enchantress chaos in order to get Harley free, ie setting up Waller to take the fall, trapping her, obtaining the heart off her so that at the very end that he was the ultimate 'hero'. Then escaping with Harley would have made more sense, rather than the ending we finally got. That was always the beauty of Nolans Joker, his apparent madness was anything but, he was a brilliantly manipulative master planner of chaos, by forcing people to make choices . Thats what I was expecting anyway and was a little annoyed that instead we had this rather crude madman.
PS
Apparently the 'Original Score' to the movie will be released later after the sound track album
PPS
Also ALOT of the Joker/Harley scenes were cut because of some EXTREMELY negative responses. You can guess why and from where. I know, I know, that's how its is in their comics history but these are modern times and whilst its alright to be an empowered, deranged and sexily dressed killer, its not OK that they are the victim of domestic abuse.
PPPS Interesting article here on Hollywood here https://www.theguardian.com/film/20...sters-directors-star-wars-dc#comment-80595652
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Rotwang
Sr Member
I think the low ratings may in part be attributed to the fact that this movie showed great promise and didn't have Snyder directly involved. Like BvS people were looking forward to this as DC/WB's Avengers, where we finally get the big payoff movie with a ton of cool moments. I'm at a loss to give you even one good example.
What we get is a very exposition-heavy movie. You quickly get a sense you are watching different versions people tried to mesh together.
I can't think of a single bad thing to say about Will Smith in this film except that it's all too obvious they really filed off a bunch of sharp edges and tacked on the humanizing daughter. It's clear that SS was on the same level as previous movies with scenes like Waller dealing with her own failures.
Rick Flagg isn't a character, he's a plot device. Ditto for Enchantress and her brother.
And what was the purpose of Cpt Boomerang again ? The stuffed animal bit seemed like a completely misguided attempt to steal from Deadpool. He's supposed to be the nasty guy nobody wants on the team but aside from a few bits here and bits there, they do nothing with it. And his Boomerangs ? He uses one as a drone, throws another two or three, that's about it. You'd imagine they would put in some kind of contest between him and deadshot to see who was the coolest, but this kind of payoff never happens.
Killer Croc, same problem, his big moment is supposedly the underwater action, but it's so trimmed to the bone, there is nothing left. The only memorable moment is him making a comment.
El Diablo at least gets a back-story and is perhaps the only team member that has a semblance of depth, but his big moment is never explained, it's a complete Deus Ex Machina. A few seconds worth of extra exposition could have foreshadowed something big happening. Now it feels completely arbitrary.
And then there is the premise of the film that never quite meshes into a coherent whole. Aside from Enchantress and possibly El Diablo, what was the use of the team that a bunch of highly-trained special forces couldn't accomplish without having to worry about breaches of security and external elements like the Joker getting involved ? Perhaps it might have worked better if they had used more creative leverage (revenge, greed, emotional blackmail) than a straightforward death threat. For example Smith could have been swayed by implying his daughter was sick or in a bad situation with a promise to help her.
What we get is a very exposition-heavy movie. You quickly get a sense you are watching different versions people tried to mesh together.
I can't think of a single bad thing to say about Will Smith in this film except that it's all too obvious they really filed off a bunch of sharp edges and tacked on the humanizing daughter. It's clear that SS was on the same level as previous movies with scenes like Waller dealing with her own failures.
Rick Flagg isn't a character, he's a plot device. Ditto for Enchantress and her brother.
And what was the purpose of Cpt Boomerang again ? The stuffed animal bit seemed like a completely misguided attempt to steal from Deadpool. He's supposed to be the nasty guy nobody wants on the team but aside from a few bits here and bits there, they do nothing with it. And his Boomerangs ? He uses one as a drone, throws another two or three, that's about it. You'd imagine they would put in some kind of contest between him and deadshot to see who was the coolest, but this kind of payoff never happens.
Killer Croc, same problem, his big moment is supposedly the underwater action, but it's so trimmed to the bone, there is nothing left. The only memorable moment is him making a comment.
El Diablo at least gets a back-story and is perhaps the only team member that has a semblance of depth, but his big moment is never explained, it's a complete Deus Ex Machina. A few seconds worth of extra exposition could have foreshadowed something big happening. Now it feels completely arbitrary.
And then there is the premise of the film that never quite meshes into a coherent whole. Aside from Enchantress and possibly El Diablo, what was the use of the team that a bunch of highly-trained special forces couldn't accomplish without having to worry about breaches of security and external elements like the Joker getting involved ? Perhaps it might have worked better if they had used more creative leverage (revenge, greed, emotional blackmail) than a straightforward death threat. For example Smith could have been swayed by implying his daughter was sick or in a bad situation with a promise to help her.
Maybe you're not familiar with the concept of the suicide squad from the comics, but the bomb in head bit is a core part of it. They couldn't use another form of leverage, otherwise it's just not the suicide squad. For the rest I can't really disagree, other than the heavy expositions didn't really bother me, especially how it was done here. Not just a bunch of dialogues, but title cards and quick flashbacks (with some iconic scenes c.f. Alex Ross's Joker and Harley famous drawing in live action).
Monkey67
Sr Member
They really should have given a better back story on enchantress and her new brother ( incubus?). Who trapped them,why and how. Who were they other than demon spirits from long ago.
Doesnt deadshot know that if you're rich and walking with a kid. Never never walk down an alley for no dumb reason in Gotham. Really now, where you going wearing your little pimp hat? Always walk down the street. This time batman took someone's father way..
Doesnt deadshot know that if you're rich and walking with a kid. Never never walk down an alley for no dumb reason in Gotham. Really now, where you going wearing your little pimp hat? Always walk down the street. This time batman took someone's father way..
Wasn't as bad as critics were making it out to be. It was corny and messy, but I still enjoyed it. I did not, however, like the main villain. That was just stupid, it was like watching The Mummy or something. But overall, I liked it. Will Smith was actually pretty good in it.
Rusty85
Sr Member
I read some of the scenes that were cut out of the movies and that was one of them. If I'm remembering correctly it's after the helicopter crashes and he confronts the Suicide Squad down in the tunnels.
Mola Rob
Sr Member
The movie is not great but it's doing great at the box office which makes me happy. I think trashing DC movies is the current annoying online trend, Suicide Squad is downright dull at times and the ending is painful but does anyone remember the first couple X-Men movies? Not exactly the most exciting things.
Snikt
Sr Member
No offense to you Mola Rob, but this bothers me. Any idea why they are trashing the DC movies? Its because they arent good. Its not just "an online trend" and the problem with people THINKING that it is, makes the studio think its ok to release movies like this. There wouldnt be a Suicide Squad or half of all these superhero movies if Xmen didnt pave the way in 2000. Yeah, does X1 hold up today? Not so much. X2? Its my favorite one in the franchise. And Im not here to defend Xmen in particular, but DC looks to make cool moments and not a cool movie. The tone of this crap was ALL wrong. I cant believe nobody mentioned this yet. @Rotwang had an almost perfect review/summary of things that were wrong, but nobody had mentioned the tone. The same reason why MoS and BvS were pretty awful. I just dont get how people can "love" this film, when fundamentally it has SO many problems. Its like they want to like it because its a DC property, and I wanted to like it too, because the trailer made it look fun, and the animated movie was great, but man. Its really bad. And what the studio thinks is that they are doing something right because its going to have a big opening, so they will have the same shoddy filmmaking pushing them along. It sucks. I wouldnt have even seen it if I knew Zack Snyder had a hand in it. Im sure as hell not spending money on JL.
And the idea that this group of clowns would even stand a remote chance against Superman, or anyone of the JL members (with the exception of maybe Bats) is a joke. Harley Quinn uses a damn bat for most of the movie. How the hell would she pull her weight in a real super powered fight? :facepalm
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