Weathering A Russrep STEEL Obi Wan Emitter

That looks great BD! Can I ask, what kind of facilities do you need to work with the acid and how does one obtain it? Do you mind sharing a rough procedure or is that a trade secret now that you're in business?

Nitric is really bad stuff. Don't play with it even if you can get it, if you don't know and aren't comfortable with safe procedures.

In case it's not obvious, I didn't mean you BD, since you do this regularly and are still alive I'm sure you've got it down.

Definately looks great BD. Once my steel one shows up I'll contact you.

One thing I was wondering before I started trying to weather mine...

Some of the screencaps I've seen give the impression that the inner ring (the one with the holes) is a couple shades darker than the outer ring. Is that just a trick of the shadows, or is the inner ring actually darker/more weathered?

[COLOR=black]On my original emitter you can certainly see the discoloration on the interior ring. As another note the surface is actually diamond blasted to create the etched appearance. Not sure of the function necessity for this but it certainly alters the appearance of the inconel.[/COLOR]

[COLOR=black]-Michael[/COLOR]

mspaw said:

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[COLOR=black]On my original emitter you can certainly see the discoloration on the interior ring. As another note the surface is actually diamond blasted to create the etched appearance. Not sure of the function necessity for this but it certainly alters the appearance of the inconel.[/COLOR]

[COLOR=black]-Michael[/COLOR]

Good to know, thanks!

MSpaw can you explain the basis of your conclusion re: diamond blasting? Is this a technology you know to have existed in the UK in the 1950s? I would be very pleased to know that this is the answer regarding the unusual finish seen on real balance pipes, but I'd like to know how they connect to these particular pieces. Is diamond blasting a technology in general use or is it only available in specialty aeronautical applications? Is it exclusively applied to exotic alloys or can it be applied to steel? Thanks!

Actually there are two unusual finishes seen on original balance pipes which I'd like to have the explanation for. One is seen on the balance pipe on the right in the photo below. It's a remarkably sparkly satin finish. The balance pipe on the left has the extreme velvety matte finish which is the other one I'd love an explanation for (and which is the one more relevant to the prop):



Patattack--I think the ring of holes is definitely darker, whether from natural causes or from whatever the prop department may have used to darken the whole saber. Not many original balance pipes show smoke damage, and to date I have not seen one of the correct model which shows a completely blackened ring of holes. This doesn't mean it didn't happen of course.

I think an aspect of that darkness is that the ring of holes has the matte finish sometimes seen on originals in that area. I think the face of the flange (the area around the ring of holes) is also clearly a matte texture, but grey, and this is a distinctive aspect of how the saber appears in the movie for me.

The matte texture on the same emitter can be seen also in this photo, it's the one on the left (on the right is a replica):

Cool effect, BD! Any idea if vinegar or muriatic acid would achieve the same effect? I certainly wouldn't want to drink muriatic acid, but since it's used for cleaning driveways or rust off of car sheet metal (I don't remember, it's been a long time since I used it), it seems like it might not be as dangerous as nictric acid.

Obi-Bob

[COLOR=black]I had taken my emitter in to a cnc machine shop here in northern cal to get a quote on reproducing it on modern machinery as well as having a solidworks cad model made from it. The first revelation was that the piece was made in two parts in inconel vs. one with a really difficult trepan grove which was the giveaway. The machinists there put it under a scope to look at it and had come to the conclusion that it was welded, and he mentioned vapor welding. I haven’t done much research into 50s manufacturing so that may have been just a guess on their part. same goes for the surface treatment. The gang there said it would have been diamond blasted, but my guess is any type of bead blasting would give a similar if not identical velvety finish. The test I’ve done on other steel parts certainly looked similar. The photo/surface on the right that you pointed out looks identical to mine. It etched for sure in just not positive of the means. Hope that helps clarify, I shouldn’t have come across so definitively. As for replicating the scorched/blacked character im up for suggestions. My original emitter is only blackened around the interior collar and not so much. As its inconel and designed for tremendous heat there is no oxidation of the typical steel variety. [/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][/COLOR]

[FONT=Times New Roman]-Michael[/FONT]

[COLOR=black]Oh, just some notes about inconel for the uninitiated or those that haven’t followed the long lead up to Russ and the gangs great work getting a version of this made. Inconel is super tough stuff. I’ve machined stainless any number of times and its literally butter compared to inconel. I talking to several shops to have reproductions made they all said basically no way. The material itself is expensive but acquirable. The real problem is It’s a lot harder to machine than Titanium. Fortunately, we don’t need to make aircraft parts, or I don’t at least… that being said I Wonder if Russ would be interested In a version in 303 stainless. It would cost more but it would not oxidize and look as close in color to the original, just food for thought. I may still do one or two this way.[/COLOR]
[FONT=Times New Roman][/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman]-Michael[/FONT]

What's up with the black text?

I had my steel Obee1 emitter (by RPF member "Obee1") sulfamate-nickel plated.
It is a type of chemical nickel plating that gives a satin finish. I think that it resembles the pictures I have seen of some (but not all) real balance pipes.
The plating protects the steel from rusting, but is relatively soft and can still be darkened by gun bluing liquids.

A common replica that I believe is sulfamate-nickel plated is United Cutlery's Glamdring sword (not "museum edition"). The pommel and handguard are almost the same finish, but maybe a little bit darker than my emitter .. but then, they are brass underneath.

clutch said:

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What's up with the black text?

Not everyone uses the dark themes. The same can be said for all of the people who use white text.

Back on topic, Boba Debt, once you've done your thing to the steel, will the steel still rust like normal? Can it be weathered any more with Perma Blue or similar?

mspaw said:

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[COLOR=black]The machinists there put it under a scope to look at it and had come to the conclusion that it was welded, and he mentioned vapor welding. [/COLOR][FONT=Times New Roman][/FONT]

It was "Flux Bath Brazed".

FB

Thanks Michael!

clutch said:

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What's up with the black text?

Probably copied from an email text body.
Interesting read!

Sorry about the text, yep wrote it up in word and copied it over.

As sor the oxidation Im anxious to try the wax protective finish post beadblasting and scorching and see how it looks. Ill post somepics here soon of my original and a test on some mild steel to see how the abrasion looks compaired to the inconel surface. Im wondering if as inconel is much harder if the blast will bite more on the mild steel. I know when Ive used it on alum it can eat into it very fast.

-Michael

I don't know if what I'm doing really follows with what you guys are doing, I'm not sure I'm gonna weather the heck out of mine or not, but I do like the dark ring of holes. I guess you all are really going for an accurate finish, but I just used perma blue on the inner part to darken it and I'm pretty pleased with the finish.

OB10 said:

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[FONT=Arial]Cool effect, BD! Any idea if vinegar or muriatic acid would achieve the same effect? [/FONT]

[FONT=Arial]I doubt viniger would produce results like this and I don't know what muriatic acid would do.[/FONT]

Sumatra said:

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[FONT=Arial]Back on topic, Boba Debt, once you've done your thing to the steel, will the steel still rust like normal? Can it be weathered any more with Perma Blue or similar?[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial]I haven't applied any type of protectent to my emitter and it doesn't have any additional rust on it yet, but it's only been a day. I'm sure it would continue to rust over time if you totally neglect it.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial]I don't know what effect chemical bluing agents will have on this finish and don't really want to test them on mine [/FONT]

[FONT=Arial]I think my process produces the most accurate looking finish to date[/FONT]

Sidewinder said:

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[FONT=Arial]BD, a 2-5% nitric (Nital) should etch this no problem (mixed with ethanol or methanol though not IPA)[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial]I gradually increased the acid content until I got a deep etch in a reasonable time. I could drop it down to 5% but then I would be brushing it on the surface for 10-15 minutes.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial]I have also found that the quicker you etch the surface the more uniform it will look[/FONT]