PropShop announces TFA Props!

Art Andrews said:

"Sculpted by" would be a bit of a stretch... Kevin did produce the first runs of TFA armor, but he didn't sculpt them.

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Before we confirmed it was actually him who produced the kits, we were highly suspicious due to it obviously looking like his work. As far as who sculpted it? I'm still leaning towards him having a direct hand in that, whether literally or figuratively, the kits were produced by him on order from Anovos. The "tells" of Kevin's work is evident looking at the raw unfinished kit...so him not having any input into the sculpts of the bucks themselves, I disagree. Would saying he utilized 3D printing be more accurate? Seems funny how he was also able to produce nearly identical re-scaled armor for his kids shortly after too, but seems pretty logical that's more likely the case.

The price point was around $1800 (approx. $2000 after taxes) for the unassembled kit and fiberglass helmet which is listed as being $600. The kit right now to for the public is $675.00 (without the intro price), which before taxes and shipping would be $1275...which means 501st members paid $525 more to "have it first"

I still believe it was more cost effective, while falling in line with the legal restrictions, that contracting the job elsewhere was better for a small run. Part of me wants to believe that offering 50 kits to the 501st was partially motivated by Anovos needing the money to produce the armor in the first place for promotional reasons asked by Disne/LFL, seeing the 501st as a tap for making it a reality, especially with Anovo's constant need of pre-orders to fund other product's production...

While, yes, a number of suits, more than just the 50 were made, I have a hard time believing that Anovos would invest so much money into producing the sculpts the same way they do, say like for the OT TK, just to re-work over a year later for actual mass production. That wouldn't make sense. Considering that Anovos was originally using fan-made armor for the base components of specific products (still visible as "prototypes" even), it doesn't seem entirely out of place with the original methodologies....but of course the company can't come out and acknowledge that .

Art Andrews said:

This is not true. ANOVOS had no involvement in making the original props for TFA.

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Again I prefaced everything I said as a rumor, I have no actual knowledge of anything, just rumors.


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the Pawn said:

Again I prefaced everything I said as a rumor, I have no actual knowledge of anything, just rumors.


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Not arguing with you or trying to give you a hard time. Just stating facts.

tubachris85x said:

Before we confirmed it was actually him who produced the kits, we were highly suspicious due to it obviously looking like his work. As far as who sculpted it? I'm still leaning towards him having a direct hand in that, whether literally or figuratively, the kits were produced by him on order from Anovos. The "tells" of Kevin's work is evident looking at the raw unfinished kit...so him not having any input into the sculpts of the bucks themselves, I disagree. Would saying he utilized 3D printing be more accurate? Seems funny how he was also able to produce nearly identical re-scaled armor for his kids shortly after too, but seems pretty logical that's more likely the case.

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There is no way this isn't going to sound arrogant, but the difference between our posts is the difference between deductive assumptions and knowing. Everything you have said is certainly logical and sounds good, but while it sounds good, it isn't the case.

tubachris85x said:

Part of me wants to believe that offering 50 kits to the 501st was partially motivated by Anovos needing the money to produce the armor in the first place for promotional reasons asked by Disne/LFL, seeing the 501st as a tap for making it a reality, especially with Anovo's constant need of pre-orders to fund other product's production...

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This is incorrect.

Art Andrews said:

Not arguing with you or trying to give you a hard time. Just stating facts.

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Oh, I know. Just pointing it out again. Thanks for the insight.


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Art Andrews said:

There is no way this isn't going to sound arrogant, but the difference between our posts is the difference between deductive assumptions and knowing. Everything you have said is certainly logical and sounds good, but while it sounds good, it isn't the case.



This is incorrect.

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Perhaps it can be considered "deductive assumptions," but these assumptions aren't exactly without merit given the history of how things have been going with Anovos, in it's entirety...it could only be dismissive to specificity but I'd be hard pressed to agree that it is entirely dismissive based on what we know.

I haven't used this analogy personally, but it's been more often or not called a "pyramid scheme," especially with the number of projects being constantly pushed back. A girl who was on the first order list of the Imperial Officers was so open and truly believed that she would have had it by now so she could join the 501st, but she finally became so fed up that she sewed one entirely herself and just got approved.

Sure, Got Maul is on the RPF time from time to explain or update things. Outside the RPF, I don't know where else he's actually visible. The lack of clear transparency on particular manners, more so, the honesty or at least the perceived lack of information on just how everyone's money is being utilized for the items these people paid for - like myself - is creating this cloud of animosity, with the general public being most affected, since they rely solely on facebook posts and emails from Anovos for the most part. The general public doesn't hear from him about the behind the scenes aspects, the delays, reasons, etc. that he posts about here. The general public are just seeing more and more new products being pushed, like this death trooper helmet, being advertised, while sitting on every other product for years.

Are all of these products that are being constantly pushed back going to remain in "development hell" like the majority of EFX's products we've seen prototypes of for several years at their con booths?

The saying "perception is reality" comes to mind. Dismissing my "deductive assumptions" is fine and all, you're right, I don't work for Anovos and basing my own thoughts on what I know and what I've been told by anovos insiders directly.

You'd have to agree though that it isn't a good thing for the company that my theories on this particular manner are more believable than someone getting their product on time.

tubachris85x said:

Perhaps it can be considered "deductive assumptions," but these assumptions aren't exactly without merit given the history of how things have been going with Anovos, in it's entirety...it could only be dismissive to specificity but I'd be hard pressed to agree that it is entirely dismissive based on what we know.

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Again, all of the assumptions you are making are perfectly reasonable, but that doesn't make them correct.

tubachris85x said:

The saying "perception is reality" comes to mind. Dismissing my "deductive assumptions" is fine and all, you're right, I don't work for Anovos and basing my own thoughts on what I know and what I've been told by anovos insiders directly.

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I am not dismissing your assumptions. I am telling you emphatically, the ones I pointed out above are wrong. Those aren't up to debate. Your logic is sound, but your conclusions are simply incorrect.

tubachris85x said:

You'd have to agree though that it isn't a good thing for the company that my theories on this particular manner are more believable than someone getting their product on time.

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We can certainly agree on that... but then, that is why I am posting, in the limited manner to which I am able to try to bring a bit of clarity to some of the incorrect assumptions that are being posted.

No offense, but please set the record straight for all.

It's kind of frustrating to go through all this only to get the answer of 'this is all incorrect, as I know what's correct, but i'm not telling you'.

Now, i realize as well that it is likely due to confidences but still, doesn't make it less frustrating.

Art Andrews said:

Again, all of the assumptions you are making are perfectly reasonable, but that doesn't make them correct.



I am not dismissing your assumptions. I am telling you emphatically, the ones I pointed out above are wrong. Those aren't up to debate. Your logic is sound, but your conclusions are simply incorrect.



We can certainly agree on that... but then, that is why I am posting, in the limited manner to which I am able to try to bring a bit of clarity to some of the incorrect assumptions that are being posted.

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And that's fine.

Wouldn't you say that a lot of these issues of assumptions could be emphatically reduced or even eradicated if the company were themselves more directly open about their production practices rather than diffusion and minor damage control?

I got it, you've got contractual and legal issues, perhaps propitiatory information that just can't be disclosed openly, but this isn't the first time we as the fan-base has had to deal with something like this. MR went under for their own internal issues, EFX IMO is squeaking along, but their image is forever tarnished. PropShop just went under almost immediately after coming into being. Anovo's image is mixed, but leaning on the negative.

People are pissed and it's not going to stop until something is done to rectify these primary issues. Being 100% upfront and honest from the get-go leaves absolutely no real reason for people to be upset when they drop their money. Instead of stating in the initial sales a specific ship date/quarter, have a development status bar and acknowledge an honest goal rather then something unrealistic.

There needs to be a stronger emphases when putting these contracts together in regard to saving your image in regards to disclosure of business practices in a beneficial manner. It's a constant running issue with high-end collectors that just seems to repeat itself.

I imagine that It's significantly easier (in a relative sense) for Disney/LFL to cut their losses, pull the license and move onto another company after having a licensee with a PR nightmare affecting the image of the franchise. Given how significant a license for star wars products are, I do not think that Anovos would be able to survive such a loss to their product lines. That's why MR went under-failure to renew their star wars license, losing their "bread and butter" of the company. But hey, we've got EFX! /s

tubachris85x said:

I got it, you've got contractual and legal issues, perhaps propitiatory information that just can't be disclosed openly, but this isn't the first time we as the fan-base has had to deal with something like this.

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That is correct. If I could say more, I absolutely would because I have no desire to keep anyone in the dark, but I am under NDA and take it seriously.

Art Andrews said:

That is correct. If I could say more, I absolutely would because I have no desire to keep anyone in the dark, but I am under NDA and take it seriously.

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Then it needs to be relayed to higher-ups that particular aspects of the NDA/contracts need to be re-evaluated. I believe saving your credibility and your image at the expense of a few facts regarding product development/use of funds that are restricted by NDA would be worth it in the long run, especially if you don't plan on making good on a lot of these promises that have been made. Unless something nefarious is going on behind the scenes, I don't see how one can perceive it as a negative to have open transparency in regards to why things are developing slower than usual, but other products are being shoved to the frontlines while leaving everything else on the back-burner.

Wow, some people really hate being told that they're wrong, when they're wrong.

Thanks for the insightful Anovos rant in the PropShop thread!
What would the RPF be without yet another one of those?

Back on topic, I'd love to know where that info about the Blade Runner 2 props came from! Care to enlighten us?

the Pawn said:

They were paid and failed to deliver three Spinner props although they delivered Two substandard 3D printed ones and the 3D printed props, the PDK Blaster, would break during filming to the point it stopped production completely.

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Jinyo said:

Wow, some people really hate being told that they're wrong, when they're wrong.

Thanks for the insightful Anovos rant in the PropShop thread!
What would the RPF be without yet another one of those?

Back on topic, I'd love to know where that info about the Blade Runner 2 props came from! Care to enlighten us?

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Sounds like someone takes things a bit too personal for not being a part of the conversation, wouldn't you say?

Don't mind me...I'm here for the Prop Shop news and updates.

David

tubachris85x said:

Sounds like someone takes things a bit too personal for not being a part of the conversation, wouldn't you say?

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Wrong again, but I look forward to reading your detailed explanation of how you arrived at your erroneous conclusion.
And if you want to have a private conversation, take it to PM. When you post on an open forum, we are all "part of the conversation," no matter how off-topic it is.

But back on topic, I've read that PropShop also worked on Ready Player One and (unsurprisingly) Star Wars: The First Order Strikes Back (or whatever episode 8 will be called ).
I wonder of those productions have been affected by PropShop's demise.

The only reference I've seen online to the quality of PropShop's work on Blade Runner have been references to this forum. "I read on the RPF that PropShop..." So I would like to know where this info originates.

Jinyo said:

Wow, some people really hate being told that they're wrong, when they're wrong.

Thanks for the insightful Anovos rant in the PropShop thread!
What would the RPF be without yet another one of those?

Back on topic, I'd love to know where that info about the Blade Runner 2 props came from! Care to enlighten us?

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Like I said it was only a rumor, but no I cannot say who I heard if from, because I believe him/her, and again I am just spreading "rumors" so I do not want to bring that person into this topic. But I found the "rumor" to be reliable for what ever that is worth to this topic. If someone knows something different, then I am sure they will correct the "rumor."

I did find it odd to see Prop Shop in the TFA 3D Blu Ray extra videos with the former President speaking on camera about their involvement and the 3D printing process.


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The Blade Runner stuff is well known by industry folk, but industry folk don't talk about it on the RPF. BR2 is in production now and everyone is NDA'd up to their necks by Alcon.

If you happen to know those folk, that relationship doesn't last very long if you go on a public forum and say 'X person works for Y studio and personally told me this'.

There are a lot of people who would like to know what happened at Prop Shop, but most of those who know more of the details aren't going to talk about it openly right now because that could adversely affect their careers. Which is why 'rumours' are likely to stay that way at least until after the dust settles.

Jinyo said:

Wrong again, but I look forward to reading your detailed explanation of how you arrived at your erroneous conclusion.
And if you want to have a private conversation, take it to PM. When you post on an open forum, we are all "part of the conversation," no matter how off-topic it is

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Wait a minute, you're gonna all of a sudden barge into this thread all huffy puffy because I had a civil debate with the owner of this very site and then demand to take it to PM when you couldn't do that in the first place yourself after the discussion ended?

You deny taking things personally while emphatically using sarcasm and condescension in your posts. Why is that? Why would you, someone who decides to come out of the blue, all of a sudden be so offended for a company that at least to me, you have zero part of.

Oh wait!

You apparently like to advertise for them, because I'm clearly so "wrong" about things /s

https://www.facebook.com/JinyoDesig...156388335389/1023651421052544/?type=3&theater


Get off your high horse

Ding ding ding!
We have a winner.

Birdie said:

The Blade Runner stuff is well known by industry folk, but industry folk don't talk about it on the RPF. BR2 is in production now and everyone is NDA'd up to their necks by Alcon.

If you happen to know those folk, that relationship doesn't last very long if you go on a public forum and say 'X person works for Y studio and personally told me this'.

There are a lot of people who would like to know what happened at Prop Shop, but most of those who know more of the details aren't going to talk about it openly right now because that could adversely affect their careers. Which is why 'rumours' are likely to stay that way at least until after the dust settles.

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To avoid being left out of such a stimulating and riveting series of non-admissions, winks, and nods, I'll simply add this:

I may or may not know things, that I may or may not have been told, that would CHANGE YOUR LIFE if you heard them...

....of course, I can't say a THING about ANY of it. Hope that's useful to you.

:lol