ANH Hero DL-44 Discussion - Three ANH Greeblies Found

The whole upper receiver slides back on the MGC. Can't remember how far back it slides and I only have an upper here so I can't try it - the lower half is away to get some work done on it.

RPGnerd said:

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Kurt, does the replicas upper receiver draw back, or do you mean the little T lever (like in a M4 rifle) pulls back? Some replicas don't have the same feature as the original guns.

In a real Mauser C96 you flip the safety to Fire and draw back the internal slide, but the upper receiver stays stationary (and will lock open if unloaded, otherwise it feeds a round). The hammer is now cocked and the safety may be put to safe now.

It will slide back slightly (under a quarter inch) and will do so when fired but remains for the most part stationary with the inner slide shooting back and over the hammer. The hammer does not self cock mechanically but gets slapped back from the slide ramming back cocking it.

The C96 is very odd, and it's to expensive to shoot ($2+ a bullet) but it looks so cool. My C96

RPGNerd, we're talking about for disassembly, not opening the chamber or shell loading.

RPGnerd said:

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Kurt, does the replicas upper receiver draw back, or do you mean the little T lever (like in a M4 rifle) pulls back? Some replicas don't have the same feature as the original guns.

In a real Mauser C96 you flip the safety to Fire and draw back the internal slide, but the upper receiver stays stationary (and will lock open if unloaded, otherwise it feeds a round). The hammer is now cocked and the safety may be put to safe now.

It will slide back slightly (under a quarter inch) and will do so when fired but remains for the most part stationary with the inner slide shooting back and over the hammer. The hammer does not self cock mechanically but gets slapped back from the slide ramming back cocking it.

The C96 is very odd, and it's to expensive to shoot ($2+ a bullet) but it looks so cool. My C96

Hi RPGnerd,

You have a real c96 you say?

Maybe we can get you to measure the bore axis and upper receiver for us?

If we knew the width and height exactly and where the bore hole is in relation we could tell if the diameter of the bull barrel-if the same as the width of the upper receiver, would allow the barrel to sit above the top edge or not.

Do you have a micrometer? And would you be willing to do this?

You would probably have to take it apart to get the center of the bore but maybe could get the top and bottom of the chamber from the top with the slide bolt back.

Could settle the issue for us!

cool video of mauser type action RPG is talking about

YouTube - ‪Mauser C96 - Broomhandle‬‏

kpax said:

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Hi RPGnerd,

You have a real c96 you say?

Maybe we can get you to measure the bore axis and upper receiver for us?

If we knew the width and height exactly and where the bore hole is in relation we could tell if the diameter of the bull barrel-if the same as the width of the upper receiver, would allow the barrel to sit above the top edge or not.

Do you have a micrometer? And would you be willing to do this?

You would probably have to take it apart to get the center of the bore but maybe could get the top and bottom of the chamber from the top with the slide bolt back.

Could settle the issue for us!

I'd be willing to do this but I'm not sure how. Would it be measured from the flat up, I don't have a micrometer available.

Hi,

That would be a great help.

Do you have a steel ruler? Even a nice plastic ruler would prob. do,

Are you able to disassemble the receiver?

If so I would take the Mauser apart safely, making sure it was empty of course and following all the safety protocols.

Get the upper receiver with the barrel and , using an EMPTY cartridge case slid partially, maybe half way in to the chamber and measure from the flat on the bottom of the upper receiver to the case.

Then simply measure the inside from top to bottom and then side to side.

If you cant disassemble, no prob. I will make a drawing to show you how to do it and where to measure.

Thanks for the offer to help!

kurtyboy said:

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The whole upper receiver slides back on the MGC. Can't remember how far back it slides and I only have an upper here so I can't try it - the lower half is away to get some work done on it.

No Marcus, it stays. It just has some mm "play".

It only slides back at dissasembling. The job usually done by a sliding back upper receiver is done with the sliding back "T-bar" in front of the hammer.

deadbolt said:

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I did some measuring on my MGC Mauser today, which has the barrel lopped off in just the right area.
Here's the results...for an MGC at least.

My MGC


The drawing isn't flawless, it was just a quick way to get the right idea.
The flat angle measurements, bore and proportions are accurate though.





Here's the Two different Barrel Size Possibilities. I'm liking the one on the Left the most. The barrel on the Original does seem a tad larger than the width of the Mauser's Upper.
Barrels shown in following pictures are Centered.


Definitely seems plausible, ehh?


-Carson

If the real Mauser measures the same, than it seems that the barrel may indeed be flat bottomed as Carson shows.

The only other proof we may want to see is how it looks on our props. I may try a centered sample barrel with flat bottom and take som pics at the same angles as the hero gun to see how it matches up.

Also just found out that Forgotten Cinema HAS a d DVD of naked Runner! I am waiting to verify its a DVD.

THE NAKED RUNNER Frank Sinatra

May be able to see something else but Carsons drawings are very convincing... as long as the bbl is in the same position on the real c96.


...closing in on the truth.

nice work carson

the answer lies in the grassy knoll

Carson, I took your drawings and superimposed it on the HERO CU. When lined up it looks like the flat spot would be as I show, a little lower than yours, not in the recess. What do you think?

recess area in super extreme CU

Wow, dang. Certainly looks as though there's a break in the reflection in that "grassy knoll" photo.

Good catch!

I´m still not convinced - it´s the combination that makes no sense.

I turned my MGC receiver/barrel down on the lathe, so it is centered around the barrels bore (if there would be one) - that´s the only way a lathe works if you don´t chuck a piece with a offset, hard to do with this piece if the barrel and the hole for the bolt at the end are a straight line.

Then i turned the barrel, and drilled/machined it a hole - again completly centered without offset.

Now we have a situation that on the top the chamfer looks not prominent enough, and we would need a flat milled bottom to disassemble it - cause a completly centered "line" puts the barrel to low, on top for the chamfer, and on the bottom for disassembling.

What can we do to get more chamfer? Making it a bigger dia - but that way we would also get more dia at the undersideof the barrel. That means even more to mill flat - the more flat the more easy noticeable. I mean "really noticeable", like a D-ring. AND the barrel would also stick more over the sides, it would be easy noticeable from every view than from the flat side - to get 1mm more chamfer on the top, the barrel has to has 2mm more dia. Instead the 22mm i used a 24mm, come on - 1mm sticking out on each side, 1mm more to mill on the underside?


Or, the second alternative, everything was kept at the 22mm - just mounted offset, cheated with a not centered/aligned bore, there was no need that real bullets can pass the barrel.
That way to lift the barrel up by 1mm would keep the sides of the receiver matching to the barrel, it would delete or at least minimize the amount of milling the bottom flat- AND it would enlarge the chamfer.

Would be a easy job (much more easy than what we do to replicate it) - just saw/mill the old barrel from the receiver at the wanted place, machine a new barrel the way you want it, weld/braze the parts together. Voila.

An interesting problem:


I think to make the blank prop work properly it would have needed to be set as a real barrel. Blanks are sensitive to pressure and may not have operated the auto loading if not done correctly...so

I think we need to get measurements from a real Mauser. The position of the bore is the key.

My drawing showed that a bore height of just a mm or two higher than the MCG would make the difference...I think

RPGnerd has offered to measure his gun. We need to show him what we need. I will try to work up a drawing to help him. He does not have a micrometer so we need to use other means.

Any other ideas?

I have a real Broomhandle Mauser (top), an MGC Mauser and a Micrometer so I'll be happy to help out as best I can.

kpax said:

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I think to make the blank prop work properly it would have needed to be set as a real barrel. Blanks are sensitive to pressure and may not have operated the auto loading if not done correctly...so

Not in every case - for some field training we got trainingsammunition/blanks with reduced power, as no slug needed to be pushed. To keep the effect of autoloading running, the reduced power had to be kept in the barrel for building up the needed pressure. Therefor we unscrewed the flashhider and put a blank-firing-adapter on. It has a really reduced outled to keep the pressure moving the bolt backwards instead of loosing the pressure through the barrel.

A 1mm offset would still provide more free flow than needed, probably another reduction would be needed, maybe invisible inside the barrel the bore was smaller, around 2-3mm.

dcarty said:

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I have a real Broomhandle Mauser (top), an MGC Mauser and a Micrometer so I'll be happy to help out as best I can.

Much appreciated.

dcarty said:

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I have a real Broomhandle Mauser (top), an MGC Mauser and a Micrometer so I'll be happy to help out as best I can.

That's great! Your Mauser would be an awesome source for more accurate measurements. Thanks!

If you can manage to figure up any or all of the measurements in this picture, that would be just great!


-Carson

Sorry do derail, but has anyone else noticed that the Naked Runner scope looks a lot like the Compac (GK) with the front bell still attached?

LOL--It would be another amazing coincidence if it were the same scope!

Here's what I have so far. Measurements off the C96:



Measurements off the MGC:



The MGC is amazingly close in some dimensions and very different in others. The differences could be chalked up to the specific pistol that MGC copied. I've owned two C96 Mausers and the parts were not universally interchangeable between them either.

the suspense is killing me!

The two
MGCs are very close