Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Pre-release)

Re: Star Wars Episode VII

I was just phrasing it in a funny way; I didn't mean for it to be taken literally or offend. I just can't see what's wrong with wanting to continue to appreciate the work as it was first presented - particularly if you enjoyed that version in a way that you don't appreciate the redux. Unfortunately, the films were just on the cusp of the time where they'd have been inherently preserved. As it is, it's very hard to find a proper copy of the originals to watch. There's no reason to label everyone who wishes they could see them a generation of whiners. They're consumers, letting the owners of that material that they are a waiting market. More importantly, they're nostaligic fans trying to enjoy something they love.
 
Re: Star Wars Episode VII

Davy Jones said:
These versions are so bad they barely count. Have you ever seen them? It's worse than watching a 20 year old VHS.
It was a big F-YOU! to the people who wanted something close to the quality they might see in a theater.
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I covered that. It wasn't an "F-YOU" at all, he gave them exactly what they wanted... but, it still wasn't good enough.

"We want the original Star Wars - just as it was in theaters!!"
"Here it is."
"NO, we don't want that! We want you fix it so that it's modern - anamorphic, color corrected, etc. Spend your money to fix it so it's what we really want."


George can have final say on his art all he likes. But that doesn't make it well loved and accepted by default.
A sensible artist should understand their audience.
Like Steven Spielberg. He made a bunch of changes to E.T but packaged that version right along with the original.
Later he asked his admirers if they minded if the new version didn't get released on Bluray since the reception had been bad. Now you can get the original E.T on Blu ray and life is good. And if you preferred the new one, there is a great quality dvd release which is the only way you would have ever seen it.
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Um, ET got a extended/director's cut, just like many movies do without much fanfare (they also changed some thing's like altering guns). Speilberg himself demanded that both versions be available when the DVD came out.

Different artists, different thoughts about the matter. Obviously, Spielberg has a lot more going on than Lucas, whereas Lucas pretty much has Star Wars (and they share Indy).
 
Re: Star Wars Episode VII

For the record, I don't like Greedo shooting at all. I think Jabba in ANH look shoddy and doesn't work - adding Boba Fett makes him more a Jabba's bitch than a ruthless bounty hunter (but, I'm not the Fett fan that so many people seem to be). I hate the ring in the Death Star explosion and that would be the first thing I got rid of.

I would buy the original version of the film. But, like many... I would like to keep changes that I like (the CG X-Wing approach is beautiful) and how the heck do you NOT fix all the lightsaber effects!?!?

But, they're not mine to change. I don't feel entitled to demand something that I really don't have a right to - if the opt to put it out, I'd buy it... but, I've bought and re-bought Star Wars on video more times than I care to count.

It's not that I don't sympathize, it's that I don't understand the incessant whining about it... I don't get the give/take about what's good enough and what's not. I don't get that folks can't understand Lucas' want to make his perfect film, not yours.


I'm not sure this is proper thread for this discussion. Bring on Episode VII.
 
Re: Star Wars Episode VII

The thing about the argument that Star War is Lucas' to tinker and play with as he pleases is that no other artist (that I'm aware of) has gone back and tinkered and messed with their creation the way that Lucas has Star Wars. I've never heard of any of the Masters (DaVinci, Rembrandt, et. al) having been known to go back and revisit their old works and make adjustments to them because they've improved their techniques, paint technology has improved so they can achieve colors and effects that they were never able to before, or because after several years they realize that there were certain things that they weren't happy with on their masterpieces. The same goes for film, no other director has gone back and tinkered with their films the way Lucas has over the years, sure we get director's cuts but those tend to be adding in scenes that were cut for time or because they were forced to by the studio, and even then we don't get director's cut, after director's cut released and the original cut hidden away.

I'm no expert on the matter of film restoration and re-mastering but I can't imagine that there isn't a remastered version of the original theatrical cut of Star Wars lying around in the vaults somewhere, despite what Lucas might claim. Why? Because when they did all of the SEs you can't tell me that they matched all of the new CG work to the original master and then remastered it afterwards. To me, the logical sequence of events would be to remaster the film first, brighten it up, dust bust it, fix the colors etc. so that you have a nice, bright, clean master to work with, then you match your new effects to that and then you print it (so to speak). So unless things are done completely backward from the way that I think they are or they just tossed the untouched remastered master there should be a remastered theatrical master somewhere in existence.
 
Re: Star Wars Episode VII

I covered that. It wasn't an "F-YOU" at all, he gave them exactly what they wanted... but, it still wasn't good enough.

"We want the original Star Wars - just as it was in theaters!!"
"Here it is."
Click to expand...

For some reason all these people who "got what they wanted" have complained since the first day of its release that it isn't what they wanted.

You make it sound like the public got the DVD release and then complained that they didn't want the ILM model work looking quite that primitive. That is not what happened.


"NO, we don't want that! We want you fix it so that it's modern - anamorphic, color corrected, etc. Spend your money to fix it so it's what we really want."
Click to expand...

I think that should read: "Spend your money to fix it and we will pay you enough to make it profitable." This is ANH we're talking about. Even GL doesn't sit there and try to argue that he might lose money on it.
 
Re: Star Wars Episode VII

batguy said:
For some reason all these people who "got what they wanted" have complained since the first day of its release that it isn't what they wanted.

You make it sound like the public got the DVD release and then complained that they didn't want the ILM model work looking quite that primitive. That is not what happened.
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Not what I said or made it sound like. Folks got a bare bones release that involved little to no investment from LFL/Fox.

I think that should read: "Spend your money to fix it and we will pay you enough to make it profitable." This is ANH we're talking about. Even GL doesn't sit there and try to argue that he might lose money on it.[/QUOTE]
Nope, I said it right the first time. There's no proof that investing the money to "fix" ANH (or Star Wars - since ANH wasn't part of the original release) will turn a profit (or even enough of a profit) to warrant doing so. It also opens new debate - which do they keep in print? etc, etc.
 
Re: Star Wars Episode VII

Old masters had a tendency to change their paintings...now with X-rays, you can see that some of the characters/backgrounds,etc were changed.
 
Re: Star Wars Episode VII

About three hundred and forty odd pages back I swore this was about Star Wars VII. Not a "George Lucas ruined my childhood by daring to change his films" thread. I cannot tell you how worthless these endlessly old and dull arguments seem in view of the brand new series of films about to be born. A new age is coming for Star Wars fans. Hope where none existed at all. A golden land of opportunity and adventure. What the hell some people will do here once the trailer comes out doesn't bare thinking about.
 
Re: Star Wars Episode VII

It just gives us something to talk about in between new rumors and the occasional set pic. It's no more boring than 20 pages of "Wouldn't it be cool if (blank) was in the new movie?!"
 
Re: Star Wars Episode VII

CutThumb said:
About three hundred and forty odd pages back I swore this was about Star Wars VII. Not a "George Lucas ruined my childhood by daring to change his films" thread. I cannot tell you how worthless these endlessly old and dull arguments seem in view of the brand new series of films about to be born. A new age is coming for Star Wars fans. Hope where none existed at all. A golden land of opportunity and adventure. What the hell some people will do here once the trailer comes out doesn't bare thinking about.
Click to expand...

I'd have to look around to make sure I was at the rpf if these sorts of "derailments" didn't take place...
 
Re: Star Wars Episode VII

JD said:
...I would like to keep changes that I like (the CG X-Wing approach is beautiful)...
Click to expand...

It looks like a cartoon. The best motion control model work that could be done in 1977 was replaced with the worst CGI that could be done in 1997. And it was not done as a technical improvement, it was an editorial decision to make one long sweeping shot. There are several "less than perfect" effects shots that were left unchanged. Why? Because they were just fine editorially.
 
Re: Star Wars Episode VII

All the changes wrought upon the OT at Lucas direction may or may not have been part of his original stated plans, but what is true without question is that he was VERY dissatisfied with the finished product of ANH. I have said it a 1000 times here in conversations that involve Lucas, the man is more a technocrat then a film maker. He loves to edit, he loves to develop new technology of film. He hates to write and direct. Trying to compare him to other artists or directors is absurd. The man doesn't really see himself in that way. He has said art is never finished, it's just abandoned. When the technology was developed sufficiently for him to go and rework his creation, he jumped at the chance, because they are his films and that is his right. He also has the right to not release the ANH form 1977 if he feels it is inadequate. Now what does Fox or eventually Disney do is another question.
 
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Re: Star Wars Episode VII

Paul Andrew said:
That gives my inner geek squirmy feelings. I want to believe it, but man... it's a tall order.
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Not really. I think a lot of you don't appreciate the financial resources Disney has at it's disposal to develop long term project and how much in their wheel house that is. LucasFilm and Marvel were TINY companies in relation to Disney. They had no financial means of leveraging their brand in a meaningful way. Disney is one of the largest media, theme park, film studio, television network companies in the world not including licensing. You really need to appreciate that before evaluating what they are capable of. I am a investment advisor who own the stock in all my client portfolios and can say without question Bob Iger and his management team are capable of almost anything when it comes to brand building.
 
Re: Star Wars Episode VII

alienscollection.com said:
Rumor: STAR WARS Sequels to “Redefine Longform Storytelling”; Will Integrate Cartoons, Books, Comics

http://collider.com/star-wars-sequels-expand-universe/
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I still don't get why people are extolling the virtues of this new EU. There was a lot of crap in the original EU, with a few gems in there. Now all the crap is canon as well. At least before the good authors (Zahn, Stackpole, Allston, Traviss, etc.) could write around the stuff the fans thought was stupid. Now they can't avoid the stupid.
 
Re: Star Wars Episode VII

Sluis Van Shipyards said:
I still don't get why people are extolling the virtues of this new EU. There was a lot of crap in the original EU, with a few gems in there. Now all the crap is canon as well. At least before the good authors (Zahn, Stackpole, Allston, Traviss, etc.) could write around the stuff the fans thought was stupid. Now they can't avoid the stupid.
Click to expand...


maybe there will be some kind of "quality control"? At least now I know that Threepio will finally be telling the story of how Phineas and Ferb helped the rebel alliance! :D
)
 
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