Alclad chrome - my first results, and some advice needed

Hey all,

I've partially chromed my Daft Punk helmet, and I think it's looking pretty good - I say partially chromed because I've stripped parts of it back to re-chrome as I wasn't 100% happy with the finish in a couple of spots. Here's how the finish was looking before I stripped any back to the black base coat:



I'm now thinking about long-term durability, and I've been experimenting with the Aqua Clear from Alclad on some test bits of plastic. It does dull the finish somewhat, but it's not as bad as I thought it would be.

But the gloss clearcoat does say that it's a suitable base layer for the chrome finish, which got me thinking. I'm waiting for the gloss coat to fully cure before I try anything else, but I was wondering - if I spray the clear over the chrome paint, then buff / micro mesh the clear coat to be as shiny as possible, and then apply another layer of the Alclad chrome paint over the top, what do you think the result would be?

What I would really like to happen is that the top chrome layer looks as good as it does in the photos above, but if any of it rubs off due to handling, it'll just rub off to the clearcoated layer and the slightly duller chrome underneath, so not totally ruining the effect - until I can re-spray.

What do you guys think - is that a possibility, or am I hoping for too much?

I know I'll find out when I give it a go, but I was just wondering if anyone else had tried anything similar in the past?

Interesting to see if it works but i dont think it will as you need the glossy black down first for the alclad to work but worth a try.

Hey, thanks for the reply 3phase.

My understanding was that the gloss black was providing the reflections for the layer of chrome on top. My thinking / hope is that the clearcoated chrome would do the same thing, as it's certainly reflective enough; or is there something else that the black basecoat provides that would be lacking from a chrome & clearcoat 'basecoat'?

I'll be trying it out on a few scrap pieces or spoons in the next few days. Fingers crossed!

The spots could be down to fingerprint grease marks or grease marks in general , give the helmet a bath in degreaser and a rinse in warm water dry thoroughly and apply another coat, let dry then clear coat ,this should improve finish , test on a piece of scrap first , I would think it might be a waste of material as I don't think it will improve the finish, only other alternative proper chrome plate the Helmet!!

Nice! That chrome effect came out looking great!

I can't see why you couldn't use the lower chrome with clear gloss as a replacement for the black base coat, they are both super glossy. Do the test pieces and let us know how they turn out. :thumbsup

that turned out pretty good, how durable is that stuff?

would you leave a finger print in the surface if pressed on.

-z

Once it's cured after a few hours, it seems OK for handling - it doesn't fingerprint much, but if you over-buff an area, the chrome can wear a bit thin, and the basecoat shows through a bit. So as a display piece, I think it's fine without a clearcoat; but as a prop / costume item that will need repeated handling and might be more prone to scratches or what have you, I think a topcoat would be a good idea.

My initial test with the clearcoat and topcoat of chrome seem to be pretty positive!


The good news is that it's still VERY reflective, and it's a nice bright colour, bringing back some of the shine that it loses after clearcoating. It also handles really well, and doesn't seem to pick up any fingerprints at all. As you can see, the clearcoat has added a little bit of 'texture' to the surface, though in real life it's not as bad as it looks in that picture, and it's only visible up close. From a distance, it looks amazing. There's also a fair bit of dust that I didn't bother to polish out of the clearcoat which have affected the finish - but I think that if I did a couple of coats of the clear and buffed it smooth before re-chroming, it might well be the combination of durability and finish that I'm looking for, without having to shell out for a full chrome paintjob

But, I need to do some more tests and do some side by side comparisons of raw alclad chrome, clear coated, and overcoated chrome, to see exactly how it'll look before I go ahead and treat the helmet.

I've also been working on the LEDs I'm going to install, here's a quick snap of the matrix I'm using in situ -


I've gone the quick route of a programmable sign matrix, rather than scratch building the lights. I'm going for a non-canon sort of look, I guess a hybrid between their 'lite' Discovery era helmets and the Human After All era. Obviously still a lot of work to go, but it's getting there!

I'll post back and let you know how the various chrome test pieces go

I've had a go with this stuff. A gloss black base coat is essential and yeah I've had the same wear issues. I've tried applying a coat of chrome, a coat of clear to seal it and then a dusting of alcad to bring back the chrome finish.

Your helmets look awesome!

That's odd. I haven't found the aqua clear to dull the chrome effect at all. However, I've had some problems with the aqua never fully curing, no matter what I try. I've tried just about everything... waiting on curing times, using only Alclad's recommended paints, other brands mixed in, different rooms/temperatures and so on. My airbrush has a moisture filter, so that's not it. It just stays ever so slightly tacky... barely noticeable but it IS there. I've asked Alclad directly and they have no idea what could be causing it.

Here's some info I gathered, while working on Alclad 2, on my MIB Neuralizer

Well I thought I would give a little update! I know this is kind of off course
with the original post, but I spent a lot of time on working with the Alclad 2 paint! So I thought if I posted some of the do's and don'ts, maybe some others could learn!

So! EVERYTHING YOU NEED TO KNOW ABOUT ALCLAD 2 PAINT, THAT I HAVE LEARNED THE HARD WAY! That should be able to track down on the search function!

I have noticed a lot of people, across the web, who try, but give no final answers! Well here they are! Some may disagree with me, but if you have not devoted answers, than you have not helped!

1. Alclad 2 is not a lacquer! To put it simply, it is a metallic, that is held in suspension, with a alcohol based chemical.

2. The surface you spray it over, has to be smooth as glass, for best results. Weather that involves, wetsanding, recoating, and a coat of a gloss top coat, this will help the look.

3. Do not spray over a Lacquer based black! (you might think this would be the best option, since it says it's a lacquer right? Go back to step 1!) It will not stick! It wipes off like powder.

4. Spray an Enamel based black (or alclad's black) first, make sure it's as slick as you an get it, wait for it to cure good, than apply the alclad 2 paint.

5. After waiting several days, you can apply Future floor wax, by Pledge. Yes they have changed the bottle, but it's the same product modeler's have used before. Some say it kills the look! It does take away from the look a little bit, but nothing like a solvent based clear. Future floor wax is like a water based coating, so it does not attack the chrome finish, like other clear's do.

6. You cannot apply lacquer clear, or urethane (2 part automotive clear) over top the alclad 2! Not from a distance!, Not in a tack coat!, Not in a small tack coat, spraying far away, or upside down, than applying a thick coat! IT WILL NOT WORK! That also goes for the House of Kolor chrome paint as well! It react's to the clear, by turning a dark grey silver! It sucks! This goes for the Enamel chrome paint's as well.

7. Right now, where I live, it's about 30 degree's. So if I was to go outside, spray gloss black enamel, over my project, the paint will wrinkle! Go ahead!, try it! It sucks, but it's the nature of enamel paint! Even if you paint indoors, with a good working temperature, it can still wrinkle! The reason is the enamel not only needs good airflow, but heat, and the sun!

8. If you want to tackle using enamel's in the winter, you need to try out some idea's. I made a little cabinet area, with a front opening. Then I put a small electric space heater inside. Using this as a little oven of sorts, to hang parts that were painted over top the heater. I tried this technique with Krylon Fusion spray can enamel, in 8 hour shifts, for 2 days (keeping a watchful eye to make sure nothing would catch on fire!) and it provided a great cureing for the paint. If you want to try this, PLEASE BE CAREFUL!! KEEP YOUR EYEBALLS ON IT!!! Space heaters can be dangerous, without painted parts hanging over top of them!

There is a difference between, dry, and cure, when it comes to enamel paint! Dry is when you can pick up the object, but, it can still finger print. this happens, because the top of the paint is dry. But, underneath, it's still trying to solidify (cure!). In the winter, on the East coast, this could take months!

I think this is a very big problem, for some of the enamel chrome paint's as well! No sun, no heat, and very dry air (without any good amount of humidity), equals, no cure!

I have used Testor's chrome paint (enamel!) before in the summer time, and had no problems. But I also let it sit out in the sun, with heat as it's friend, and it's cured! I tried this on the Neuralizer project, applied very light coats, let it sit for a month! But without some summer heat, and sun, their was no cure! So it smudged, and finger printed!

Back in the day's of when enamel's where used on cars, they would use a catalyst, or a gloss hardner. This made the finish cure, within a day or so. without it, it could take month's or years, before it was finally cured. Which also meant, they could not wetsand and buff the vehicle! It would turn into a gummy mess!

Why am I going into such detail about enamel? Because it's what has to go underneath the alclad 2 paint! I start with a lacquer primer (which could be wetsanded with 600 grit for a smoother finish), applied Krylon Fussion gloss black paint. I hung this over the space heater, for a couple days, to get a better cure. Than finished with alclad 2 paint.

I tried using Future floor wax, by spraying it through my Iwata HP-CS, airbrush. It did not need any reduction, in my opinion. I had to turn down my air pressure, to keep it from running. I noticed it did dull it a little bit, but for the protection it provides, I think it was worth it. The alclad 2 paint does dry pretty good, but you can scratch the finish. Not to mention, it will rub off, if you try hard enough.

joatrash - that's strange, the only thing I can think is that the bottle might have been shaken beforehand? I've read that you really, really really need to avoid mixing it up before you spray it. It seems to be drying pretty well on my test sprays; though I have only been doing small pieces (spoons, mostly). I'm a bit worried that when I try to do the whole helmet, I'll get drips / runs in the clearcoat? I know they suggest a medium to heavy coat, but I think I'll try misting it on in a couple of successive coats, rather than trying to do it all at once.

I had a little bit of a mishap doing some chrome resprays last night - a drop of paint splashed out of the top of the airbrush and right onto the front of the helmet. Because the paint is quite hot, it's burned through the paint and almost down to the plastic, I think. I managed to dab off most of the paint before it caused too much damage, but there's a definite mark in one area. But I'm reluctant to sand the whole piece back down and re-coat. I'll see how bad it is once the paint has cured and I've gently buffed it. Hopefully it'll be in an area that's not too visible (I'm 6' 7" tall, so when I'm wearing it, most people won't even see the upper sections!).

Thanks for all your suggestions and help chaps

Arktic said:

joatrash - that's strange, the only thing I can think is that the bottle might have been shaken beforehand? I've read that you really, really really need to avoid mixing it up before you spray it.

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Really? Where have you read this? I've never heard of a paint that you're NOT supposed to mix...!

joatrash said:

Really? Where have you read this? I've never heard of a paint that you're NOT supposed to mix...!

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On the bottle of the Aqua Gloss itself, the instructions say not to thin and not to shake the bottle -


I have a feeling that shaking it will introduce excess air bubbles into the mixture... Perhaps that could be the cause of your clearcoat not curing?

I've used the Alclad chrome which looks almost like the real thing if a black base coat is done but had the problem of it coming off if touched. I thought I'd go the clear coat to protect it but with disastrous results. The chrome went dull and looked more like metallic grey instead. Has anyone used the aerosol paint "Liquid Chrome?"

andyoda said:

I've used the Alclad chrome which looks almost like the real thing if a black base coat is done but had the problem of it coming off if touched. I thought I'd go the clear coat to protect it but with disastrous results.

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Andyoda, what clear coat did you use? The Alcad one?

How thick did you coat it, and in how many coats?

Yep, I used the Alclad clear through my airbrush with lots of light coats. I've been airbrushing for over 20 years and thought I'd give the chrome a go. I've also used the Testors Chrome in the aerosol can but put it through my airbrush again and it didn't look too bad. By putting it through the airbrush the paint comes out nice and fine but I'm hoping to fine something more chrome like.

Odd... that's not the same clear that I have. Mine is not milky but conpletely transparent. It's also not water based. Shaking will produce bubbles, which will affect flow through the airbrush but it shouldn't affect curing.It would be impossible to ship it if that were the case. Anyway, bubbles dissipate after a while.

The tackiness is acutally barely noticeable- it doesn't leave fingerprints or anything but if you press on it, your hand will stick a little.

My theory would be that the bottle I bought is too old.

Arktic said:

On the bottle of the Aqua Gloss itself, the instructions say not to thin and not to shake the bottle -
http://i.imgur.com/Z3yRFCl.jpg

I have a feeling that shaking it will introduce excess air bubbles into the mixture... Perhaps that could be the cause of your clearcoat not curing?

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A lot of useful information, Im glad I came across this thread. Do you guys know if this stuff will adhere to smooth cast 300 stuff? Im making an emblem and I want it to be chrome. It will be attached to a helmet, so it wont have too many people touching it, but I think I would feel better if a clear coat went on it to try and protect it.

I've been making some toys for some guys out of smooth cast 300... My friend works at a denture place and they have to polish their acrylic, and they use a pummice wheel, then a buffing wheel. The smooth cast came out looking like glass, I have not needed to paint one since, but has anyone tried painting over highly polish plastic? Would that help these things?

A few guys on here have experimented with cosmichrome. After you primer Cosmichrome, if you touch the primer it shows up after you do it. But if you prep right, it looks aces. Why don't you guys try that?

Snikt said:

A lot of useful information, Im glad I came across this thread. Do you guys know if this stuff will adhere to smooth cast 300 stuff? Im making an emblem and I want it to be chrome. It will be attached to a helmet, so it wont have too many people touching it, but I think I would feel better if a clear coat went on it to try and protect it.

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I airbrushed the gloss black base coat directly onto my resin cast (smooth cast 65R, I think), and I didn't have any real issues - when wetsanding, I found that the gloss black rubbed off a little easy from any parts I'd used bondo on, but other than that it held up pretty well, and the chrome went over the black without a problem. If I were doing this again, I'd probably go with a primer first before the gloss black base coat, to avoid the spot filling issue.

So I went ahead and applied a clearcoat - and it's TOTALLY taken the edge off the chrome finish. Here's a before and after:



As you can see, it's a pretty dramatic difference - look how 'frosty' the reflection is of the window on the main dome after clearcoat!

But, I'm not too crestfallen, as I was pretty much expecting this, or at least something similar. And as a costume prop, it needs to be handled - there's no point having a beautifully chromed helmet that I can't touch!

My next steps are to buff the clearcoat layer, possibly using the higher grades of micromesh, to bring it back to a shine and then apply another topcoat of the chrome, which will hopefully give it back a bit of that lost lustre and the clarity of reflections.

In the meantime, I've been playing around with other elements of the costume


And whilst I'm at it, here's one that I've photoshopped slightly.

I'm not going to lie, seeing this makes me really excited to get the thing finished!